First Impression of 1.215

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

First Impression of 1.215

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> World in Flames >> First Impression of 1.215

Page: [1] 2 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

First Impression of 1.215 - 9/24/2014 5:53:18 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I got myself in a pickle last night in my Brute Force game with version 1.207. I had just finished a bloody May/Jun 1946 turn and was placing a British territorial reinforcement in Ethiopia when I couldn't because Addis Ababa was already stacked with two corps. I went back to the save of the Allied movement phase and started moving some units around again before deciding to call it a night.

I remembered during the night about the fix in the latest beta version that fixed this placement problem and decided to see if there was a version later than 1.212. I was hesitant to do another public beta as I did one 6 months ago and regretted it as it stopped my game cold. I found the new 1.215 version available so decided to download it and apply it.

I then went back to the Factory Destruction phase of my last turn and was able to get back to placing British reinforcements. This time I was able to place my Ethiopian corp off-city without a problem. That definitely was good news as I don't have to redo the moves and combats nor the whole production and moving naval units back to port that took several hours the first time around. Now I can continue with the following turn.

Omnius

Post #: 1

First Bug Found in 1.215 - 9/26/2014 8:26:49 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I did find a new bug while playing the public beta version of 1.215. Iraq, India and Spain now show no garrison when they indeed have proper garrisons. These garrisons were fine in 1.207, now these three countries show that there is no garrison at all, a big fat Zero.

I've almost made it through 2 busy impulses without any other untoward events.

Omnius

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 2

RE: First Impression of 1.215 - 9/26/2014 11:23:56 PM

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline

Hi Omnius good post. Hope it is working out for you.

No return post comments yet.

Either nobody Has downloaded 1.215,

or they don't know it's there,

or they just don't care,

take your pick.

At 7:25 Friday EST 2014 there was not one person on the MWIF posts, in all the years I have been here I have never seen that. I find it

that kind of scary

but that's just me.

7;45 EST paul just arrived now I feel better

I am not alone

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 9/27/2014 12:47:01 AM >

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 3

MWiF Ghost Town? - 9/27/2014 2:44:39 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

bo,
Is the 1.215 update the Rodney Dangerfield update? No one gives it any respect? I don't know if I would read too much into how many have or haven't downloaded 1.215. I was certainly hesitant about downloading public beta updates after I did it with 1.10 and found a nasty bug that messed up play. However desperation breeds brilliance so I brilliantly downloaded 1.215 to overcome a territorial reinforcement placement problem.

Other than the messed up garrison values for three countries that I can easily overcome by rolling what I want for those partisan rolls. I'm now looking forward to another busy day killing lots of units as I'm now into Jul/Aug 1946.

Omnius

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 4

RE: MWiF Ghost Town? - 9/27/2014 6:40:51 PM

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

bo,
Is the 1.215 update the Rodney Dangerfield update? No one gives it any respect? I don't know if I would read too much into how many have or haven't downloaded 1.215. I was certainly hesitant about downloading public beta updates after I did it with 1.10 and found a nasty bug that messed up play. However desperation breeds brilliance so I brilliantly downloaded 1.215 to overcome a territorial reinforcement placement problem.

Other than the messed up garrison values for three countries that I can easily overcome by rolling what I want for those partisan rolls. I'm now looking forward to another busy day killing lots of units as I'm now into Jul/Aug 1946.

Omnius

I use to think you were brilliant until I read this post Jul/Aug 1946 war still raging, any commander worth his salt would have ended this farce in 1945

You need to go to crussdaddys basic training school

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 9/27/2014 7:41:38 PM >

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 5

RE: MWiF Ghost Town? - 9/30/2014 4:26:35 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bo
I use to think you were brilliant until I read this post Jul/Aug 1946 war still raging, any commander worth his salt would have ended this farce in 1945 You need to go to crussdaddys basic training school

Bo

bo,
I used to think you were brilliant until you posted this ignorant reply. I'm learning the game and I'm having fun playing past 1945. I don't need to go to crussdaddy's basic training school, I'm doing my own basic training. The whole point of this game was to explore the possibilities. I started with the Brute Force scenario this time instead of the Global War one because I wanted to get involved in the heavy duty stuff right away and have the Axis at the apex of their power.

