RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/19/2015 1:03:58 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

05 September 1943

I gave Kandavu a poke last turn. I've had dash-7 Wildcats keeping an eye on it. Their range is nice.

quote:

Morning Air attack on Kandavu Island , at 132,162

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 39 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 19

Allied aircraft
PV-1 Ventura x 12

No Japanese losses

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
AMc Kosan Maru, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Kyokei Maru, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Mogami Maru, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Tamazono Maru #2, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Kyoie Maru #3, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Naruo Maru #3, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Fuji Maru #11, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
AMc Hamanogo Maru, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk

Port hits 2

Aircraft Attacking:
12 x PV-1 Ventura bombing from 7000 feet *
Port Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
284 Ku S-1 with N1K1-J George (15 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(19 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
15 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 11 minutes

Massive explosion on AMc Kyoie Maru #3

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Kandavu Island , at 132,162

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 26 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 19

Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 12

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 5 damaged

Port hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
12 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 10000 feet *
Port Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
284 Ku S-1 with N1K1-J George (19 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
19 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 20000.
Raid is overhead

---------------------------------------------

Afternoon Air attack on Kandavu Island , at 132,162

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 7

Allied aircraft
PB4Y-1 Liberator x 10

No Japanese losses

No Allied losses

Port hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x PB4Y-1 Liberator bombing from 7000 feet *
Port Attack: 5 x 500 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
284 Ku S-1 with N1K1-J George (7 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(7 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
7 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 20000.
Raid is overhead

Recon indicated no airplanes, so these must have bled over from Suva. Fortunately, the PV-1s breezed through without getting caught. Recon indicated things like sub tenders and stuff there, but all I bagged were minesweepers.

Speaking of, I've wiped clean the night mine drop at Townsville. The one group of five did the job. I have five groups of five out now, just in case.

I've been hitting Port Moresby every two or three days, keeping the airfield at or near 100%. I haven't bothered with escorts, just letting Jugs and Lightnings sweep ahead of them, a squadron each. I'm guessing he's wary of LRCAPping there again.

I'm getting a convoy out every turn from Cape Town, shipping troops to Karachi. This will take awhile. Fleet carriers have been enroute for about a week now.

I've noticed Bezwada's been accumulating supply -- about 78,000 worth. I'm railing a bunch of base troops over there from the less supplied bases. B-24s and fighters for CAP are also relocating there.

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Post #: 1141

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/19/2015 11:21:21 AM

HansBolter

Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline

As long as his CAP is at 20k trying to ward off sweepers he has very little chance of getting any of your bombers coming in at 7k.

If he has no sweeper threat at that airfield then it is a mistake to have the CAP at 20k.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 8/19/2015 12:21:39 PM >

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Post #: 1142

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/20/2015 1:19:32 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

07 September 1943

More quietness.

I sent the bombers I have at Bezwada to Trincomalee last turn. Recon was indicating only about two dozen fighters there. It turns out there were more than that. I had four squadrons set to sweep, but of course the weather interfered and the bombers went in first, sweepers going in on the PM segment. I took a few losses and did relatively minor damage to the airfield.

Looking at the intel screen, his fighter losses were coming close to 50 while I lost less than 10 planes overall.

A new model of B-24 has come out this month and looks to be coming in decent quantities. (30-40 going on memory) This should help with the struggling bomber pool I've had for awhile now. A 20/25 squadron of P-51As are in Karachi, in from Aden. I'm looking forward to the long ranged Merlin version when they arrive. I'm trying to get all my air in India set up in some of the more well supplied central bases. When D-Day arrives, they'll surge to the closer spots to start a massive air campaign. I'll probably start a sweep campaign the week before things kick off.

Curiously, a night fighter variant of the F4U is out this month, but all the quantity numbers for production and replacement are zero. I guess I'm not getting any.

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Post #: 1143

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/20/2015 9:39:41 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

09 September 1943

Another day, another turn.

My fourth CVL arrived in Panama, now enroute to Cape Town. Cowpens. All my other carriers are enroute to Karachi.

Victorious departed Pearl Harbor a few days back after finishing her upgrade. Just enough time to get her to the states to withdraw. I could have used her.

A boatload of heavy bomber units are at Bezwada and Hyderabad. It'll hurt a bit when I cut them loose. Probably 20 squadrons worth, at least.

