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Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - DBBC - No Sniper Pls

 
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Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - DBBC ... - 8/20/2015 2:30:52 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Welcome.

They say on the stock market no matter how many times you make the same mistake, you can always make it one more time. I'll be putting this to the test and yes, I'll make the same mistakes again.

I'll post house rules in a bit, but they are standard. Limits on CAP height. PDU is off and realistic R&D is on.

So what I have to do is make sense of this and turn it into a machine of sorts.






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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 2:37:41 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Big Picture

The KB will be around Singapore. No PH. Because of this, there will be little Cenpac or SoPac in the beginning. I'll be doing landings at Rabaul and Kavieng. LBA will cover a slow expansion there. No Wake until later, after I've upgraded enough Claudes to Zeroes. 14th Army will be Luzon with 2 Divs and Brigade.

A day 2 Mersing Landing, followed by a hopefully quick victory in Singapore. All 4 divisions from the HI, plus the 38th from Hong Kong will be joining the party, after which, 2 divisions will divert down to Java and the remainder will focus on Ceylon and India.

I'm still not sure on any Aleutians as my main focus will be on Ceylon and then India. If things go smoothly, I'll focus on an Aleutians campaign.




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< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 3:38:47 AM >

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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 2:49:56 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		December 7th through December 14th, 1941

Mersing landing occurred on the 8th. Attack occurred on the 9th, but my ARM regiment didn't pursue unfortunately. So I don't think I cut the north off. I'm seeing 5 units in Kluong and 12 units in Johore Bharu. 20 units in Singapore, so I'm going to have to do this the hard way. 4 Divisions are converging on Mersing, the Imperial Div coming south and the 38th Div will be picked up as Hong Kong fell to the second attack on the 11th.

Repulse and POW both reported sunk. Port Strike of Manila was disappointing but the follow up has netted a couple of DDs, Subs and Tankers.

Palembang fell to the 124th Battalion on the 11th also.

Rabaul was invaded with 2 Naval Guards and Kavieng invaded with a partial Naval Guard. A second attack at Rabaul scheduled for today.

To avoid losses, there won't be much being done in Timor area for a while. Once Luzon landing are secured, I'll shift a few SCTF to the area and start a low push into the Timor Sea.

The Mini-KB went up to Takao to upgrade it's planes and is now supporting Luzon against a horde of MTB and PT boats. I've had no losses there yet. Once secured, it will shift to support Timor.





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< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 3:55:59 AM >

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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 3:04:33 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Air Losses to Date

A few uncoordinated strikes and CAP traps nailed more Vals than I would have liked. Otherwise, I'm happy with the results so far.






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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 11:32:21 AM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Good luck!

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 5
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 1:08:19 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		Lessons "I've learned" - prioritize where your Air HQ are going and assign sufficient shipping to get them out of Formosa. This will free up KB to "pillage and burn." Second, KB needs to hit port of Soerabaja hard asap. Make it a port the Allies cannot use for replenishment of SC TF and subs.

_____________________________


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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 2:14:28 PM   
JocMeister

 

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		Good luck! I´ll follow this. Can´t help much though as you are playing the dark side!

(in reply to ny59giants)
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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 6:34:51 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		No worries and thanks since you're playing the dark side also! Roshemon anyone?

I'm following your game with Lowpe closely.

(in reply to JocMeister)
Post #: 8
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 6:37:55 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lessons Learned #1 - Never enter into a land war in Asia

Old adage and true but too late. This one is on Tojo and if he were smart, the war in China wasn't worth the effort. The resources weren't worth the effort compared to the # of Divisions that could have been elsewhere. Doubtful China would have attacked in Manchuria and the Russians maintained truce throughout the war (until it was obvious to Stalin). However, a what if that can't be played out.

My main focus will be on Changsha area, the railways and roads around it with Kweiyang the secondary objective. Nanning, Chengchow and the defensive line north of them are primary objectives. Lanchow/Sian are secondary objectives and based on what Are does. I lucked out with Bill only because he had some issues with stacking and left a few units too close to mine rather than a full retreat.

China is a lot of work and that leads me to my second Lesson Learned.

< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 10:51:29 PM >

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 9
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 6:50:54 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Thanks Michael. KB is in position to do that and will do that. Singapore is a couple of weeks away as I have 4 divisions in route and will probably take no chances and cross with the 2 division on Johore Bharu and the 4 additional. That's 2400 AV (with the Imperial possibly getting there in time). Southern and 25th are prepping for it. Should be more than enough for a December victory. Johore will fall today, so that should enable land based fighters and bombers to take over that part. KB will move south.

