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PT Boats - 10/10/2015 3:20:09 PM   
Mudmag99

 

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Status: offline 		How do I move my PT Boats from Pearl to somewhere useful? Or are they stuck?
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RE: PT Boats - 10/10/2015 3:27:44 PM   
OPilot

 

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Status: offline 		Send them back to the pool at PH. Then, for a supply expense you can buy them back at another port. The port needs to have at least 20K supply if my memory serves me correctly. This mechanism takes the place of loading them on ships to transport them to another port. Historically, some where towed but that was for short distances.

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RE: PT Boats - 10/10/2015 4:27:07 PM   
crsutton


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Status: offline 		Or, if need be you can put them in and "escort" Task force with a big freighter. The trip will be slow as they will need to refuel often but they can go a long distance that way. If you return them to the pool you lose them for 30 days. Not the end of the world but in 1942 your PTs are pretty scarce and you might not have this luxury. To build them at a port you need to have the required size and supply and it has to be an American owned port. You can't build PTs at Sidney or Colombo for example. If you are fighting in the Indian Ocean it is a good idea to have American forces capture at least one port for this very reason.

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RE: PT Boats - 10/10/2015 7:36:32 PM   
rustysi


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quote:

If you are fighting in the Indian Ocean it is a good idea to have American forces capture at least one port for this very reason.


I've never tried it and correct me if I'm wrong here, but can't they be created from a loaded AK or something?

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RE: PT Boats - 10/11/2015 2:50:21 PM   
Alfred

 

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Status: offline 		PT boats can be built in Sydney.  Under certain circumstances they could be built in Colombo too.

I set out the conditions in November 2011.  This thread provides an opportunity for me to set out in greater detail how PT boats, and the other types listed on page 108 of the manual, can be created using supply.

1.  There must be PT boats in the pool.  Surplus PT boats can be sent back to the pool and after a delay will be come available for reassignment on map.

2.  They can be created at an Australian or American port which meets the following criteria:

  • port is size 1
  • port has 10k supply points

For each PT boat created, 50 supply points are expended from the local port supplies.  Up to 12 PT boats (subject to there being sufficient supply) will be created in each batch.

3.  They can be created from the supply carried by a Transport Task Force if the following criteria is met:

  • the Transport TF loaded it's supply at the National Home Base (San Francisco for an American transport TF, Sydney for an Australian transport TF)
  • only ships in the transport TF with a cargo capacity of 1000 or more are candidates to generate PT boats
  • candidate ships must still have a minimum of 50 or more supply points not yet unloaded to generate a PT boat
  • the transport TF is located at an on map base which is not the same base where the supply was taken on board

Accordingly, an American Transport TF which loads supply at San Francisco on to two xAK with a cargo capacity of 8420 each, could sail to Auckland where it unloads 8200 supply points at Auckland from each merchantman, have its unloading stopped at that point and provided sufficient PT boats are in the pool, create a total of 8 PT boats (4 from each merchantman) and then unload the remaining 40 supply points.

It is usually much easier to create PT boats under method 2.

Alfred 

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RE: PT Boats - 10/11/2015 3:31:23 PM   
btd64


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Status: offline 		Thanks for reposting that info Alfred.. Not a bad idea to have some fuel at the port either, to fuel up the PT's after they are built....GP

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RE: PT Boats - 10/12/2015 3:38:14 PM   
HansBolter


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quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Thanks for reposting that info Alfred.. Not a bad idea to have some fuel at the port either, to fuel up the PT's after they are built....GP


And is you want them to be more than one shot wonders you will need infrastructure to replenish torpedoes.


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RE: PT Boats - 8/19/2016 10:59:38 AM   
Leandros


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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter


quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Thanks for reposting that info Alfred.. Not a bad idea to have some fuel at the port either, to fuel up the PT's after they are built....GP


And is you want them to be more than one shot wonders you will need infrastructure to replenish torpedoes.



A tender, perhaps. The question now is how to get a little port in the Andamans or Malacca Strait turned
into a US or Australian base...A landing of troops, would that suffice...?

Fred


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River Wide, Ocean Deep - a book on Operation Sea Lion - www.fredleander.com
Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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RE: PT Boats - 8/19/2016 11:31:51 AM   
Sardaukar


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Status: offline 		You can attach PT boats to TF with AK or 2, they'd refuel from ships on the way...so one can that way transfer them long way. Of course, you need PT boat tender to resupply torpedoes anyways.

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RE: PT Boats - 8/19/2016 12:22:51 PM   
Leandros


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

You can attach PT boats to TF with AK or 2, they'd refuel from ships on the way...so one can that way transfer them long way. Of course, you need PT boat tender to resupply torpedoes anyways.


Thank you, S - I have done that with other "small" vessels from the US to the Pacific but the PT's are so
short-ranged that I have looked for a more elegant way. It seems I have got the various solutions now.

Tks all for the help!

Fred


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Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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RE: PT Boats - 9/18/2016 8:21:16 PM   
Yaab


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Status: offline 		Weel, there should be a penalty in the code for PTs and other craft travelling alongside big ships. Every once in a while, a PT should sink in the open seas due to rough seas or something.

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Post #: 11
RE: PT Boats - 9/18/2016 8:58:08 PM   
RagingKrikkit

 

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Status: offline 		The slow pace would probably be considered penalty enough by some, and IIRC, PTs tend to rack up sys damage quickly when on the move.

