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Questions - 10/8/2014 4:11:14 PM   
stormbringer3

 

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From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		Will this title have support units like WitE? I did move them around trying to create better units but IMO they are a needless complication.
The air war aspect has been controversial in WitE. Has it been changed in this title?
Thanks for any info.
Post #: 1
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 4:33:22 PM   
RedLancer


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Status: offline 		WitW has support units like WitE - the rules on how many can take part in combat are more generous for the Allies. They are certainly not needless in WitW especially in Normandy's bocage. In addition WitW has Multi-role units - these are combat (on map) units that can convert to support units (off map) to save on stacking limits or back again to occupy hexes. Most MRUs are brigade size units like 1st BR Assault Engineer Brigade.

The Air System in WitW is completely different to WitE. There is a separate air phase in which Air Groups are controlled in WitW by giving an Air Directive (AD) to an Air Comd. There are six different types of AD from Air Superiority to Strategic Bombing. The Air Comd will automatically meet the requirement of the AD by instructing Air Groups to fly air missions. There can be more than one mission flown to deliver an AD. Airbases are fixed installations on the map - not the abstracted counters of WitE.



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Post #: 2
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 4:47:20 PM   
stormbringer3

 

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From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		Thanks for your quick reply. Just to be sure when I'm talking about support units I mean how in WitE you would move support units such as Stug battalions, flak units etc. from a HQ to a combat unit of your choosing.
Thanks again.

(in reply to RedLancer)
Post #: 3
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 4:52:41 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Status: offline 		Yes, same thing but keep in mind that support unit micro-management is also optional.

The Air War is entirely re-done and the new system is effectively a whole game in itself that you can choose to mostly automate or get into just as deeply as the land game.

Regards,

- Erik


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Post #: 4
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 4:55:41 PM   
RedLancer


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Status: offline 		Yes, we're both talking about the same support units. The system is essentially the same in WitW. Learning to use them is an important skill to play WitW effectively.

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Post #: 5
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 5:05:12 PM   
stormbringer3

 

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Status: offline 		Thanks Red Lancer. I was afraid that you'd say that. It's not a purchase breaker for me but it does give me some pause.

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Post #: 6
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 5:34:05 PM   
HMSWarspite

 

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Joined: 4/13/2002
From: Bristol, UK
Status: offline 		At this scale, I think support units are essential. Not all divisions are equal, and not all battles are the same. The assault divisions were hugely reinforced, but didnt stay that way. Short of enforced TOE changes, how else would you do it?

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Post #: 7
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 6:17:07 PM   
warshipbuilder


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quote:

The Air War is entirely re-done and the new system is effectively a whole game in itself that you can choose to mostly automate or get into just as deeply as the land game.


How does it compare to BTR?

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Post #: 8
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 7:24:59 PM   
cato12

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Lancer

Yes, we're both talking about the same support units. The system is essentially the same in WitW. Learning to use them is an important skill to play WitW effectively.



Is the SU automated system actually going to work in WITW as it doesn't in WITE. It is such an unbelievably mind numbing to chore to constantly shift them around.

The automated system in WITE sounds perfect in theory, if only it worked.

(in reply to RedLancer)
Post #: 9
RE: Questions - 10/8/2014 9:39:46 PM   
Helpless


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quote:

How does it compare to BTR?


You can see some common elements (air groups, planes, raids, pilots.. ), but gameplay is very different.

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Post #: 10
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 8:12:57 AM   
RedLancer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cato12

Is the SU automated system actually going to work in WITW as it doesn't in WITE. It is such an unbelievably mind numbing to chore to constantly shift them around.

The automated system in WITE sounds perfect in theory, if only it worked.


It is difficult to reply when I don't agree with either of your key statements. There is always an area of debate whether an automatic system is working correctly when it doesn't second guess quite what you want which is why I always play with locked SUs.

