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Death in the Desert! Squirmer (Good Guys) vs Gary Tatro (Bad Guys)

 
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Death in the Desert! Squirmer (Good Guys) vs Gary Tatro... - 3/16/2003 12:24:16 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		This is a play-test of a new Steve "Warrior" Avery scenario for SPH2H - Death in the Desert.

Steve's brief description:

quote:

Set in an alternate universe where German & Russia remained allies: North Africa May 1945, meeting engagement between US, British, & Canadian vs German, Russian & Italian forces. 25 turns, lots of heavy armor, good terrain for shoot & scoot.


Passwords currently being exchanged, Good Guys go first, will report soon ... :)
Post #: 1
Turn 1 - 3/16/2003 3:28:01 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		As this is a play-test I'll try and give a bit more info than usual. Without compromising security obviously ... :)

The map is large at 100x140 hexes. Typical desert, lots of open spaces and long ridges. Visibility is 30. There are high value end of battle VHs at top, middle and bottom.

Allied starting forces consist of what I suppose you might call a Recon Company, staffed by redoubtable Canucks. We have heard that forces from the "Axis of Bad Guys" may be in the vicinity so we are proceeding cautiously. Two VHs taken, no sign of the enemy.

A quick look at the roster reveals substantial US and British reinforcements following behind. Half the free world's artillery and air force are on call though most seem to be on tea/coffee break at the moment.

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 2
German - 3/16/2003 6:03:18 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Recon froce strengthened by some meaner stuff starts out. High visibility, but that leads to dust trails so in the beginning you can see where the bad guys are going and coming to. Moved to a victory hex and took it. First thing notices is the there is very good terrain but getting to it is difficult. All hills with large valley's where the VH are. Trying to move from one hill to the next will be hard. Quickly note that there are no Glory holes ploted for the artillary. That is ok the originator was kind enough to lend us a FO.
Trade some shots with and M4, but mostly just create a dust screen to block line of sight and protect my small force until my reinforcements arive and try to move into a better position.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 3
Turn 2 - 3/16/2003 6:04:22 PM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		Italians!

No wonder they are trying to hide behind their own dust trails ;) I don't think the trails block visibility for that long, we shall see ...

All we can see is a FO team on foot. They have been suppressed by the mighty 75mm of our M4s (or Sherman Vs) and a super-fast responding 3in mortar.

Pretty much a holding operation until the reinforcements arrive.

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 4
The Americans - 3/16/2003 9:38:13 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		They are so bold. Leaving their M4's out in the open. Unfortunetly the Italians are not very good shots. So we need to do some more tartget practice. Not much else. I see the Americans are going for the VH grab. That is ok when my reinforcements arrive we will just take them back. :)

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 5
Turn 3 - 3/17/2003 1:33:23 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		The M4s are now hiding. The Italians have the cheek to field our own 90mm AT weapons against us ... :)

It seems the Bad Guys have some serious artillery support too. 150mm batteries are starting to re-create the surface of the moon.

Reinforcements have started to arrive. Only a trickle right now though.

This is going to be a real meat-grinder once one of us trys to advance ...

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 6
As my artillary falls - 3/19/2003 7:54:18 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		and the wimpy british retreat and rout. Halftracks and armored cars zoom in and destroy the poor disoriented infantry and halftracks.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 7
Turn 4 - 3/20/2003 4:06:26 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		In response to the Italian attack M4s come out of hiding and just about manage to damage an APC. Class shooting guys :rolleyes: An RSI infantry squad is also pushed back with significant casualties.

Just skirmishing really at this point. Reinforcements are beginning to arrive in force but will take a while to get to the front, especially as half of them break down in the sand ...

We have spotted a T-70 in the south :eek: Ruskies in the desert, cool :)

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 8
The italians continue to move forward - 3/21/2003 5:07:05 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Italians taking advantage of the still disoriented british serge forward again and destroy two more half tracks and take out a few more infantry men. Russian reinforcements arive and are rushed foward to the front.

Side note: As far as the senario has been so far, the players do not do a lot in the first four or five turns. I not really sure why you did the reinforcements the way you did? It might be better to increase the amount of recon forces in the beginning or to bump up the speed in which the reinforcements arive. The recon tanks of the soviets could have started where they reinforced on turn 1. If I had not been lucky with my artillary both Squirmer and I would have done pretty much nothing for the first few turns. Also it seems a little strange with no ATG's at all. They are much less expensive then tanks and in this visibility would be deployed with a vengence if available. Just a couple of thoughts.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 9
- 3/21/2003 7:14:26 PM   
Warrior


Posts: 1808
Joined: 11/2/2000
From: West Palm Beach, FL USA
Status: offline 		Good observation about the AT guns. The Italians & Canadians are mainly recon in force.