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Post #: 1144

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/21/2015 6:58:27 AM

Chijohnaok2

Posts: 628
Joined: 7/29/2002
From: Florida, USA (formerly Chicago)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: EHansen

I have been using Prince Rupert for supporting Alaska and the Aleutian Islands. I move a number of the Base Forces from the interior Canadian bases there to build it quite quickly.

+1 EHansen!

Mundy, I don't understand your conviction that large convoys will negate the need to use other ports.
For starters, Prince Rupert is a couple of days sailing closer to Aleutian bases which means less exposure to his subs
and raiders and faster turnaround of needed ships. You can get millions of tons of supply to PR just by moving Canada
Command there. It builds quite quickly using ALL the interior Canadian BFs, which have, initially, no aircraft to support anyway.

Using more ports also splits his sub patrols so he cannot saturate all the routes out of one port. At the beginning of the game
US ASW is so poor that it cannot inflict significant damage to sub concentrations while they can devastate Allied shipping and
nearly always get through to the most valuable ships (CV, AP, BB, TK).

That's my take on how the game works, but it's your game and I will be following to see how your strategy plays out!
Good Luck!

I am posting to this thread late, but I also support the use of 'alternate' ports.

In one of my human vs human games I built up Prince Rupert as my cargo/troop shipping base for Alaska and the Aleutians.
I set up San Diego as my port for troop transports moving from the West Coast to Pearl Harbor, Australia and the Pacific in general. This pushed my shipping lines further south and IMHO made it more difficult for my opponent to locate and attack them (this was far south for surface attacks and required longer transit times and lower patrol times for submarines). Los Angeles was used as the port for shipping supplies and fuel to the above mentioned areas. My opponent expected me to use SanFrancisco as the major port for shipping supplies and troops out, and to use Seattle as the port for troops and cargo for the North Pacific. He had about a half dozen to a dozen subs parked for over a month after the game start either outside San Francisco or along the SF-PH shipping route. He also had 3-4 subs around Seattle. He never thought to put any around Prince Rupert or Southern California.

< Message edited by chijohnaok -- 8/21/2015 8:00:38 AM >

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Post #: 1145

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/21/2015 11:46:13 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

Hey Chi! Welcome aboard.

To be honest, this has become a non-issue for me. Cannonfodder has pretty much zero going on as far as anti-commerce is concerned. It's been over a year since I've seen any sub near the US West Coast. It sort of ended when my blimp squadron in San Francisco beat up a couple of subs he had nearby. I noticed you can set blimps to anti-ship. That would be interesting to watch...

Pretty much the only sub activity I've seen from him is around Ceylon and southern India. He's backed off in the area west of Karachi after I've beaten a few up. My destroyers have gotten very good at dealing with them. Back in New Zealand, I hurt them badly there too.

Speaking of, I've been tracking Hornet's healing. sys is down to 45. I'm shooting for cutting her loose for Pearl when she reaches 25 or so. Any yes/no advice on this is welcome. Forgetting about subs, one did nail the wounded HMAS Australia one hex away from Sydney. She was one of the wounded ones making it back from New Zealand after that fiasco.

I'm running everything out of San Fran and Seattle. It depends on the game, 'cause sometimes I'll run stuff out of Los Angeles instead. I just choose randomly at the game start. When all my transports are together, it's just easier for me to dole out the right amount of shipping for the mission. I've since sent a lot of ships to Cape Town to try and keep India fed -- mostly xAKs. Not a lot of transports sit at anchor long at SF, as I keep them running quite a bit. I have plenty of ASW flights running the Seattle/Prince Rupert region. SF is also a default "send to" button on the bottom of the TF screen, which makes it easier to move new ships there with fewer clicks.

My Aleutians bases are pretty well fed, though I'm just reaching the point to stock up again. I have a big supply and engineer loaded TF headed to Shemya right now, just to get another base going. It's the island one hex E of Attu. I would love to build up Medny, but it's Russian. When we get deeper into 1945, I'll be looking at a move into the Kuriles from here. I need more LCUs to show up first. Most of my free ones are dedicated to the India op.

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Post #: 1146

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/21/2015 11:58:00 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

For my long range plans, I think I'll probably have to win this war in the west. Not really as glorious as the Nimitz plan.