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RE: PT Boats - 9/18/2016 11:26:44 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leandros


quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter


quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Thanks for reposting that info Alfred.. Not a bad idea to have some fuel at the port either, to fuel up the PT's after they are built....GP


And is you want them to be more than one shot wonders you will need infrastructure to replenish torpedoes.



A tender, perhaps. The question now is how to get a little port in the Andamans or Malacca Strait turned
into a US or Australian base...A landing of troops, would that suffice...?

Fred


Assuming you are talking about bases already owned by the Allies and with no troops at the time of landing the US or Australian ones? NOPE - the ownership of the base does not change unless you conquer it from the enemy or buy it with PP.

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RE: PT Boats - 9/19/2016 1:55:06 PM   
Leandros


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Weel, there should be a penalty in the code for PTs and other craft travelling alongside big ships. Every once in a while, a PT should sink in the open seas due to rough seas or something.


I believe there were instances when they were towed.

Fred


_____________________________

River Wide, Ocean Deep - a book on Operation Sea Lion - www.fredleander.com
Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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RE: PT Boats - 9/19/2016 2:25:37 PM   
Trugrit


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They were moved on cargo ships.

In the game you should be able to load them like aircraft onto cargo ships but you can't.
Some stuff was abstracted into the game.






Attachment (1)

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Post #: 15
RE: PT Boats - 9/19/2016 4:00:22 PM   
Leandros


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Nice photo! I believe a large tanker destined for the Philippines was in PH on December 7th with 8 PT's on her decks. As with much other stuff this shipment was halted, too.

Fred

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River Wide, Ocean Deep - a book on Operation Sea Lion - www.fredleander.com
Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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Post #: 16
RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 1:55:41 AM   
wdolson

 

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Status: offline 		PT Boats as well as landing craft to be used at forward bases were routinely strapped to the decks of ships. A boat is a water vessel that can be carried by a ship (though submarines are referred to as "boats" too even though some are very large. PT boats were called boats because they were boats.

The game engine can't handle a naval vessel carried on another naval vessel. Don Bowen worked a long time trying to make it happen, but the changes required were just too messy and involved, so midget subs are only pseudo carried with their mother boat and small boat vessels like PTs and landing craft are handled indirectly by being created out of stock on site, or traveling with another ship in a TF to get from one point to another.

Bill

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RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 3:23:14 AM   
geofflambert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson

A boat is a water vessel that can be carried by a ship (though submarines are referred to as "boats" too even though some are very large. PT boats were called boats because they were boats.

.

Bill



Bill, you are supposed to be the moderator here. We do not sink to name calling in this forum.

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RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 7:38:23 AM   
Chris21wen

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert


quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson

A boat is a water vessel that can be carried by a ship (though submarines are referred to as "boats" too even though some are very large. PT boats were called boats because they were boats.

.

Bill



Bill, you are supposed to be the moderator here. We do not sink to name calling in this forum.


A boat's a boat. Now if you called a ship a boat, well that's name calling. That could be construed as shipish so I suppose the opposite could also be true but if I was a boat and got called a ship I'd be pleased.

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RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 8:39:04 AM   
Leandros


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson

PT Boats as well as landing craft to be used at forward bases were routinely strapped to the decks of ships. A boa
t is a water vessel that can be carried by a ship (though submarines are referred to as "boats" too even though some
are very large. PT boats were called boats because they were boats.

Hi, Bill - I've never seen that description before. In my book a boat is a "ship" not longer than 12.5 meters. Longer
than that is "ship". Both categories are "vessels" if you stretch it a little. I believe there is a tonnage restriction
involved in those definitions, too. Is it 20 tons?

quote:

The game engine can't handle a naval vessel carried on another naval vessel. Don Bowen worked a long time
trying to make it happen, but the changes required were just too messy and involved, so midget subs are only pseudo
carried with their mother boat and small boat vessels like PTs and landing craft are handled indirectly by being
created out of stock on site, or traveling with another ship in a TF to get from one point to another.

Bill

Which works admirably except one cannot drop a PT squadron in an allied's port. Isn't that so?

Fred


< Message edited by Leandros -- 9/20/2016 8:40:55 AM >

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River Wide, Ocean Deep - a book on Operation Sea Lion - www.fredleander.com
Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 4:28:51 PM   
BBfanboy


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Joined: 8/4/2010
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Status: offline 		I think PT boats weighed in at around 75-80 tons. They were also much longer than 12.5 meters.

PS - In case it helps with figuring out what the game designers called a ship vs a boat, the smallest ship I was able to find was a Japanese xAKL at 170 tons.


< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 9/20/2016 4:31:40 PM >

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RE: PT Boats - 9/20/2016 5:30:01 PM   
Yaab


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Status: offline 		Also, vessels weighing up to 100-tonnes can sail past reef hexsides.

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RE: PT Boats - 9/21/2016 11:14:07 AM   
Leandros


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I think PT boats weighed in at around 75-80 tons. They were also much longer than 12.5 meters.

PS - In case it helps with figuring out what the game designers called a ship vs a boat, the smallest ship I was able to find was a Japanese xAKL at 170 tons.



Yes, I know - and this I believe stems more from the way vessel types are "named", rather than their correct (formal)
naval description. MTB and MGB are others. It's not really important in this context.

As an example, my 27-meter former minesweeper is formally a "ship" in the ship's register.

Fred


< Message edited by Leandros -- 9/21/2016 11:16:04 AM >

_____________________________

River Wide, Ocean Deep - a book on Operation Sea Lion - www.fredleander.com
Saving MacArthur - a book series on how The Philippines were saved - in 1942! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D34QCWQ/?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref=series_rw_dp_labf

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Post #: 23
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