_____________________________

Retreat is NOT an option.



(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 10
Turn 5 - 3/21/2003 7:24:22 PM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		That's almost an entire platoon of Canadians wiped out by the Italians, who are concentrating their entire force in a small area.

We can see an enormous amount of Russians in the south. Thankfully they do not have very up to date equipment, only T-34/76s and IS-1s. I would be a bit worried if some indestructable IS-3s had showed up (maybe they still will?).

Air support was called in to try and slow the Soviet Hordes down but for some reason the P-38 pilot couldn't hit jack :(

Notes:

I agree with Gary, this is a bit slow to get going. I can also confirm that the Allies have no AT guns either now or on the way, and I do think a few would be in order.

There are some nice touches here though. Both Canadian and Brit grunts get Garand rifles which are basically twice as effective as the Lee Enfield. The Russians have a unit called a "SO Halftrack" which is an M5 but with a 12.7mm AAMG instead of a .50 cal. No real difference in effectiveness but more Russian if you know what I mean :)

One more thing, and this is just personal really, is the Brit tanks. They are all Fireflys. I would have liked to see some home-made stuff there i.e. Comets :) If the 17 pdrs are required for balance then maybe have them as AT guns?

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 11
Not much - 3/24/2003 9:42:30 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		From me this turn.
Mostly menuvering.

My Air attack that I had planned on your M4's decided that it would attack my own troops. :( But my artillary thought that a 150mm shell down the hatch of one of your M4's would be cool.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 12
- 3/24/2003 6:39:05 PM   
Warrior


Posts: 1808
Joined: 11/2/2000
From: West Palm Beach, FL USA
Status: offline 		Hi you guys! This is really helpful, and I appreciate your posting like this. Your on-going comments are most useful. I was working on a "lite" version of this when you started (with no artillery except mortars, no air support, and less visibility), and have incorporated some of your suggestions.

_____________________________

Retreat is NOT an option.



(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 13
Turn 6 - 3/25/2003 4:01:55 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		The M4 platoon is definitely suffering. About 3 arty batteries targeted on them right now.

A Firefly sitting further back kills an Autoblinda AC. US Air Support is more successful than German, there is now one less T-34 to worry about :)

Still lots of manouvering for position going on. The American ground forces are starting to arrive.

Notes:

As an equivalence to the Brits and Canadians getting Garands, it seems the Ruskies have been given Stg 44s by the Germans.

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 14
Well not a lot - 3/27/2003 6:51:05 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		happened this round either. Reinforcements are really starting to come in and a lot of menuvering to get into position as both sides rush to get to the front.
Down in the south I crest the hill with a scout tank and kill a AA greyhound and a halftrack as the southern russians finally make contact with the Americans.
Center not much happening.
North reinforcements Rushing at each other.

On a side note it seems kind of strange that my overall field commander has not arived yet and it is turn 7. Hmm maybe he overslepted. Warrior was there a reason for no preploted glory heles? It is taking me a long time to get my artillary to land, even with the FO (since the HQ is not on board yet he is out of contact 50% of the time) and most of my artillary is off board currently. The americans on the other hand should have very short lags even without a FO. Just curious. Has not made a big deal yet.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 15
Re: Well not a lot - 3/27/2003 10:36:56 AM   
Warrior


Posts: 1808
Joined: 11/2/2000
From: West Palm Beach, FL USA
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Gary Tatro
[B]On a side note it seems kind of strange that my overall field commander has not arived yet and it is turn 7. Hmm maybe he overslepted. Warrior was there a reason for no preploted glory heles? It is taking me a long time to get my artillary to land, even with the FO (since the HQ is not on board yet he is out of contact 50% of the time) and most of my artillary is off board currently. The americans on the other hand should have very short lags even without a FO. Just curious. Has not made a big deal yet. [/B][/QUOTE]

A couple of reasons for the HQ's coming on late: 1) if somebody wants to play this vs the AI, they won't get a free kill as the HQ rushes blindly into their gunsights, and 2) the idea is that this is a major probe to find a way around or through the enemy lines for a flank attack - hence the Italians & Russians, Canadians & British as mainly recon, with the major force following on to exploit any breakthrough. So it seemed logical to me that the HQ's would be with the main force. :)

Pretty much the same reason for no pre-plotted arty: these forces are supposedly out of their normal operations areas, going where they haven't been before. I know the artillery delay is a handicap for the Axis, but it can be overcome, and I've tried to compensate for it by giving you some goodies the Allies don't have. ;)

BTW, when you guys are through getting bloody with this, I've got the "Lite" version finished. It has basically the same forces, but quite a few map changes, including different placement of the victory hexes, and reinforcements come on the map sooner. There's no heavy artillery or air support, and it is a real bruiser. :D :eek: :D

_____________________________

Retreat is NOT an option.