Provided Ceylon goes well, I'll be looking at the Andaman Islands and Calcutta next. The former for shutting down Burmese oil. The latter to fix India's supply problems. I'm thinking of bypassing Burma and going straight to northern Malaya after that. If KB doesn't show, my carriers should be able to cover that. Taking Singapore would truly make the British relevant again. I guess the big question mark is how heavily has CF defended his interior, or are all the heavy infantry on the front.

I don't know what the threshold will be for KB to start moving in that direction. If they do, he can forget about keeping Baker Is, The Gilberts and the Marshalls. Maybe I'll get lucky and he'll split KB.

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Post #: 1147

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/21/2015 10:59:41 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

11 September 1943

More stuff.

Looking at reinforcements, CV Bunker Hill is due next turn. CVL Monterey will show up in 7 days. That will be it until the next CVL in 2.5 months and at least another fleet carrier in December. I can look forward to having four fleet carriers and 4 light carriers in Karachi in the next month or so.

It's been five days, so I'm massing a big raid on Port Moresby's airfield. Recon seems to fluctuate each turn on what the real damage actually is.

Another USA division is due in San Francisco within the next few weeks. I have enough for the Colombo expedition, so I'll make use of them if/when the central Pacific offensive starts. A new armored brigade arrived in Karachi from Aden, and they're going to Ceylon too.

I could use some intel on KB at this point. The IJN seems unusually disciplined right now.

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Post #: 1148

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/23/2015 12:51:49 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

13 September 1943

The AGC Blue Ridge arrived in Panama. Off to Cape Town with her. It just so happens I have an amphibious HQ sitting in San Francisco in strategic mode, so they're shipping off to Eastern USA and then Cape Town. One question: When the HQ is on an AGC in an amphib TF, they stay on board, right? I know they help smooth the unloading process, but I'm assuming they automatically stay on ship. Or do they need to be in a separate TF in the same hex?

I decided to hit Lae. I probably should have looked closer, as it looks like CF never really developed that base. I'm rather surprised at this, as it leaves Port Moresby pretty much hanging out on a limb, with the nearest help at Rabaul. Even Buna looks empty.

quote:

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 10 NM, estimated altitude 31,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
Boomerang C-12 x 16

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
16 x Boomerang C-12 sweeping at 30000 feet *

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 14 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Allied aircraft
Boomerang C-12 x 2

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x Boomerang C-12 sweeping at 30000 feet *

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 11 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 14
B-24D1 Liberator x 18
B-25D1 Mitchell x 15
B-25G Mitchell x 18

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 20
Airbase supply hits 20
Runway hits 66

Aircraft Attacking:
15 x B-25G Mitchell bombing from 8000 feet *
Airfield Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
12 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
15 x B-25D1 Mitchell bombing from 8000 feet *
Airfield Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-25G Mitchell bombing from 8000 feet *
Airfield Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 10 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D1 Liberator x 12

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 5
Airbase supply hits 6
Runway hits 18

Aircraft Attacking:
12 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 39 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D1 Liberator x 9

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 2
Runway hits 4

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 43 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D1 Liberator x 9

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 8

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 27 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-25G Mitchell x 9

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x B-25G Mitchell bombing from 8000 feet *
Airfield Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 43 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 8

No Allied losses

Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 4
Runway hits 6

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 25 NM, estimated altitude 38,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-38H Lightning x 3

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x P-38H Lightning sweeping at 35000 feet

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Lae , at 99,126

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 40,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-38H Lightning x 22

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
22 x P-38H Lightning sweeping at 35000 feet

My first group of carriers are on map and unsighted, heading for Karachi. I'll have 4 CVLs and 4 CVs. If this doesn't kick off by the first half of December, I can expect some more CVs to arrive.

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Post #: 1149

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/23/2015 3:10:52 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

Just catching up on your AAR Mundy. Couple of comments:

quote:

A new model of B-24 has come out this month and looks to be coming in decent quantities. (30-40 going on memory)

Be careful with that decent production. IIRC it only goes on for a very few months before being turned off.

quote:

Curiously, a night fighter variant of the F4U is out this month, but all the quantity numbers for production and replacement are zero. I guess I'm not getting any.