I was able to then move into Iraq and Iran as Germany before getting my act together as the Commonwealth. The Japanese were able to take Ceylon the first turn and thus got Madagascar. I'm now getting ready to invade Madagascar this impulse as the CW while I'm finishing up liberating Iraq, Syria and probably this turn Persia.

So no I don't need any stinking trash talk about a game I'm thoroughly enjoying and which I'm learning a lot from. I just had a major naval battle in the Marianas that turned into the Great Marianas Turkey Shoot as I learned the value of land planes in carrier plane combats.

Just for grins this turn I decided to declare war on all minor countries to eliminate having to click through those screens. Just as I'm advancing through France as the Americans I added the Swiss to Germany and they fit right into the front lines perfectly. I now have the Swedish Bikini Team ready to come to the aid of Germany and it gives Germany more reason to play a naval move although I loved the sub war. Argentina and most of South America went to Germany while Central American and Venezuela and Colombia went to America along with the Caribbean islands.

So no bo I'm having a blast playing my game so late into 1946. I get to see those awesome post war units like the Il Duce armor. Best of all next turn I get the awesome B-36 Peacemaker bomber for America. I'm enjoying doing plenty of carpet bombing attacks to aid my ground game rather than do strategic bombing because Germany has too many excess factories to make that worth it. I enjoyed playing 4 offensive chits per turn in the two summer turns as America. I enjoyed being able to do simultaneous Super Combined moves as American and the Commonwealth.

Instead of starting a new game I'm having more fun finishing up this one. I'm just getting ready to invade Truk after bouncing the Japanese fleet out of the Marianas as I was able to knock it out of supply then was able to disorganize both units with tac bombers and a carrier plane. I was merely repositioning units from Eniwetok to the Solomons to set up an invasion fo Truk the next turn but as luck has it I'll make that invasion a turn earlier. I already have three marine units on the small island adjacent to Truk to help get better odds.

I'll keep on playing until I invade and conquer Japan. I want to see what it takes to invade the Philippines and take back Burma. I'm having too much fun learning how things work and to get to play with the awesome units to stop playing this game now.

Omnius

Here's my latest saved game - tell me this isn't fun

Attachment (1)

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 6

RE: MWiF Ghost Town? - 9/30/2014 11:18:33 PM

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

quote:

ORIGINAL: bo
I use to think you were brilliant until I read this post Jul/Aug 1946 war still raging, any commander worth his salt would have ended this farce in 1945 You need to go to crussdaddys basic training school

Bo

bo,
I used to think you were brilliant until you posted this ignorant reply. I'm learning the game and I'm having fun playing past 1945. I don't need to go to crussdaddy's basic training school, I'm doing my own basic training. The whole point of this game was to explore the possibilities. I started with the Brute Force scenario this time instead of the Global War one because I wanted to get involved in the heavy duty stuff right away and have the Axis at the apex of their power.

I was able to then move into Iraq and Iran as Germany before getting my act together as the Commonwealth. The Japanese were able to take Ceylon the first turn and thus got Madagascar. I'm now getting ready to invade Madagascar this impulse as the CW while I'm finishing up liberating Iraq, Syria and probably this turn Persia.

So no I don't need any stinking trash talk about a game I'm thoroughly enjoying and which I'm learning a lot from. I just had a major naval battle in the Marianas that turned into the Great Marianas Turkey Shoot as I learned the value of land planes in carrier plane combats.

Just for grins this turn I decided to declare war on all minor countries to eliminate having to click through those screens. Just as I'm advancing through France as the Americans I added the Swiss to Germany and they fit right into the front lines perfectly. I now have the Swedish Bikini Team ready to come to the aid of Germany and it gives Germany more reason to play a naval move although I loved the sub war. Argentina and most of South America went to Germany while Central American and Venezuela and Colombia went to America along with the Caribbean islands.

So no bo I'm having a blast playing my game so late into 1946. I get to see those awesome post war units like the Il Duce armor. Best of all next turn I get the awesome B-36 Peacemaker bomber for America. I'm enjoying doing plenty of carpet bombing attacks to aid my ground game rather than do strategic bombing because Germany has too many excess factories to make that worth it. I enjoyed playing 4 offensive chits per turn in the two summer turns as America. I enjoyed being able to do simultaneous Super Combined moves as American and the Commonwealth.