(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 16
Turn 7 - 3/30/2003 1:01:57 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		South: Russians have taken a hill overlooking the objective, beating up British halftracks on the way. They are now suffering artillery bombardment while the rest of the Brits take their time getting there :rolleyes:

Centre: Italians seem to be hiding now. Finally got rid of an immobilised Autoblinda which had been sitting there peeing its pants for several turns ;)

North: The Germans have arrived. They have some horrible tanks with them i.e. Kingtigers, Tigers and Panthers. P-38s attack en masse and kill one Panther for the loss of one plane. Germans flak is numerous and effective.

A lot of US reinforcements arrived this turn and are hurrying to the front.

Notes:

This is pretty much developing into a stalemate right now, any breakthrough will probably only be achieved via attrition. The map lacks cover for proceeding in a lateral direction ... Also, although it is big, at 100x160, it could be even bigger given the amount of forces and their speed.

I lied about the AT guns. US now have some 3 inchers, the Germans 88mm PaK43s.

Is there any point in having recon units come in with the Americans since the Canadians and Brits have already performed this function?

Anyway, things are going to start heating up from now onwards :)

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 17
Holy opportunity Fires batman - 3/31/2003 2:01:57 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Uggh, I just learned the hardway not to give Firefly's oportunity fires, as I lose an IS-2 and a T-34/85. :( :( :( and there was only two of them. Well things continue to heat up as reinforcements continue to come in and are rushed forward.

I correct two of my last two statements, first I do have ATG's they just are arriving now and the F*cking American artillary and AIR is sure getting anoying. Considering my Commander has still not arrived and my FO still is not in contact and the earlyest my artillary can arrive is 2.1. I can't play this way!!!!!!, What are you doing to me. Please change the time the commander of the battle arrives, please, please, please.

Enough wining. Back to you oh OP-Fire devistator.

By the way how does one squirm in the desert?

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 18
Turn 8 - 4/2/2003 2:32:45 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		I'm gonna be squirming if any of those German tanks get near my armour ... :)

Fireflys did do rather well last turn, got 3 HTs and an Italian tank as well as the two Ruskie tanks.

What was also good was the Staghound armoured car which single-handedly took on an entire mechanised infantry battalion and survived.

Anyway, this turn we concentrate on beating up German and Soviet infantry scambling across the hills. More reinforcements arrive and are on their way, throwing up huge clouds of dust.

Definitely fun now :D

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 19
Never bring a Firefly - 4/4/2003 8:22:17 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		To a KNOGSTIGER fight.
Knogstigers 3 Firefly's 0 :D :D :D

Some of my armor was able to shrug of the mass amounts of air attacks in the last two turns and engaged four Firefly's. Three down I do not think the fourth will stay out in the open.

What do you have in those things anyway laser sights. It is a good thing I lead with Halftracks instead of tanks. Shh. It was like my half track commanders were pulling straws to see whoe was the next to explode. Maybe two misses on the Firefly op fire out of like ten at + 2000 yards. :eek: :eek: :eek: Thats just crazy. Well I am glad my KongsTigers are well armored.

To answer my previous question it is like a snake, squirming that is in a desert.

PS my commander finally arived thank god.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 20
Turn 9 - 4/7/2003 12:09:56 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		I told you I'd be squirming when those Katz turned up :)

Remaining Firefly is now hiding. Air and artillery are concentrating on slowing the panzers down.

Only real action this time was in the south where a platoon of British infantry got bored and decided to take on the entire Russian contigent on their own. Did amazingly well considering but they will probably not last long ...

Got a boatload of reinforcements this turn, there are still more to come looking at the roster!

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 21
Death to the Imperialist Pig dogs. - 4/7/2003 7:38:00 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Down South we crush you pathetic attempt at breaking through.

In the middle we find your British company in the rocks and riddle every single man with a bullet.

Up north we place some smoke in front of your ATG's and proceed to give your M4's Kongstiger lovin.

That is all for now.