I think the 0 production for the NF might mean that some new air units which are still in the reinforcement queue are getting all the production. Can't explain your lack of success with sex though ...

quote:

I'm thinking of bypassing Burma and going straight to northern Malaya after that.

Malaya has a lot of air bases to which he can transfer in his Nells, Betties, Francis, etc. Your US carriers with Hellcats should be able to hold them off - while they are on station to support landings. I have little faith in the fighter force on the British CVs. However, carriers have to withdraw and a LB airfield is needed to continue the cover. The Andaman Islands can help until Malayan AFs are repaired/built up.

quote:

One question: When the HQ is on an AGC in an amphib TF, they stay on board, right? I know they help smooth the unloading process, but I'm assuming they automatically stay on ship. Or do they need to be in a separate TF in the same hex?

Right - the HQ stays on the ship and can extend its support one hex. It must be in a separate TF to avoid unloading. Make sure that is an Amphibious FORCE HQ on the AGC, not an Amphib Corps HQ (which is like any land corps HQ and must be landed to do its work).

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/23/2015 10:04:16 PM

Chijohnaok2

Posts: 628
Joined: 7/29/2002
From: Florida, USA (formerly Chicago)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy

Hey Chi! Welcome aboard.

[snip]

Speaking of, I've been tracking Hornet's healing. sys is down to 45. I'm shooting for cutting her loose for Pearl when she reaches 25 or so. Any yes/no advice on this is welcome.

[snip]

The comparison may not be exactly the same, but in my previous games, here is what I normally do with the large ships (BBs) that were damaged after the Dec. 7 Pearl Harbor strike: I keep them in repair/shipyard in PH until the sys/float/engine damage is down to about 20. At that point I send them under escort to the SanFrancisco and/or Mare Island shipyards to finish up repairs and to undergo their scheduled upgrades.
This frees up shipyard space at PH for repairs on more critical ships like CVs.

Not sure if that adds to anything that you might already be doing or be familiar with but I'm just adding my 2 cents.

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 12:30:34 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Right - the HQ stays on the ship and can extend its support one hex. It must be in a separate TF to avoid unloading. Make sure that is an Amphibious FORCE HQ on the AGC, not an Amphib Corps HQ (which is like any land corps HQ and must be landed to do its work).

BB, do you have any names for the Amphib Force? I went through the LCU list filtering on HQs as well as the upcoming reinforcements and can't seem to find any. The unit I'm moving is a corps.

quote:

ORIGINAL: chijohnaok

The comparison may not be exactly the same, but in my previous games, here is what I normally do with the large ships (BBs) that were damaged after the Dec. 7 Pearl Harbor strike: I keep them in repair/shipyard in PH until the sys/float/engine damage is down to about 20. At that point I send them under escort to the San Francisco and/or Mare Island shipyards to finish up repairs and to undergo their scheduled upgrades.
This frees up shipyard space at PH for repairs on more critical ships like CVs.

Not sure if that adds to anything that you might already be doing or be familiar with but I'm just adding my 2 cents.

Sounds good to me. I think all the flt is around 27 and all of that heavy. I have the PG Charleston enroute to Pearl with zero sys, but 50 flt, but she seems okay for now. I have lots of destroyers in NZ ready for escort work when the day comes. She's not going to Sydney, as his sub activity has picked up there and a wounded Australian CA died a hex away from port.

Speaking of subs, CF now has a north to south line of three of them sitting two hexes west of Karachi -- just in time for my first carriers to arrive. I'm circuiting them slightly south and then along the coast. I'm going full speed in and auto-disbanding once in. Though I think this doesn't occur until turn end. They're currently unspotted which is good. I don't think any of these are carrying Glens.

My first patrol frigate arrived at Mare Island a few days ago. I've also noticed that my USN AMs are arriving with hedgehog launchers on board, which pleases me. I haven't shot off one of those yet.

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 3:30:04 PM

witpqs

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Not sure about current Stock scenarios, but in Babes the Amphib Force HQs are USN (they are supposed to remain afloat and only help during unloading).

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Post #: 1153

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 4:34:25 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
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From: Neenah
Status: offline

It's possible if they're in transit between US and Cape Town, they may not show on the lists.

1943 is a new and alien thing to me. I haven't been able to play with this stuff before.

