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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Uncommon Valor - Campaign for the South Pacific >> AV, SC and other PG

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AV, SC and other PG - 3/22/2003 1:37:14 AM

djoosten

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Ill continue the discussiong on this here cause went to much away now from the original BB discussion.

Ok so ill get these SC in large groups and get them expierence at sea. What is the mousetrap for ? I have no idea what this is ?

About the AV .. so now i know it gives support the floatplanes, what do i need to do with these exactly ? Can they cary them or do they run special supply to a forward base or do i just put them in the port where i have forward base patrol floatplanes?

Tx in advance for the tips :)

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Re: AV, SC and other PG - 3/22/2003 2:03:33 AM

Admiral DadMan

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[QUOTE]Originally posted by djoosten
[B]Ill continue the discussiong on this here cause went to much away now from the original BB discussion.

Ok so ill get these SC in large groups and get them expierence at sea. What is the mousetrap for ? I have no idea what this is ? [/B][/QUOTE]The "Mousetrap" is an ATW "Ahead Thrown Weapon" develovep by the Royal Navy and adopted by the USN. It was fired from the bow of an ASW capable vessel. It was used for depth bombing subs. A larger version, the "Hedgehog" was used by DD/DE type ships.

As opposed to a Depth Charge (fired from the stern), these projectiles would explode only on contact with an object. The further advantage was the the vessel did not have to break contact to use it.

[QUOTE]...About the AV .. so now i know it gives support the floatplanes, what do i need to do with these exactly ? Can they cary them or do they run special supply to a forward base or do i just put them in the port where i have forward base patrol floatplanes?

Tx in advance for the tips :) [/B][/QUOTE]AV class ships (both IJN and USN) must be docked in a TF or Anchored to provide seaplane support. IJN AV have their own aircraft as well, where as USN AV do not. Most players use AV to take the load off their Base Force crews, while some like to use them to set up advance seaplane bases.

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- 3/22/2003 2:13:10 AM

Feinder

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The mouse-trap fires depth-charges (for use against subs). Your SCs have a very limited range, but you've got a ton of them. First you have to get their exp around 55 for them to actually attack anything, so just get a TF of them together and sail them back and forth between two bases that are about 6 hexes apart. Or you can attach them to mundane convoys between Noumea and Luganville; however if you do this MAKE SURE you have other escorts with the convoy, as your SCs are still training and won't likely do anything.

Your SCs are expendable. Don't cry for too long if they die. Even if a IJN sub nails them, at least he wasted a torp on an SC (1vp) and not one of your transports (10vps + men/supplies).

For SCs that aren't on "short range" convoy duty, keep a couple of groups of SCs parked near your ports, so they run out to kill any sub contact that your patrols have spotted.

...

Regarding AVs.

Best to think of them as mobile air support points, for patrols ONLY. You can't launch from an AV like a carrier. To set up a sea-plane base, drop about 100 supplies on friendly base. It can have an airfield size of 0. You can even have your PBYs drop the supplies (it's faster, and doesn't risk the transport). Now sail your AV to base. After the AV has arrived, send over the PBY squadron, set up the volleyball net, and break out the booz.

You can also use them to "save" air-support points of your base-force units at major airfields. If you have PBYs at Port Moresby, send an AV there. The support points to handle the PBYs will be provided by the AV, meaning that the mechanics from the baseforce will be able ot handle an additional 12 planes (the number of planes in the PBY squadron). Be advised tho, that the AV only provides support points for Patrol and Float type aircraft (so your Seagulls and Kingfishers could feed off the AV if you chose to strip them from your cruisers). The AV however contributes NO support towards Fighters, Bombers, etc.

-F-

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- 3/22/2003 2:25:44 AM

crsutton

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In skilled hands they were nasty. Because they fired in front of the ship vs depth charges that were dropped behind, it was much more difficult for a sub to take evasive action. Not that the sub could not turn away but the SC or DD did not necessarily lose sonar contact and could adjust fire accordingly. With rear thrown DC as the PC or DD passed near and over the sub, sonar contact was lost due to the sound of the attacking ships own engine noise and the shock waves from the ship passing through the water. This gave the sub commander the chance to jink at the last minute with the attacking surface ship commander having to guess as to which way the sub would turn. DC were bigger and carried more punch, but the mousetrap and hedgehogs spread over a large area and exploded on contact.

