orders to help create kill zones

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Flashpoint Campaigns Series >> Requested Features and Ideas >> orders to help create kill zones

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orders to help create kill zones - 2/12/2015 7:25:06 PM

mattdbook

Posts: 4
Joined: 2/12/2015
Status: offline

Hello,

I have been playing the game only since December, but one of the struggles as a Nato player is to create good kill zones. Two things would help:

1) ordering units to hold fire until a certain line is crossed, a range reached, or a certain minimum number of units in LOS. My tanks often engage prematurely, plinking off a recon unit, and then they get pummeled by helicopters and artillery before the Soviet tank companies roll through. If I try to have them scoot to a new position they cannot respond and move quickly enough to reengage the hard-charging Soviet tanks.

2) weight the target selection:the tanks really go after recon and other soft units, and it frustrates me to see them engaging those kind while T80's are repeatedly firing on them. Perhaps this is an automated attempt to suppress artillery spotters, but the strategy doesn't work. It would be great to weight target selection for some units to take out enemy recon while the tanks save themselves for the main enemy body.

It seems that units have markedly more lethality when on hold rather than screen orders. Is this really accurate? For a tank does being in a prepared position drastically improve lethality of their fire? I can understand defensive benefits... This may not be a real issue, but it seems to be happening.

Lastly, stingers versus hinds is really depressing. I know this has been mentioned in other places. Do Hinds really have the same kind of pop-up maneuverability as an Apache or Kiowa? Hinds seems to be like veritable gods of war just trashing units with almost impunity all over the map. And these are against units that are dug-in in forest and towns, with overlapping air defenses, etc. So my request would be to reconsider the modeling of this.

I really do enjoy the game, and these are my suggestions and requests offered in the spirit of helping you continue to produce a wonderful simulation. As a relatively new player perhaps I am not aware of how these issues can already be resolved in the game, so I will happily take advice if I am commenting out of ignorance.

Thanks!

Post #: 1

RE: orders to help create kill zones - 2/13/2015 4:52:54 AM

IronMikeGolf

Posts: 899
Joined: 3/19/2010
Status: offline

These things are on the list for version 2.1

At the scale we are working with, both in terms of distance/size (kilometers), units covering them (platoons and companies), and the size of the target units (companies, battalions, and regiments) such areas are called Engagement Areas. Kill Zones are used by squads and platoons, are normally 10s to 100s of meters in distance/size, and target squads and maybe platoons.

It is not too difficult to establish an Engagement Area (EA) in the game, even without having that as an explicit control measure. Yes, you will get units that engage enemy outside the EA. Yes, units will shoot BTR-60 equipped MRCs (Motorized Rifle Companies) or BRDM equipped Recce Platoons at 2000+ meters with ATGMs when there are T80s only 1500 meters away. We just have to live with that for now. Try to position your AT shooters where they can only see the EA.

US SAMs (Surface to Air Missile) air defense systems are not all that good. At the time, the US was placing the air defense in the USAF's basket. The theory was fighter aircraft would dominate (eventually) the battlefield and deal with the rotary wing threat. Of course, they's spend a number of days killing WP fighters in order to establish air superiority, first. Kinda suck on the ground until that happens.

So, what to do? Use guns and terrain. 25mm and 20mm is pretty good against Hinds and Hips 1500 meters and closer. 50 cal less so. A two ship Hind element 1000-1500 meters from a US Bradley equipped mech comapny is in a bad situation. See if you can use terrain so that the two units don't see each other until the range is like that. Think SAM trap, but with guns. I put the Chaparral tracks further back so their forward edge of the missile engagement envelope is at the forward edge of the gun systems. This masses fores from the Brads, Vulcans, and Chaparrals. Too far forward and the Chaparrals fire all their missiles and maaaaybe get a hit. Then get waxed by ATGMs. Much better to let them get closer and then everybody gang up and smack them out of the sky before the get a missile off. This can and does work. You do need the right force mix, placement, and cooperative terrain.

_____________________________

Jeff
Sua Sponte

(in reply to mattdbook)

Post #: 2

RE: orders to help create kill zones - 2/13/2015 4:27:21 PM

mattdbook

Posts: 4
Joined: 2/12/2015
Status: offline

Thanks for the advice on air defense - managing well what is controllable and just accepting US doctrine for what it is.

I am excited for 2.1, but already really enjoy the game.

(in reply to IronMikeGolf)

Post #: 3

RE: orders to help create kill zones - 2/13/2015 5:19:56 PM

IronMikeGolf

Posts: 899
Joined: 3/19/2010
Status: offline

I think one of the design goals for the 2.1 version is to make a Unit SOP AI so that we, as players, worry less about operating as platoon leaders and company commanders and instead focus on decisions at battalion and higher levels.

I am also hoping for a differentiation between maneuver orders ("hold up at Phase Line MARLBORO") and battle planning orders ("conduct attack by fire from Hill 873 oriented northeast"). As it stands now, every order gets an order delay and the delay is the same for everything. The first example above in real life takes seconds or a couple of minutes (in a light to moderate EW environment) to execute and the latter takes a goodly bit of time.

_____________________________

Jeff
Sua Sponte

(in reply to mattdbook)

Post #: 4