It seems the most thrilling thing in WITP is finally pulling the trigger on a long planned invasion. I can't wait to let this go, but I'll make sure everything's perfect before I do.

All my troop hauls to Karachi are packing lots of supply with them. I'm doing my best to get that un in India before this starts. If/when I take Colombo, I'm hoping a ton of supply will get captured, which would help things immensely.

Normandy's gonna look like a picnic after this. Timing's going to be big executing this.

After my first carriers make Karachi, I'll be forming the DDs into one or more ASW task forces. Purge the unclean. I've been sending lots of DEs to Cape Town as the arrive in Eastern USA. They'll probably make up separate ASW groups to cover the invasion.

My usual invasion doctrine, which as worked well for me in the past:

1) At least one BB and a few CAs in the invasion TF proper.
2) Bombardment TF to hit the turn of landing. Set to remain on station.
3) One or more ASW TF, preferably made up of DEs and/or Corvettes. Keep the true destroyers with the important stuff.
4) One or more Minesweeping TFs following invasion TF. Can probably help with ASW, as my new AMs have hedgehog.
5) CV task force will be adjacent hex to landing site. They'll be in the same hex up to this point. I can't remember if carrier ops are still penalized while in a base hex.
6) I'm torn with the CVEs. I'm not sure whether to put them in the Amphib TFs or keep them in their own separate ones. I don't want them messed up by any base hex penalty.

I don't know what he has for search assets on Ceylon. I haven't really been noticing sightings lately. Hopefully he's been lax and I can spring it on him at D-Day. I know for sure Bombay is unobserved as my test TF continues to show.

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 4:37:00 PM

Sangeli

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Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
Speaking of subs, CF now has a north to south line of three of them sitting two hexes west of Karachi -- just in time for my first carriers to arrive. I'm circuiting them slightly south and then along the coast. I'm going full speed in and auto-disbanding once in. Though I think this doesn't occur until turn end. They're currently unspotted which is good. I don't think any of these are carrying Glens.

Why exactly do you have to go into Karachi for this Ceylon OP? You can refuel at sea with AO and I know you don't need to rearm right now. Whatever you can do to avoid being detected.

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Post #: 1155

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 5:07:13 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

What, you mean invade straight from Cape Town? I don't know if four weeks on an amphib would do the troops any good. I thought disruption and fatigue take a hit on long amphib trips.

Bombay's my first choice, but I was worried about sightings. I may still rout it from there, as my SCTF there has never been sighted so far. I can load more supply from Karachi also, compared to Bombay.

I'll deal with the subs. My blimps there already took a couple shots and they're bound to get lucky.

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Post #: 1156

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 7:54:48 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

16 September 1943

Chipping away...

My group of four ML at Karachi went after one of the subs there.

quote:

ASW attack near Karachi at 38,7

Japanese Ships
SS I-23, hits 1

Allied Ships
ML No. 247
ML No. 303
ML No. 269

SS I-23 is sighted by escort
I-23 diving deep ....
ML No. 303 fails to find sub, continues to search...
ML No. 269 fails to find sub and abandons search
ML No. 303 attacking submerged sub ....
ML No. 303 fails to find sub, continues to search...
ML No. 303 fails to find sub, continues to search...
ML No. 303 fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

That was a real hit inflicted. A PBY claimed another, so if that holds up, I'm doing a good job with these. Next turn, I can get some destroyers from the CVTF to hunt down the last one. My carriers weren't spotted.

Speaking of, Coastwatchers indicated Zuikaku is parked at Koumac. Now I don't put a lot of stock in Coastwatcher sightings, but even if the particular ship is misidentified, it's possible another CV was sighted. Most likely that's where KB is holed up right now.

I've moved the 255th Armoured Tank Brigade to Jubbulpore. Intel indicated an IJA armored unit was prepping for there. Lots of Stuarts in this unit, so it should fend them off. I have plenty of infantry there already.

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Post #: 1157

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 8:04:23 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Right - the HQ stays on the ship and can extend its support one hex. It must be in a separate TF to avoid unloading. Make sure that is an Amphibious FORCE HQ on the AGC, not an Amphib Corps HQ (which is like any land corps HQ and must be landed to do its work).

BB, do you have any names for the Amphib Force? I went through the LCU list filtering on HQs as well as the upcoming reinforcements and can't seem to find any. The unit I'm moving is a corps.