Instead of starting a new game I'm having more fun finishing up this one. I'm just getting ready to invade Truk after bouncing the Japanese fleet out of the Marianas as I was able to knock it out of supply then was able to disorganize both units with tac bombers and a carrier plane. I was merely repositioning units from Eniwetok to the Solomons to set up an invasion fo Truk the next turn but as luck has it I'll make that invasion a turn earlier. I already have three marine units on the small island adjacent to Truk to help get better odds.

I'll keep on playing until I invade and conquer Japan. I want to see what it takes to invade the Philippines and take back Burma. I'm having too much fun learning how things work and to get to play with the awesome units to stop playing this game now.

Omnius

Here's my latest saved game - tell me this isn't fun

Easy there Omnius, notice the laughing face, just kidding also I am very jealous as I have never got past a full year yet with all the testing we were doing. As for crussdaddy now come on Omnius. I do not trash talk Ominus nor do I willfully do ignorant posts. I apologize if you took it that way.

Sometimes I go a little overboard to relieve some of the tension here, it used to fun but no more. I will end it with that. Enjoy your game.

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 10/1/2014 12:22:36 AM >

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 7

Misunderstood - 10/1/2014 3:41:12 AM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

bo,
Sorry for misunderstanding your playful jibe. I was enjoying my game this evening until I found a ground support bug that forces me to go back to the land combat declaration phase and redo the land combats and ground supports. I think it didn't like my flying strategic bombers on extended range since that is the first time I've ever done that and it's the first time I've had this problem with ground supports.

I used to do beta testing so I understand how you get hung up in stop and start. I started the Brute Force scenario with the intent of playing extra innings as they say in baseball vernacular. After wailing away as the Axis it's now fun getting to turn the tables. I didn't use the oil rules so I could enjoy this game after getting frustrated in my first one of Global War. I definitely have learned a lot about the game mechanics.

Omnius

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 8

RE: Misunderstood - 10/1/2014 6:03:28 PM

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

bo,
Sorry for misunderstanding your playful jibe. I was enjoying my game this evening until I found a ground support bug that forces me to go back to the land combat declaration phase and redo the land combats and ground supports. I think it didn't like my flying strategic bombers on extended range since that is the first time I've ever done that and it's the first time I've had this problem with ground supports.

I used to do beta testing so I understand how you get hung up in stop and start. I started the Brute Force scenario with the intent of playing extra innings as they say in baseball vernacular. After wailing away as the Axis it's now fun getting to turn the tables. I didn't use the oil rules so I could enjoy this game after getting frustrated in my first one of Global War. I definitely have learned a lot about the game mechanics.

Omnius

Cool, how do you find the time to go into 1946. What side do you lean towards, I know myself I lean towards the Axis side because it is the Germans who set the pace, at least early on, I rarely test Global War, I test Fascist Tide all the time and Guadalcanal some of the time looking for problems with carrier air battles, digression AA fire etc.

You will really like Fascist Tide when Steve gets it up an running. I am fortunate to be able to test it and I feel it runs pretty smooth, I think what might be holding it up is the production phase of the scenario.

< Message edited by bo -- 10/1/2014 7:06:27 PM >

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 9

Finding Time - 10/1/2014 6:25:47 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

bo,
It's nice to be semi-retired and self-employed. So I have plenty of time to play MWiF. Plus I've been playing this current game since July, just after 1.207 came out. I favored the Axis early on to see things like capturing Ceylon triggering the Madagascar option which was way cool for Japan. Now the Brits have landed and have to dig out two units widely separated. I also got to see Turkey join the Axis and had the Germans rampaging through the Middle East through the Caucasus.

Then the game reached stalemate and finally it was the Allies striking back. I'm close to seeing how Italy surrenders. I saw a report about German units not setting hex control properly so best to see it for myself to determine how to play that for the future, or until it gets fixed. I got to do the liberation of France and am now getting close to liberating Belgium and the Netherlands. The Soviets are rampaging back from the Caucasus as I had to pull the retreat Army Group A out of there and back through the Rostov corridor and the Kerch Peninsula.