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- 3/22/2003 2:36:36 AM

djoosten

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Thank you all for just teaching me something i didn't know yet in this game! Im surely going to get better results now that i know how to use these ships !

S!

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- 3/22/2003 3:31:34 AM

Mr.Frag

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Keep in mind as you think about patrol aircraft that not all patrol aircraft are created equal.

Japan gets: Mavis = 1070 miles, Emily = 1480 miles.

Allies get: PBY = 720 miles, some light recon planes.

As you can well imagine, Japan can see Allied movements long before the Allies can see what Japan is up to.

With the wonderful addition of recon information of whats located in ports in patch 2.30, these long ranged assets of Japan can be used to pinpoint Allied force disposition which is something the Allies really can not do without being in a forward (hostile) area.

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- 3/22/2003 4:05:31 AM

djoosten

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When i put the PBY for example in Lunga, are they located on the AF or in the port when i put a AV inhere?

Also how many planes can one AV support, is there anywhere i could find this information?

tx.

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- 3/22/2003 5:03:35 AM

Mr.Frag

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If you bring up the base status screen, you will see the Aviation Support Value.

It will show # + #. This second # is the amount of seaplane support provided. The first number is support provided by any base units.

Allied AV's provide capacity + 18

Japan AV's/CS's provide capacity + 10

This applies against Floatplanes, Float-Fighter and Patrol.

In order to provide this support, SYS damage must be less then 50 and have no current fire/floatation damage.

I have never personally seen aircraft used this way subject to an attack, so I cannot comment on whether an airbase attack would damage them or not while at a size 0 base.

Remember that even though the AV/CS provides the aviation support staff required, you still need supplies at the base itself.

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- 3/22/2003 12:27:04 PM

Feinder

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It's actually very unlikely that you'd damage the PBYs at the base with a bombing attack, simply because the PBYs should be gone all day on patrol even in foul weather. It's just like your planes on CAP won't be taking damage from the BOMBS of the bombers, they're in the air. I suppose you might be able to kill a few a night, but your opponent would have to be pretty stupid to waste bombing a sea-plane at base at night, just to try to kill PBYs.

You should probably bring a pair of SCs with you tho. It doesn't take very long for your opponent to figure out that you've got a base there, and he sends subs after you. Obviously, if you spot a surface TF coming your way, it's time to get the he11 out of Dodge.

-F-

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- 3/23/2003 7:19:55 AM

timtom

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AV's are Fast Transport capable, meaning among other things that they can carry supplies forward and setup a seaplane base on their own. This is highly advisable as most forward seaplane bases will be at locations without harbour facilities. An AP or AK would take forever to unload here. Use USN AV's to support major operations. Fx, if operating against Guadalcanal, push your AV as far forward as you dare, carrying supplies. Then move in a Catalina sqn. This allows you to extend the searchrange of your PBY's by many hundreds of miles compared to Espiritu Santu, not least to the north of the Solomons, which is the most direct approach route of IJN TF's coming down from Truk. Pull back the AV along with your other supporting TF's. In general, against a human opponent, don't let the AV sit around too long unprotected, or it'll draw a sub or a couple of fast DD's (unless of course your hoping to). The AI doesn't seem to care. IJN AV's and CS's carry their own seaplanes and are much more flexible, usable for ASW, recon, and even against enemy shipping.

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- 3/24/2003 2:21:51 AM

crsutton

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Yes, now the Japanese have a spotting advantage over the Allies due to the range of their Mavis and Emily's. Usually, the Japanese can gain more knowledge of American dispositions than the Allies.

However, historically this was not the case. Due to the great skill of the Allies in intercepting and interpreting Japanese radio traffic, the Allies had a good notion of where the bulk of the Japanese capital ships were at any given time. There was also Ultra breaks as well but the Japanese navy was a pretty good at changing thier codes with regularity, leaving gaps in Ultra intel.

On the other hand the Japanese, were quite often caught by surprise by American force disposition. I don't think Emilys and Mavis patrols actually flew that close to American ports for recon purposes. Radar really prevented that. So in game terms we actually have the opposite of what really happened with the Japanese player frequently knowing more about American ports than the Americans knew about Japanese ports.

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