Air HQs are in already in motion. I have one in Balikpan that's moving to Truk and eventually either Rabual or Roi-Namur as American CVs and BBs have been spotted just south of Wake. Not sure where they are going, but if they stick around I'll push that Air HQ into Roi. If not, Rabual. The 11th Air Fleet is in motion to either Balikpan or Rabual, again depending on his actions with the carriers. I already have an Air HQ in Bangkok to prevent resupply of Burma. 22nd will move from Saigon down to Palembang.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 10
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 7:03:19 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #2 - Work Within your Dumbness

Whether it's the sheer size of this game or limitations on concentration due to ADD or Alzheimers, running multiple simultaneous operations is beyond my abilities. Focus on China and I forget Subs. Focus on Industry and I forget replacements and pilots, or forget to double check cap levels/fatigue/morale or forget that Amphib force I moved to pick up a unit, or I'm focused on everything and then forget to wipe in the bathroom.

Tracker helps but not enough for me to remember stuff. Notes help, but I'm not very thorough about writing all the notes required.

Operations:
Phase 1 - Singapore and Rabaul
Phase 2 - Java, Ceylon and Solomons (including Port Arthur)
Phase 3 - Timor (under LBA) and India (with KB Support for landings at Diamond/Chittagong/Calcutta)
Phase 4 - Cenpac (under LBA)
Phase 5 - Aleutians (with KB Support)
China - Limited goals - Nanning Line, Changsha Line, Kweiyang and possibly Lanchow/Sian, but I don't want to put huge effort like I had to with Bill

So, this requires getting everything into position in time to start these operations. It helps to have taken Palembang as a fuel source and Hong Kong (not sure how much Fuel I took, but it was a lot). And that leads me to my next Lesson Learned.

< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 8:04:51 PM >

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 11
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 7:09:46 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #3 - Push, Push Push it, Push it real good

Within the limitations of Lesson #2, I'm seeing that the successful Japanese players push the Allies and force them to defend, something I haven't done hardly at all with Bill. The game with Bill will be a lesson if Japan can defend a historical (roughly) perimeter and my guess is no. But we'll see. That being said, pushing the Allies, keeping them off balance, forcing Air and Land battles and hopefully catching the Allies in some type of mistake as they are reacting seems to be a formula for success. Keep the strategic initiative for as long as possible. What I've learned in John's game with Michael is that Japan can do a tremendous amount in 42. However this mod and BTS are very very different, still I think the capability is there. Again, in order for me to do this, I have to be able to focus operations to maximize my wee little brain.

< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 8:11:22 PM >

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 12
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 7:20:52 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #4 - Don't just stand there, get into the War Dummy

It took me about 5 months of game time before I realized that some units have both a cargo and troop cost, sitting there wondering why I needed so many xAPs in order to transport a DIV. Sigh. Figured that one out so now I have AmphDivs set up with combo of troop and cargo transports, all relative knot speeds and I'm going to keep them together with good leaders throughout the war (or until they get hammered, whichever comes first).

I also focused on troop transport for all troop movements instead of using all available xAKs to move troops, slowing me down considerably. This time, I'm doing the following

So with this in mind:
1) Get everything FORWARD. There's plenty of reinforcements coming in for rear areas (didn't fully appreciate how many until my game with Bill)
2) Use everything to move this stuff. There's a godawful amount sitting around. Doesn't help to leave it there. Get it forward and figure out where it goes from there. Use the Amphib bonus while it lasts.
3) Create and maintain AmphDivs for divisional movement, find an consolidate the rest at key junctions such as Truk and Babeldaob and Soerabaja and Tokyo as so much comes in there.
4) Convert to AKs as much as possible as they are great to accompany AmphDivs.


< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 10:53:46 PM >

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 13
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 8:00:51 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #5 - A Russian don't take a dump, Son, without a Plan

Name the movie that line came out of.

Have a plan a keep to it. I've been fumbling around in my game with Bill. Initial expansions were because there wasn't opposition. But it wasn't a plan. Once I encountered resistance, I realized that I didn't have anything in the correct position to continue it. So once I hit resistance in Suva, I stopped and didn't continue forward in part because I wasn't prepared. Once I hit resistance in Aleutians, again I stopped.

And because I wasn't prepared, I've been moving right and left without any real goal (other than China). I stopped 2 hexes off NE OZ with 3 Amphib forces because I realized nothing else was behind and ready to follow up. I moved 2 infantry to the HI in order to follow up in the Aleutians and then called that off because nothing else was ready. The KB has been moving all over the map without much gain and using WAY too much fuel. All this because of no plan.

So, my plan for India will be to move as much AA/ENG/Fuel/Supply into Singapore and eventually Ceylon and India. This is my plan and I'm sticking with it.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 14
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 8:03:09 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		The Hunt for Red October

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(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 15
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 8:09:28 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Ding Ding Ding

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 16
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 8:11:46 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		And you thought I wouldn't be reading this!

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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 8:35:17 PM   
vicberg

 

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RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 9:32:26 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vicberg

No worries and thanks since you're playing the dark side also! Roshemon anyone?

I'm following your game with Lowpe closely.


Don't let anything out of the bag, like Fortress Hokkaido. Remember, loose lips sink ships.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 19
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 9:35:10 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Loose Clicks sink ships also.

