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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> The War Room >> Sov Air Groups

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Sov Air Groups - 10/7/2014 1:40:11 AM

hfarrish

Posts: 734
Joined: 1/3/2011
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Can anyone summarize quickly the rules around generation of new Sov air groups, when it starts and when it ends? I vaguely remember something about averaging 7 air units per group to generate more, but the whole process seems pretty opaque.

As an aside, this element is quite possibly the most maddening about running the Soviets - you basically have to overload your air groups, have new ones randomly generate, then go through and manually take out air units once they start doubling in size...which then prevents you from getting new air groups so vast quantities of planes just sit in reserve doing nothing. Hopefully I'm missing something.

In any case, is there any real reason not to allow the purchase of air groups for an AP or 2 rather than the current convoluted system?

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/7/2014 1:59:54 AM

charlie0311

Posts: 941
Joined: 12/20/2013
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H, I think you're talking about airbases here. Average number of groups (per base) above 6 to get new airbases. If you can overload the ones out of combat range it doesn't really hurt (I think).

(in reply to hfarrish)

Post #: 2

RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/7/2014 6:15:20 AM

caliJP

Posts: 320
Joined: 8/5/2013
From: California
Status: offline

hfarrish, charlie is correct, if your average of air groups per airbase is over 6, then the AI will keep creating new AirBases. This starts in early 1942 sometimes after the automatic disbanding of legacy airbases starts.
I agree it is a goofy way to do things, but generally the way around it is:
Plan out how many airbases you want in the end, and stop the process when your reach that number by keeping the number of air groups per airbase to 6 or less. If you mix bombers and FBs, usually in 1942 you reach the support limit by the time you have 6 air groups anyhow.
I usually do this:
- Have 5 or 6 per Front, usually 6.
- I then have 8-10 under Long Range Air Command, under STAVKA. I put all the VVS ones in there and use them to supply partisans with transports and bombers. I also keep 2-3 airbases dedicated to transports which I use for para operations. I keep all of that under STAVKA to avoid loading up fronts and allow me to move them around as needed. I keep the 4 commands under Long Range for local chain of command for that reason.

I am sure there are other ways to do this

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/8/2014 1:59:23 AM

hfarrish

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Joined: 1/3/2011
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So basically no mechanic for getting additional airbases once airgroups go 30/40+ (unless you want your air force to be useless). After playing this game for four years, I find this to be quite possibly the most ridiculous implementation of them all (for the first three years no game lasted past 41, so the later war mechanics slowly become apparent).

Story of the Soviet Air Force: Click up SAD air bases, have them go away, re click in air units to the remaining air bases, have new air bases randomly appear, then de click out the air units as they expand...only to find that then you are short air bases.

To paraphrase (or quote) Frank Costanza, "there has to be a better way!"

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/8/2014 2:39:37 AM

Oshawott

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Joined: 10/30/2013
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This is another reason to keep the U2-VS. You can generate all the airbases you need for the rest of the war in 42. Just focus on U2VS, fighters and tactical bombers and forget about long range bombers. But be careful with the number of airbases you generate/use or you run out of vehicles.

I agree with you that the airbase system is silly. You should be able to build airbases just like other units.

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/8/2014 5:09:48 AM

caliJP

Posts: 320
Joined: 8/5/2013
From: California
Status: offline

hfarrish, I agree it is up there as a top flaw of WTE on the soviet side.

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/8/2014 5:27:34 PM

M60A3TTS

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Joined: 5/13/2011
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I scrapped half my LB force in '43. Each regiment I disposed of had less than 10 ground kills. That shows you their value relative to TacB.

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RE: Sov Air Groups - 10/9/2014 2:25:39 AM

hfarrish

Posts: 734
Joined: 1/3/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

I scrapped half my LB force in '43. Each regiment I disposed of had less than 10 ground kills. That shows you their value relative to TacB.

Good call guys - I will do that. I assume consensus is that the partisan air drops not really worth it (only real trade off I can think of in sending LBs back to the Urals)?

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Post #: 8