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Vechiles - 3/22/2015 12:02:31 PM

Smirfy
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Ran a test in the Italian campaign destroyed every single axis unit and the grand total of 64193 vechiles were destroyed or captured. It still left a huge pool at the end game of 1.5 million trucks

The Allies on the other hand had no units that capitulated and none destroyed suffered no air interdiction yet lost 105,000 trucks.

Something seems off here

Post #: 1

RE: Vechiles - 3/22/2015 12:23:30 PM

Davekhps
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Not sure about that Axis truck pool #, but I imagine the Allies lose a *lot* of trucks in moving supplies from depots, i.e. "Red Bull Express" wearing out the pool.

But that's, like, a logical historical explanation... dunno if that's actually what's happening with the game mechanics.

(in reply to Smirfy)

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RE: Vechiles - 3/22/2015 2:25:06 PM

carlkay58
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Trucks suffer losses as they wear out delivering supplies. All vehicles and AFVs suffer losses as the units move. These losses go into the repair pools as damaged and are slowly returned to the active pool or destroyed in the repair process.

As you destroy more and more Axis units, the Axis vehicle pool is drawn down less for supplying the remaining units and are thus lose less than supplying all of the units. It is a feedback cycle.

(in reply to Davekhps)

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RE: Vechiles - 3/22/2015 4:44:02 PM

decourcy2
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Plus, the Axis truck pool is way to big in both WitE and WitW.

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RE: Vechiles - 3/22/2015 10:24:11 PM

Smirfy
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I would be a fan of seeing more dislocation and im still not convinced that the allies would lose double the trucks with no Stalingrad esque defeats and the Germans would lose halve that number with catastrophes, aerial and ground . Remember these are outright losses. The axis appear to be running huge surpluses in everything especially trucks and supply. I believe in the end game you should be experiencing greater dislocation rather than the battlefield replicating the summer 43 in the winter and spring of 45 so that the player can try varying strategies to expedite that end. My latest test again I found the most effiecent use in the end game was using strategic bombers as a battlefield weapon.

< Message edited by Smirfy -- 3/22/2015 11:24:55 PM >

(in reply to decourcy2)

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RE: Vechiles - 3/23/2015 11:29:58 PM

Fallschirmjager
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In my PBEM game we are in Feb 1945 and my opponent is running out of trucks. This comes after he stripped 1/3 of his units of trucks and made them static to build forts.

Mud, interdiction and bombing vehicle factories has finally paid off and his units are not able to supply themselves.
I think the game models horses somewhere in the logistics system. I have also been slamming his rail yards since day one and combat is now easier since his CV is lowered across the board. If weather was better I could probably break into northern Italy and move faster into Germany. But as is, I think I have a shot at taking Berlin. My opponent also admitted he wanted to perform a large scale counter offensive back in November against my southern front since my link between my southern France invasion and northern France invasion was very weak. He might of seriously delayed me if he had done that. But the lack of supply and trucks meant he could not pull it off. Many of his units cannot move now due to lack of trucks and to haul supplies.

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RE: Vechiles - 3/24/2015 8:24:00 AM

Smirfy
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Great that your seeing it I seen absolutely zip in my game against AI and I inflicted several Stalingrads on them and still mananaged as I say to lose twice the trucks. How about a couple of screens to see what dislocation we can expect? Frontlines and Pools would be fantastic. Of course distances would be shorter in my test and though airpower would be less prevelent there are less targets which balances slighty and the terrain favours the axis somewhat. In my game against the AI it ended up playing much the same as WiTE which is something that really should not happen. Going back to saves before the final offensive the Axis have 29,000 trucks in units (a surplus) and about a 7% supply surplus with an Ammo surplus even higher in units. Just using the scenario as an experimental control I would argue that several pools are excessive even for the needs to get a viable game against the AI. So I can safely stand by my asssertion that it is a more effiecent use of Strategic bombers in my test at any rate to use as battlefied weapons.

(in reply to Fallschirmjager)

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RE: Vechiles - 3/24/2015 8:39:15 AM

RedLancer
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The truck requirement for the Axis and the Allies is quite different so a direct comparison is possibly unhelpful.

Remember that trucks are used in two key ways - in a unit for movement and also for linking to depots for supply.

Manual Section 20.4.1.1 on Page 181 explains the difference on the supply path to depots - the Axis don't need trucks if the distance is three hexes or less. In addition Axis units need a lot less trucks in their units.

It may well be the case that the truck pool in Battleground Italy is excessive but as we have said before this is a scenario which exposes production problems.

_____________________________

John
WitE2 Asst Producer
WitE & WitW Dev

(in reply to Smirfy)

Post #: 8

RE: Vechiles - 3/25/2015 4:28:21 PM

Joel Billings
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There was a bug that slipped into the game right around release where every time we re-saved a scenario in the editor, 50k vehicles were added the to German damaged vehicle pool if the scenario editor had his East Front Option turned on. This was fixed recently in a test version, and will be in the next public beta that should be released any day now. I found one scenario where the German truck pool had over 1 million at the start. Since the Germans get 10% back every turn, you can see it didn't take long for the German vehicle pool to explode. If you're playing a scenario where the German vehicle pool looks inflated, it probably was.

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All understanding comes after the fact.
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RE: Vechiles - 3/25/2015 4:46:58 PM

Smirfy
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Thanks, Look forward to that patch and putting the Germans on the hoof.

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