From the Marianas Scenario they are V and III US Amphibious Force. Look for the wavy lined HQ symbol. The IIIrd does not show up until June 1944 while the Vth is there at Scenario Start in May 1944. I presume stock and other scenarios keep the same arrival dates. The AGC can be a normal AP until the Amphib Forces arrive.

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Post #: 1158

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 8:26:43 PM

Sangeli

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Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
What, you mean invade straight from Cape Town? I don't know if four weeks on an amphib would do the troops any good. I thought disruption and fatigue take a hit on long amphib trips.

Oh, you are talking about invasion forces. I see. I would agree with you here. I'm only just talking about the carriers. They can stay at sea for a while without issue and then meet up with the invasion fleet later.

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Post #: 1159

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 8:35:25 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

I would still have to be careful about that, as he hold's Diego Garcia and Attu. No idea if he's running search planes from these.

Karachi will suffice. I've been good at beating off subs lately.

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 9:03:39 PM

HansBolter

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From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Not sure about current Stock scenarios, but in Babes the Amphib Force HQs are USN (they are supposed to remain afloat and only help during unloading).

Pretty sure its called V Amphibious Force HQ and is commanded by Kelly Turner of course.

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Post #: 1161

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 9:34:24 PM

witpqs

Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Not sure about current Stock scenarios, but in Babes the Amphib Force HQs are USN (they are supposed to remain afloat and only help during unloading).

Pretty sure its called V Amphibious Force HQ and is commanded by Kelly Turner of course.

There are several of them as time goes on.

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Post #: 1162

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/24/2015 9:55:28 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

Thanks guys.

17 September 1943

Cannonfodder raids Bangalore.

quote:

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 31 NM, estimated altitude 38,800 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 32

Allied aircraft
P-40K Warhawk x 25
P-40N5 Warhawk x 21

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-40K Warhawk: 7 destroyed
P-40N5 Warhawk: 5 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *

CAP engaged:
23rd FG/75th FS with P-40N5 Warhawk (4 airborne, 9 on standby, 8 scrambling)
13 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters between 13000 and 27460.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 17 minutes
23rd FG/76th FS with P-40K Warhawk (5 airborne, 10 on standby, 10 scrambling)
15 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 15000 and 29580.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 21 minutes

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 12 NM, estimated altitude 36,514 feet.
Estimated time to target is 2 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-84a Frank x 37

Allied aircraft
P-40K Warhawk x 6
P-40N5 Warhawk x 5

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
P-40K Warhawk: 2 destroyed
P-40N5 Warhawk: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
36 x Ki-84a Frank sweeping at 31514 feet *

CAP engaged:
23rd FG/75th FS with P-40N5 Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters between 15000 and 35580.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 36 minutes
23rd FG/76th FS with P-40K Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 16288 and 37580.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 69 minutes

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 14 NM, estimated altitude 36,800 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 31

Allied aircraft
P-40N5 Warhawk x 1

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
P-40N5 Warhawk: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
31 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *

CAP engaged:
23rd FG/75th FS with P-40N5 Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters to 27460.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 31 minutes

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 179 NM, estimated altitude 36,800 feet.
Estimated time to target is 53 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 6

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *
3 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 153 NM, estimated altitude 37,514 feet.
Estimated time to target is 38 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-84a Frank x 4

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
4 x Ki-84a Frank sweeping at 31514 feet *

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 146 NM, estimated altitude 37,560 feet.
Estimated time to target is 36 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 40

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
40 x Ki-43-IIb Oscar sweeping at 32560 feet

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 104 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 32 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 42
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 90

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
Dakota III: 18 damaged
Dakota III: 4 destroyed on ground
B-24D1 Liberator: 15 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 2 destroyed on ground
C-47 Skytrain: 68 damaged
C-47 Skytrain: 4 destroyed on ground
B-24D Liberator: 66 damaged
B-24D Liberator: 2 destroyed on ground
Liberator GR.III: 16 damaged
B-17F Fortress: 23 damaged
B-17E Fortress: 42 damaged
B-17E Fortress: 3 destroyed on ground

Allied ground losses:
10 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 31
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 83

Aircraft Attacking:
27 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
27 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
36 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 79 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 24 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 30