Shhhhhh....secrets is safe with me. I won't mention anything about the special atom bombs stored in Tokyo. Nope. Won't do it.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 20
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 9:35:14 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vicberg

Lesson Learned #3 - Push, Push Push it, Push it real good

The game with Bill will be a lesson if Japan can defend a historical (roughly) perimeter and my guess is no. But we'll see.


This is perhaps the most prudent way to play Japan. Less than historical expansion, tenacious offensive defense. But almost nobody plays that way.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 21
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 10:00:41 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #6 - Never ever ever use ETRE with another Verb

That's from my 7th grade French class. But since it has nothing to do with WITP

Lesson Learned #6 - Never ever ever shock attack across a major river into an Urban Hex unless you absolutely have to

Crossed with 2 division into Changsha, both were decimated. Then did it AGAIN with 2 more. Stock Market lesson played out twice with Bill. No matter how many times you make the same mistake you can always make it one more time. Also, have learned about stacking limit. Bill mentioned there's a roll when over-stacked to determine if the over-stack is disrupted or not. Didn't know that. So when attacking an over-stacked hex, hit it bombers and bombardments and wait. Also, don't get upset at the game system. It's sensitive.

< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 11:01:29 PM >

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 22
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 10:10:14 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #7 - Concentrate Firepower at the point of attack or defense

I have had stuff scattered to the four winds in my game with Bill, again because of Lesson #5 or lack thereof. Don't have a plan then don't take a dump. Concentrate Planes where needed. Concentrate Surface Fleets where needed. I've taken horrendous losses in Burma against Bill before I got enough juice there. So, this time, focus focus focus. My wee little brain is getting a headache already.

Again, with a plan, easier to focus firepower and manpower.

< Message edited by vicberg -- 8/20/2015 11:11:09 PM >

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 23
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 10:12:51 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Lesson Learned #8 - Never speak about fight club

This is actually more relevant than it seems. If I told anyone about the time and effort I put into this single game, someone would have me committed.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 24
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/20/2015 11:50:05 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		December 14th, 1942

Crappers!

He's one of THESE types of players. Crud. Now I'm going to have to micro-manage movement.

He shock attacked at Wenchow and caught me in move mode. And look at all the aggressive Chinese Movements! Oh boy...

Ground combat at Wenchow (89,58)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 11593 troops, 38 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 418

Defending force 14753 troops, 114 guns, 36 vehicles, Assault Value = 435

Allied adjusted assault: 1296

Japanese adjusted defense: 355

Allied assault odds: 3 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), op mode(-), preparation(-), experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
3505 casualties reported
Squads: 51 destroyed, 9 disabled
Non Combat: 100 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 7 destroyed, 4 disabled
Guns lost 13 (8 destroyed, 5 disabled)
Vehicles lost 7 (4 destroyed, 3 disabled)
Units retreated 2

Allied ground losses:
329 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 40 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
100th Chinese Corps
25th Group Army
14th Chinese Base Force

Defending units:
22nd Division
2nd Ind.Mixed Regiment






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(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 25
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/21/2015 12:11:21 AM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

December 14th, 1942

Crappers!

He's one of THESE types of players.


Here's an "attaboy" for 'im!




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(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 26
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/21/2015 12:24:26 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

December 14th, 1942

Crappers!

He's one of THESE types of players.


Here's an "attaboy" for 'im!



Yes, this is bringing back flashbacks. No it's not Nam and I wasn't on drugs. It's playing YOU. Clark Field keeps repeating in my mind. Ichang. Caught in move mode.

So much for a more "quiet" China.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 27
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/21/2015 4:16:47 AM   
JocMeister

 

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		That is a nice move by your opponent catching you off guard! In my experience though being aggressive in China as the Chinese never ends up well. So if he keeps it up be ready to exploit that.

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 28
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/21/2015 11:30:13 PM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		December 15th, 1942

Holy Hyper-Aggressiveness Batman!

Aren't I supposed to be the aggressor since I started this war? 2 Allied TFs within range of Truk. There's Zeroes and Netties in Truk but no Air HQ (1 day away). Still going to attack. Also, 3 SCTF in Truk (CA and CL) and I'm going to do a no guts no glory move and see if I can swamp one of these TFs.

Japanese starting airpower in this mod just sucks. Only 2 Sentai and one partial of zeroes an no airbases big enough to upgrade the Claudes. I pushed the partial Sentai of Zeroes (18) and 2 Sentai of Netties into Bangkok, but since nada is going on there, they are transferring.

Good to see my Naval Search is doing well. Showing 10 CVs between the two TFs. Didn't know US had that many at start of war




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(in reply to JocMeister)
Post #: 29
RE: Lessons Maybe Learned - Vicberg(J) v. Sniper(A) - D... - 8/22/2015 2:20:48 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 1176
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		A stroll in the Park

According to Nav Search, yet more CVs. Number is up to 12 CVs . Not sure if this is the Saratoga out of SD.






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