On a side note, the battle is really huge, I am having trouble negotiating the hole battlefield and making cohesive attacks, there are just to many opponents and to much terrain.
I agree with Squirmer also if you wanted this to be a hide and seek battle it is more turning into a slug fest with the winner being who ever can turn a flank. There are two things affecting this. One the visibility-it is totally going for tanks with high penatration and high targeting. Also because it is so high you leave dust trails everywhere. This allows the opponent to have a general idea where you are. I have been trying to nullify this by moving over all the hexes in my backfield putting up dust everywhere thus limiting his recon, but with the planes he is fielding it is hard (imposible) for me to keep my forces hidden. :(

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 22
Turn 10 - 4/7/2003 8:13:46 PM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		My word there are a lot of Germans about! We are now most definitely in defend stance ... No idea how I'm going to stop those Koenigstigers, haven't seen any Kongstigers ... :confused: :rolleyes: :)

Very little happened this turn. Just a lot of artillery and now diminishing airstrikes trying to slow things down.

Notes:

An awful lot of units now. Tons of HT-mounted infantry mostly. Need more tanks really. Or even better a bunch of 17 pdr ATGs with APCR ...

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 23
More - 4/10/2003 6:19:01 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		British infantry die this turn along with a platoon of americans. They got to close AT infantry and were suppressed so he blasted them out of their halftracks and SS came in to finish them off. Saw a whole bunch of USA reinforcements coming in. Sent some aircraft their way. :) That is about it.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 24
Turn 11 - 4/12/2003 2:53:23 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		Not much action this turn. Mainly just trying to get into good defensive positions, which is not easy. Those elements which have foolishly moved forward (couple of mech inf platoons) are fighting where they stand.

My air is almost kaput. Lost another P51 to the darned Ostwinds. Almost a guaranteed kill when that 37mm hits ...

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 25
2 Pershings Die - 4/12/2003 8:23:23 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Along with a M4 and about 2 platoons of halftracks. :) But down south is beginning to look ugly. Pershings and M4's by the dozeen. Getting hot in the desert for sure. Now if I could just shot down the rest of that air I would be happy.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 26
Turn 12 - 4/13/2003 10:49:06 PM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		The last few turns show how Gary likes his infantry :) An endless stream of HTs, dismounting and assaults. Tanks only appear right at the end if my vehicles are still standing. Very effective stuff. I can only hope that at some point the German grunts run out of smoke so that I can shoot at them on my turn.

Things are not looking good for the allies except possibly in the south, where our forces are concentrated for some reason. We are now attempting a deep flanking manouver right on the bottom edge of the map. Panthers, StuGs and flak wagons oppose us. It will be interesting to see how this turns out ...

Note:

The turns are so long now that I do not get to see the whole VCR replay. Cuts out about 3/4 of the way through. The .REC files are now getting to be 8-10mb in size.

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 27
I lost two Tigers this turn - 4/14/2003 9:32:31 AM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		Without much to show for it. Pershings are nasty got one with an op fire and the other was kiled by US artillary. I also had two aircraft shot down. :(

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 28
Turn 13 - 4/15/2003 8:00:57 AM   
Squirmer

 

Posts: 211
Joined: 7/9/2002
From: GB
Status: offline 		Our defense line did pretty well that go. Forces are now lined up on opposing ridges in most places, it's difficult to cross the valley between.

Allies continue to make their mad flanking manouver in the south. One HT down, lots more still going.

Note:

Air has been pretty ineffective for both sides. Lots of planes getting shot down. Maybe less flak?

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 29
My air finally did something - 4/15/2003 7:17:19 PM   
Gary Tatro

 

Posts: 1213
Joined: 2/1/2002
From: MA, US
Status: offline 		I think he should rename the the senario Vallies of Death instead of death in the desert. It seems when either one of us trys to cross a valley we end up being "buzzard food". :)

This turn up north I get within one hex of that 3 inch ATG and am stopped. I managed to take the other one out.

In the middle and south more half tracks and infantry perish but no pershings. :(

Way Way down south you get pummled by my overwatching units and artillary and aircraft.

My aircraft did a decent job this time racked up 2 tanks and a halftrack. I see you still have a lot of units back there.

The artillary is quite tremendous and devistating. I am having a real problem with all the Americain super halftracks that have a 50 cal and 2 30 cals. Where the vast majority of my halftracks have one 30 cal. :( I really have to worry about his halftracks shoting mine which forces me to use my tanks on his halftracks. Which is ok but he has really good tanks also and can use them to concentrate on my tanks. Over all it appears to be ballancing itself out.

_____________________________

"Are you going to do something or just stand there and bleed"

(in reply to Squirmer)
Post #: 30
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