I'm learning about playing the Pacific and large scale naval battles. I'm loving submarine warfare and can't wait to try out the 1.215 production and convoy fixes to use the oil rules again. I just recaptured Truk thinking I was just going to reposition units for a better box the following turn as the Japanese had placed a huge fleet in the Marianas and I got lucky being able to watch the Marianas Great Turkey Shoot play out which chased the Japanese back to Tokyo. I'm finding that instead of starting over it was better to play on and remember the mistakes for future reference.

So I made sure to take the time to savor this game and learn everything I can while getting to play with the post war units. I love MWiF because it covers the entire global war so I'm not too sure I'll enjoy the half game. So many games cover one theater and they're okay. I love the challenge of total global war on a strategic scale and MWiF has a game system that incorporates air-ground-sea combat like no other game. While it is very involved with lots of back and forth during action but it gives us a really fun game that represents history well.

I have been finding bugs and have been reporting them in the tech section. I'm not sure if they're previously reported but I figure best to report them in case I find something new. I just learned not to send strategic bombers on extended range ground support, had to go back to an autosave to redeclare combats to redo ground support.

Omnius

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 10

RE: Finding Time - 10/1/2014 7:40:46 PM

Posts: 4176
Joined: 5/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

bo,
It's nice to be semi-retired and self-employed. So I have plenty of time to play MWiF. Plus I've been playing this current game since July, just after 1.207 came out. I favored the Axis early on to see things like capturing Ceylon triggering the Madagascar option which was way cool for Japan. Now the Brits have landed and have to dig out two units widely separated. I also got to see Turkey join the Axis and had the Germans rampaging through the Middle East through the Caucasus.

Then the game reached stalemate and finally it was the Allies striking back. I'm close to seeing how Italy surrenders. I saw a report about German units not setting hex control properly so best to see it for myself to determine how to play that for the future, or until it gets fixed. I got to do the liberation of France and am now getting close to liberating Belgium and the Netherlands. The Soviets are rampaging back from the Caucasus as I had to pull the retreat Army Group A out of there and back through the Rostov corridor and the Kerch Peninsula.

I'm learning about playing the Pacific and large scale naval battles. I'm loving submarine warfare and can't wait to try out the 1.215 production and convoy fixes to use the oil rules again. I just recaptured Truk thinking I was just going to reposition units for a better box the following turn as the Japanese had placed a huge fleet in the Marianas and I got lucky being able to watch the Marianas Great Turkey Shoot play out which chased the Japanese back to Tokyo. I'm finding that instead of starting over it was better to play on and remember the mistakes for future reference.

So I made sure to take the time to savor this game and learn everything I can while getting to play with the post war units. I love MWiF because it covers the entire global war so I'm not too sure I'll enjoy the half game. So many games cover one theater and they're okay. I love the challenge of total global war on a strategic scale and MWiF has a game system that incorporates air-ground-sea combat like no other game. While it is very involved with lots of back and forth during action but it gives us a really fun game that represents history well.

I have been finding bugs and have been reporting them in the tech section. I'm not sure if they're previously reported but I figure best to report them in case I find something new. I just learned not to send strategic bombers on extended range ground support, had to go back to an autosave to redeclare combats to redo ground support.

Omnius

Well its good your going deep into the game because I am assured some bugs will crop up that the testers were not aware of. Steve needs someone playing deep into the game.

Bo

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 11

RE: First Impression of 1.215 - 10/3/2014 2:38:09 AM

eliliang

Posts: 8
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

Hi Omnius good post. Hope it is working out for you.

No return post comments yet. Either nobody Has downloaded 1.215, or they don't know it's there, or they just don't care, take your pick.

At 7:25 Friday EST 2014 there was not one person on the MWIF posts, in all the years I have been here I have never seen that. I find it

that kind of scary but that's just me.

7;45 EST paul just arrived now I feel better I am not alone

Bo

There are those of us around for Chris Marinacci's CWIF who have waited almost 20 years for a stable and playable computer WIF and who are content to lurk around for the 6-12 months that it will take for netplay to work stably. After all, what is another year if you waited at least 15?

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 12

RE: First Impression of 1.215 - 10/3/2014 11:25:28 AM

Joseignacio

Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline

I understand that but I prefer to pay for a game, not to be a betatester. So, I have it installed but I don't even look at it.

My time has a value. When there is a patch that is supposed to solve all the issues, including netplay I will try it. In the meantime...