WitW is even more complex than WitE - as a result there are a number of areas, particularly in the air phase, where you can delegate tasks to the game. What I have noticed is that the choices of a human player will always be better than an automatic system.

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Post #: 11
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 5:32:51 PM   
mavraamides


Posts: 447
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Status: offline 		Is there going to be a naval layer? If so will it include subs and convoys?

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Post #: 12
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 6:41:14 PM   
RedLancer


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Status: offline 		The naval element is the most abstracted element of WitW.

Ground Element Counters can move by Sea providing sufficient transport ships are available. Sea movement is impacted by naval interdiction points set in each sea hex by each side. These are primarily generated by naval air patrols although there are other factors involved. Interdiction Points can prevent sea movement, make movement contested or relatively free. Depending on the interdiction level moving units and their transport ships face attrition. Lose too many ships and the ground element is lost too.

Although this may at first seem an omission as WitW covers from Jun 43 onwards the impact of Axis sub and surface forces was by this stage of the war of limited importance compared to air superiority and naval combat is not the focus of the game.

Hopefully the attached picture gives you an idea of what is going on.




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 13
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 6:44:06 PM   
aaatoysandmore

 

Posts: 2848
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Status: offline 		What level of strategy will the game have? Army? Corps? Division (I hope), lower (I hope even more) I want a game with thousands of pieces like back in the day of that game that sounds like Drag Net Austin. I remember we had a lot of fun just setting up the pieces back then. Talk about a moster game.

Will the ai be able to to historical or near historical amphibious invasions?

Will there be any whatif elements like getting to choose the main debarking points not just Normand?

Also many whatif Hitler hadn't have been asleep? What if all the panzer divisions had been released.

< Message edited by aaatoysandmore -- 10/9/2014 7:51:49 PM >

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Post #: 14
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 7:03:51 PM   
RedLancer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore

What level of strategy will the game have? Army? Corps? Division (I hope), lower (I hope even more) I want a game with thousands of pieces like back in the day of that game that sounds like Drag Net Austin. I remember we had a lot of fun just setting up the pieces back then. Talk about a moster game.

Will the ai be able to to historical or near historical amphibious invasions?

Will there be any whatif elements like getting to choose the main debarking points not just Normand?

Also many what if Hitler hadn't have been asleep? What if all the panzer divisions had been released.


This is a monster in terms of units from above Army Group (e.g. SHAEF, OKW, AFHQ) all the way to Battalion level; although at the lower level they don't appear on the map and exist in the game attached to larger formations.

The scenarios are set up as historical snapshots but then the choice is yours. The AI can and does launch invasions.

The May 44 Campaign allows you chose an alternatives to Normandy. If you have the East Front Box Option 'ON' then the entire Axis OOB is at your disposal and you can rob the Ostfront for more units at your peril.


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Post #: 15
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 7:41:39 PM   
Freyr Oakenshield


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quote:

If you have the East Front Box Option 'ON' then the entire Axis OOB is at your disposal and you can rob the Ostfront for more units at your peril.



Can you do the opposite, i.e. send some units from the Western Front to the East (West->East), or exchange some units between the fronts (West<->East)? Or is it only in one direction - East->West?

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Post #: 16
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 8:03:42 PM   
RedLancer


Posts: 4314
Joined: 11/16/2005
From: UK
Status: offline 		You can send units in either direction.

Here's a screenshot of the EF Box - it puts the Ostfront in play in an abstracted manner. In simple terms the more units the slower the Soviets advance.




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 17
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 8:06:28 PM   
warshipbuilder


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quote:

I want a game with thousands of pieces like back in the day of that game that sounds like Drag Net Austin.


I believe you are referring to Drang nach Osten?

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Post #: 18
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 9:01:35 PM   
Freyr Oakenshield


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quote:

In simple terms the more units the slower the Soviets advance.


Does slowing the Soviet advance benefit the German player in any way, like e.g. more resources, better production, reinforcements?