Allied aircraft
no flights

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 10 damaged
Dakota III: 3 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 3 damaged
B-17F Fortress: 6 damaged
C-47 Skytrain: 13 damaged
C-47 Skytrain: 1 destroyed on ground
B-24D Liberator: 10 damaged
B-24D Liberator: 1 destroyed on ground

Allied ground losses:
10 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 4
Runway hits 7

Aircraft Attacking:
30 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb

Two squadrons of P-40Ns at medium altitude don't cut it. Bangalore's about the range limit of his Franks and Georges, so I've got everyone further north. Transports and fighters to Bombay, bombers to Bellary. I've raised the CAP altitude at the southern bases. I've also flipped a P-40 squadron to P-47s. Two short of 25, but it'll catch up. I have another squadron of P-38s at Karachi I'll move south when the last plane repairs next turn.

It'll be bloody when I kick the thing off.

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Post #: 1163

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 12:50:34 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

Meant to add...

2nd day in a row of Zuikaku sighting at Koumac. At this point I'm inclined to trust this report.

I figure at least part of KB is with her.

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Post #: 1164

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 1:18:55 AM

SqzMyLemon

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Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline

Looking forward to your Ceylon operation. Did you get the supply issue sorted out for your bases in Southern India?

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Post #: 1165

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 1:33:16 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

Not really. Some of them been going up, just because I dumped about 200k into Karachi. More's on the way.

I would like Cochin to go up, as they're minimal. They're on a major rail line, so I don't really get it.

< Message edited by Mundy -- 8/25/2015 2:33:32 AM >

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Post #: 1166

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 4:12:15 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy

Not really. Some of them been going up, just because I dumped about 200k into Karachi. More's on the way.

I would like Cochin to go up, as they're minimal. They're on a major rail line, so I don't really get it.

I think you may want to consider postponing your operation until you get the supply situation sorted out. The fact the Japanese were able to successfully attack your base from Ceylon is a also a bit concerning at this point. Because if you are unable to suppress the Japanese LBA they are likely to do a lot damage to your fleets even if the KB is elsewhere. Your current plan doesn't have any mention of using ships to suppress Japanese bases meaning you are relying on your LBA to do that. Well...can they? I think that's one of those things you need to actually accomplish before risking invasion assets. Because if you manage to shut down the Japanese AFs on Ceylon it likely will not be hard to keep them shut down indefinitely (and doing so well help drain Japanese supply).

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Post #: 1167

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 5:17:37 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

That's something I have to mull.

I have lots of heavy bombers in India. Probably close to 20 squadrons worth. I count 'em up next turn. I agree that once I can plaster his airfields, they'll most likely stay down. Port Moresby has been good practice at doing this lately. Latest recon indicates about 30 fighters at Trincomalee and over 100 at Colombo. I have Jugs, Lightnings and Corsairs in-country to help. I'll probably have F6Fs there also by then. P-51As are also present now also, along with A-36s. When the day comes, lots of paras will also hit that one inland base there.

Apart from CAP, I'm not sure how to utilize my naval air yet. Do I sweep for surface ships, or help suppress the airfields? At a minimum, I'll have 4 CVs and 4 CVLs for this, along with some CVEs. (3-4?). I'll probably have at least two SCTFs with the convoy, so maybe I shouldn't worry about the air aspect here. I tend to hate using naval air on land bases, as I always take heavy flak losses doing it. In my Japanese game, I lost a boatload of fighters just hitting Pearl.

I'm suspecting a lack of resources to be the problem with supply in India. I'm rolling in fuel in India, but resources... Last I looked, not much were being generated and I have no close location to ship a bunch in from the outside. I could probably round up a mega convoy from the states, but I'm looking at at least two months one-way. I'd need plenty too, as HI uses 10 per supply point generated. LI is at 15 per point. Cape Town, Aden and Abadan all have nil. I suppose all the resources were mined near Calcutta... I'd like to get a few million over.

I'm assuming December to be the utmost earliest for this, so I'm not rushing it. If I wait longer, more CVs and CVLs will be available, which is a bonus. I could probably almost take on KB at that point. A pity IronBabes couldn't help me out and give me the CVBs 18 months early. Victorious could almost be back by then -- maybe even Hornet too.