(in reply to eliliang)

Post #: 13

RE: First Impression of 1.215 - 10/3/2014 2:16:12 PM

Numdydar

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline

But it still is so much fun. Really it is. You really should try it but understand if you do not want to.

Edit: Additional comments

I am right now playing multiplayer with Skype and Teamviewer (all free btw) and having a blast.

< Message edited by Numdydar -- 10/3/2014 3:17:42 PM >

(in reply to Joseignacio)

Post #: 14

I Love It! - 10/3/2014 9:19:03 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

tyroneslothrop,
I had Marinacci's old computer version of WiF and was rather hesitant to play it with the way it mishandled convoys. However now I'm really enjoying the new 1.215 version of MWiF. I'm glad I didn't wait and am learning the user interface and enjoying getting through so many turns and having lots of fun.

Yes I occasionally stumble into bugs and have to go back to a prior autosave and do something over so I avoid the fatal error that stopped me cold. The programmed autosaves ensure one doesn't have to backtrack too far. I just got stuck on another bug after some important air combats on ground support. Now I'll have to go back to the land declaration subphase or perhaps the ground support CAP subphase to start over and see if I can dumb the ground support down some so it will finish up and go to the land combat subphase.

I took the time to save the game and post it with a bug report on the forum hoping that if it isn't known it will be now. Even if it is known one never knows when a saved game file comes in handy for the programmer to see the error. This was the second time I've seen this problem and posted a report and file. Even with the minor frustration of having to report bugs and redo some subphases I am enjoying the game immensely!

Omnius

(in reply to eliliang)

Post #: 15

RE: I Love It! - 10/6/2014 6:13:13 AM

Joseignacio

Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline

Numydar: I tried it when I bought it and it really is a huge and nide piece of work, I was amazed to be able to play wif like tyhis.

However, it's incomplete. There are bug that kill the game, and there is no MP.

As for the MP with skype, I tried it and didn't like it. I used a system through which I could see my opponent stacks, but the problem is I can only see the upper counter, cause I cannot operate his wif game to go see what's under it. Because of this I had some losses that I would never have had, leading to a disastrous Barbarossa defence.

It may be a piece of art, when it's complete but it's not complete.

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 16

RE: I Love It! - 10/6/2014 6:31:02 AM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

You used the wrong system. Try Teamviewer. (Usual warnings and caveats excluded.)

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Joseignacio)

Post #: 17

Italy Surrenders - 10/7/2014 2:53:29 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I had to laugh that last night I managed to force Italy to surrender and the only attack I made that turn was a stupid artillery ground strike that failed to hit any of 3 units in really bad weather during a naval impulse. I had taken Taranto the turn before and thought Italy would fold then but I was mistaken. I hadn't gotten the garrison rule nailed down since I had so many disorganized units from so much action. I poured more air and ground units into Sicily and then Italy surrendered just as I was thinking that I had been a chump sending my whole 6 build points to Germany thinking it was Italy's last gasp. I actually timed it perfectly. So mainland Italy is down in the Jan/Feb 1947 turn. I learned that Albania carries on the fight so now have to invade there to make all Italian units go away. Shows me that taking Albania before taking down Italy might be a wise choice. While all Italian units in Italy went away the ones outside of Italy didn't so I still have some fighting to do. I also discovered that the problem with converting hex control is screwed up as I had German units in all Italian cities and the hexes around those corps aren't remaining Axis. I hope that gets fixed someday soon.

I'm enjoying getting so deep into the game in extra innings. I'm definitely learning things better by doing than by reading the rules. While I basically remembered the Italian surrender rules it was another thing to witness them in practice. I hadn't considered an impartial conquest and didn't realize Albania would remain a pain in my Allied side. That's why I'm glad to slug it out to the bitter end to see how things work. I want to see how German minor allies react when Germany goes down. Will that trigger Japan asking for peace? Plus it's fun to play the USA with all of those awesome planes and carriers.

Omnius

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 18

RE: I Love It! - 10/7/2014 6:38:10 PM

Numdydar

Posts: 3211
Joined: 2/13/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Numydar: I tried it when I bought it and it really is a huge and nide piece of work, I was amazed to be able to play wif like tyhis.