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Post #: 19
RE: Questions - 10/9/2014 11:40:46 PM   
Szilard

 

Posts: 386
Joined: 1/3/2001
Status: offline 		I would have preferred something on the scale of GG's old western front game (which I loved, back in the day), updated with a much better AI; the abstracted east front mechanism; better graphics; etc - rather than a monster. But interested enough in the western front to buy this one anyway, probably.

I'm only interested in playing against the AI. Is it going to be capable of playing a plausible German side? Eg, trying for a staged retreat via river lines, trying to hold as far forward as possible until the weather breaks while preserving forces etc etc. Rather than just recapitulating something like the historical scenario. A weakness in the old game was the way it would throw everything it could into Normandy and then immediately draw everything back to the West Wall when the Allies took a couple of key hexes.

I guess a difficulty is that the historical scenario can be seen as kind of low-probability, with an inept German defence strategy. The Allies' planning target seems more plausible - expanding out a beachhead to reach the Loire and Seine by D+90 or whatever; a build-up before the next push; importance of taking the Brittany ports; etc etc. I'd want a game in which something like that is likely to happen, maybe with an optional German dumb-toggle of some kind to allow exploration of a more historical scenario.


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Post #: 20
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 7:15:21 AM   
RedLancer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Freyr Oakenshield

Does slowing the Soviet advance benefit the German player in any way, like e.g. more resources, better production, reinforcements?


Yes - the Soviet advance is tracked across the map as are Axis losses in the EF Box. You won't get any more reinforcements but the longer you hold the better.

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Post #: 21
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 8:10:20 AM   
RedLancer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Szilard

I'm only interested in playing against the AI. Is it going to be capable of playing a plausible German side?



The German AI plays pretty well but of course not as good as a human player. In the games I've played it won't get itself trapped in a Falaise Pocket but then again it doesn't immediately run all the way to the Westwall.

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Post #: 22
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 10:48:16 AM   
zakblood


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Status: offline 		i just hope its not as hardcore as in the east was

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Post #: 23
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 10:56:59 AM   
morvael


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Status: offline 		Same scale, so you can expect less divisions and shorter fronts, just because Western Front was smaller than Eastern Front :) Does it make it less hardcode? No :)

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Post #: 24
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 4:46:03 PM   
freeboy

 

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Status: offline 		did we ever get a price ????

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Post #: 25
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 6:08:38 PM   
SuluSea


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Status: offline 		Assuming this game will give me as much fun as WITE or WITP AE----Price doesn't matter.

That said, knowing what it's going to cost (or even a rough estimate) ahead of time is always good IMO.

< Message edited by SuluSea -- 10/10/2014 7:10:09 PM >

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Post #: 26
RE: Questions - 10/10/2014 8:07:06 PM   
aaatoysandmore

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: warshipbuilder

quote:

I want a game with thousands of pieces like back in the day of that game that sounds like Drag Net Austin.


I believe you are referring to Drang nach Osten?



LOL thas the name. I never could spell it but it always sounded like Dragnet Austin when someone mentioned it.

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Post #: 27
RE: Questions - 10/12/2014 3:30:56 AM   
Gizuria


Posts: 199
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Status: offline 		Well, finally. I will definitely pick this one up as a Christmas present to myself. I expect it to cost somewhere around the region of US$90 to $100 which seems to be the current top-level Matrix games price. But I'm sure it will be more than worth the price.

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Post #: 28
RE: Questions - 10/12/2014 9:57:19 AM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline 		well it's a purchase tbh as i have the east, just keep reading and if needed will help out if a alpha / beta testers are needed, but as release date already been given i think you are already sorted in that department then


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Post #: 29
RE: Questions - 10/16/2014 3:35:15 PM   
stormbringer3

 

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Status: offline 		Does this have any kind of R&D decisions or weapon manufacturing decisions? Thanks.

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Post #: 30
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