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Post #: 1168

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 6:18:33 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
I have lots of heavy bombers in India. Probably close to 20 squadrons worth. I count 'em up next turn. I agree that once I can plaster his airfields, they'll most likely stay down. Port Moresby has been good practice at doing this lately. Latest recon indicates about 30 fighters at Trincomalee and over 100 at Colombo. I have Jugs, Lightnings and Corsairs in-country to help. I'll probably have F6Fs there also by then. P-51As are also present now also, along with A-36s. When the day comes, lots of paras will also hit that one inland base there.

I'm not sure Port Moresby is a good measure of what you can do in Ceylon. The reason being that the Japanese can afford to let you shut down Port Moresby and still defend the base against invasion because there are plenty of Japanese bases in LBA range (Rabaul being the big monster) and the Allied bases are too far for effective LRCAP. My opponent doesn't defend the air space over Port Moresby either but I KNOW that if I tried to invade it would be a bloodbath. But if the Ceylon bases get shut down the Japanese have no other bases that can assist.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
Apart from CAP, I'm not sure how to utilize my naval air yet. Do I sweep for surface ships, or help suppress the airfields? At a minimum, I'll have 4 CVs and 4 CVLs for this, along with some CVEs. (3-4?). I'll probably have at least two SCTFs with the convoy, so maybe I shouldn't worry about the air aspect here. I tend to hate using naval air on land bases, as I always take heavy flak losses doing it. In my Japanese game, I lost a boatload of fighters just hitting Pearl.

I would refrain from AF attacks with naval air for this sort of invasion. Those bombers are just way too vulnerable to CAP. If it were me, I would range my CVs behind Ceylon interdicting anything that could cause problems for the invasion fleet. Just don't stay there long enough for the KB to get you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
I'm suspecting a lack of resources to be the problem with supply in India. I'm rolling in fuel in India, but resources... Last I looked, not much were being generated and I have no close location to ship a bunch in from the outside. I could probably round up a mega convoy from the states, but I'm looking at at least two months one-way. I'd need plenty too, as HI uses 10 per supply point generated. LI is at 15 per point. Cape Town, Aden and Abadan all have nil. I suppose all the resources were mined near Calcutta... I'd like to get a few million over.

Maybe lack of resources are an issue but as you say you only get 1 supply for every 10 or 15 points of resources shipped. Meanwhile you get 1 supply per 1 supply shipped. So you're better off just shipping supply.

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Post #: 1169

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 8/25/2015 8:11:44 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

18 September 1943

My subs are starting to pull their weight.

quote:

Sub attack near Bandjermasin at 60,102

Japanese Ships
TK Ayazono Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
SC CHa-34
PB Heiei Maru #7
SC CHa-41

Allied Ships
SS Grayling

SS Grayling launches 4 torpedoes at TK Ayazono Maru
Grayling bottoming out ....
PB Heiei Maru #7 fails to find sub and abandons search
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
SC CHa-41 fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

quote:

Sub attack near Singkep at 50,88

Japanese Ships
TK Shoun Maru, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
PB Showa Maru #5

Allied Ships
SS Herring

SS Herring launches 2 torpedoes at TK Shoun Maru
Herring bottoming out ....
PB Showa Maru #5 fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Showa Maru #5 fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Showa Maru #5 fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Showa Maru #5 fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Showa Maru #5 fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

Two laden tankers in a day. Pretty good. I've been averaging a transport or two per day as well. I have so many subs now, that I don't hesitate to throw them into the Java Sea anymore.

My new ASW group roughed up the third sub near Karachi.

quote:

ASW attack near Karachi at 38,10

Japanese Ships
SS I-162, hits 3

Allied Ships
DD DeHaven
DD Farenholt
DD Meredith

SS I-162 launches 4 torpedoes at DD DeHaven
I-162 diving deep ....
DD Farenholt fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Meredith attacking submerged sub ....
DD Meredith cannot establish contact with SS I-162
DD Meredith fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Meredith fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Meredith fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Meredith fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

These were all "soft" hits. I don't know what CF's damage threshold is for subs, so I'll try to beat them up some more.

Despite 100% damage at Port Moresby, a squadron's worth of fighters has showed up there. I'm hitting them with the sweep and bomb next turn.

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Post #: 1170

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