However, it's incomplete. There are bug that kill the game, and there is no MP.

As for the MP with skype, I tried it and didn't like it. I used a system through which I could see my opponent stacks, but the problem is I can only see the upper counter, cause I cannot operate his wif game to go see what's under it. Because of this I had some losses that I would never have had, leading to a disastrous Barbarossa defence.

It may be a piece of art, when it's complete but it's not complete.

+1 to paulderynck's response. Teamviewr is how we play and you can see and do everything that you could do in a solitaire game.

(in reply to Joseignacio)

Post #: 19

RE: Italy Surrenders - 10/7/2014 6:48:19 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

I had to laugh that last night I managed to force Italy to surrender and the only attack I made that turn was a stupid artillery ground strike that failed to hit any of 3 units in really bad weather during a naval impulse. I had taken Taranto the turn before and thought Italy would fold then but I was mistaken. I hadn't gotten the garrison rule nailed down since I had so many disorganized units from so much action. I poured more air and ground units into Sicily and then Italy surrendered just as I was thinking that I had been a chump sending my whole 6 build points to Germany thinking it was Italy's last gasp. I actually timed it perfectly. So mainland Italy is down in the Jan/Feb 1947 turn. I learned that Albania carries on the fight so now have to invade there to make all Italian units go away. Shows me that taking Albania before taking down Italy might be a wise choice. While all Italian units in Italy went away the ones outside of Italy didn't so I still have some fighting to do. I also discovered that the problem with converting hex control is screwed up as I had German units in all Italian cities and the hexes around those corps aren't remaining Axis. I hope that gets fixed someday soon.

I'm enjoying getting so deep into the game in extra innings. I'm definitely learning things better by doing than by reading the rules. While I basically remembered the Italian surrender rules it was another thing to witness them in practice. I hadn't considered an impartial conquest and didn't realize Albania would remain a pain in my Allied side. That's why I'm glad to slug it out to the bitter end to see how things work. I want to see how German minor allies react when Germany goes down. Will that trigger Japan asking for peace? Plus it's fun to play the USA with all of those awesome planes and carriers.

Omnius

Just curious on the hex control bug (we do know there are some bugs on conquest but...) were the hexes also ZoC'd by Italian or Allied units? The way the rule reads, the ZoC must be undisputed by any other power in order to convert to German control.

On the other question, Japan is completely separate in terms of conquest and to completely conquer Japan, you also need to conquer Formosa, Manchuria and Korea. The Japanese are willing to set up shop in each of those countries if the home islands are conquered.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 20

RE: Italy Surrenders - 10/8/2014 2:04:21 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

Just curious on the hex control bug (we do know there are some bugs on conquest but...) were the hexes also ZoC'd by Italian or Allied units? The way the rule reads, the ZoC must be undisputed by any other power in order to convert to German control.

On the other question, Japan is completely separate in terms of conquest and to completely conquer Japan, you also need to conquer Formosa, Manchuria and Korea. The Japanese are willing to set up shop in each of those countries if the home islands are conquered.

paulderynck,
I do know the rules and the German units did not have competing ZOC's with Allied units. I had read of this ZOC control problem when Italy surrenders before and wanted to see how it played out. It is definitely a bug that must be fixed. My solution was to station 2 German mountain corps in the mountain hexes south of Munich and by chance the Rommel HQ came in that turn as a reinforcement that I placed in Munich. I'm now pushing supply southwards from Munich with Rommel.

I also found that some Italian units in southern France are incorrectly out of supply. Some of the Italian units that survived the surrender are in supply while some aren't. I'm posting a saved game and bug report on it and this saved game will show you the incorrect Italian surrender and ZOC control. It's version 1.215 so hopefully you'll be able to check it out yourself and see the problem is real.

Omnius

PS - Thanks for the forewarning on Japan. I'm starting to get the hang of how the rules work as far as surrender goes. It's also why I'm going so deep into the game to see how things work. I saw how cutting off supply by sinking all convoy points in the China Sea puts Japan's empire out of supply, not to mention reducing it's production.

Is Germany the same way? WQill I have to conquer every Axis minor? Really lame as when the major goes belly up the minors should too. Probably the one real bug fail in the diplomacy rules.

< Message edited by Omnius -- 10/8/2014 3:08:45 PM >

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 21

RE: Italy Surrenders - 10/9/2014 12:25:52 AM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

The are rules for automatic victory - capturing certain victory cities. Those should kick in without you having to go around the globe conquering every minor country.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 22

RE: Italy Surrenders - 10/9/2014 3:13:37 AM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius
I do know the rules and the German units did not have competing ZOC's with Allied units.

It was German units having competing ZOCs with Italian units that I wondered about. Counter-intuitive but those hexes become controlled by the Allied conqueror.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius
Is Germany the same way? WQill I have to conquer every Axis minor? Really lame as when the major goes belly up the minors should too. Probably the one real bug fail in the diplomacy rules.

Any minor aligned with Germany is a potential new home country for an incompletely conquered Germany.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 23

Silly Surrender Rules - 10/9/2014 2:19:51 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I can see where the incomplete surrender rules work well early in the game for countries like Belgium or the Netherlands or France which had overseas colonies. I find the incomplete surrender rules silly at the end of the game where Italy or Germany or Japan can hang around like a bad hangover way past time that they historically gave up. When Germany historically surrendered it didn't fight on as Norway. Probably the one poorly thought out part of the game system.

Omnius

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 24

Automatic Victory? - 10/9/2014 2:23:54 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

Shannon,
Not sure what you mean by automatic surrender. I did force Italy to surrender incompletely when I fulfilled the conditions set out in the rules. Had a nasty surprise when Italy hung on as Albania. Downright frustrating when I had to wait another turn having some Italian units hold up the American advance into northern Italy as the Italians just happened to be in southern France. It sure was nice to see them disappear after Albania/Italy completely surrendered.

I sure wish there were a more automatic surrender rule for Germany. Like when the Allies capture all German factory cities and Berlin then Germany should completely surrender, no incomplete nonsense. That would more properly model the death of Hitler and the lack of desire by the remaining generals to want to continue a losing war.

Omnius

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 25

RE: Automatic Victory? - 10/9/2014 5:12:37 PM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline

I don't know. Historically, the Germans first lost all aligned minors before they were themselves conquered...

Would the CW capitulate if Great Britain was conquered?

Personally, I think it is a just rule, forcing the allies to conquer all aligned minors (which they historically did, except for Finland, which could make a political deal with the USSR in september 1944).

< Message edited by Centuur -- 10/9/2014 6:14:13 PM >

_____________________________

Peter

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 26

RE: Automatic Victory? - 10/9/2014 5:42:13 PM

Orm

Posts: 22154
Joined: 5/3/2008
From: Sweden
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I don't know. Historically, the Germans first lost all aligned minors before they were themselves conquered...

Would the CW capitulate if Great Britain was conquered?

Personally, I think it is a just rule, forcing the allies to conquer all aligned minors (which they historically did, except for Finland, which could make a political deal with the USSR in september 1944).

Hear, hear.

_____________________________

Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb -- they're often students, for heaven's sake. - Terry Pratchett

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 27

RE: Automatic Victory? - 10/9/2014 11:49:30 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to Orm)

Post #: 28

RE: Automatic Victory? - 10/10/2014 12:37:15 AM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

Shannon,
Not sure what you mean by automatic surrender. I did force Italy to surrender incompletely when I fulfilled the conditions set out in the rules. Had a nasty surprise when Italy hung on as Albania. Downright frustrating when I had to wait another turn having some Italian units hold up the American advance into northern Italy as the Italians just happened to be in southern France. It sure was nice to see them disappear after Albania/Italy completely surrendered.

I sure wish there were a more automatic surrender rule for Germany. Like when the Allies capture all German factory cities and Berlin then Germany should completely surrender, no incomplete nonsense. That would more properly model the death of Hitler and the lack of desire by the remaining generals to want to continue a losing war.

Omnius

See Automatic Victory in RAC, page 116.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 29

Norway? - 10/13/2014 8:23:24 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

Centuur,
Didn't Norway survive in German hands until the end of the war? When Germany surrendered so did all the German troops in Norway. Anyway a bad surrender rule for Germany as when Germany is completely conquered, including Berlin being captured, then that should be the end of Germany's war since that would model Hitler being killed. Unlike Italy when Germany surrenders it should be game over for German allies.

Omnius

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 30