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RE: WitE 2 - 2/22/2016 6:16:51 PM

RedLancer

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Have you looked at the Battles listed in the Commander's Report?

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Post #: 361

RE: WitE 2 - 2/22/2016 6:18:27 PM

821Bobo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: uw06670

If not a true "replay" then a summary that is easier to digest than clicking on each of the battle sites to see what happened. Perhaps a list of battles where units Retreated, Routed, Shattered would be useful. If there is already something like this then I haven't seen it so far.

Its already in. In Commander's Report is a tab Battles.

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Post #: 362

RE: WitE 2 - 2/22/2016 7:26:23 PM

uw06670

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Thanks guys. I love putting my ignorance on display.

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Post #: 363

RE: WitE 2 - 2/23/2016 12:36:02 PM

swkuh

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KUDOS for asking what I should know, but too dumb to ask.

< Message edited by rrbill -- 2/23/2016 12:46:19 PM >

(in reply to uw06670)

Post #: 364

RE: WitE 2 - 2/24/2016 5:06:13 AM

shermanny

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I agree. I've not played but one H2H game and that one went very well for the Allies, but my sense is that a careful German will simply avoid serious fighting in
France, backpedaling to the Meuse, and thus while away June, July, and most of August. By the time the serious fighting begins, time is short for the Allies and the
weather is beginning to turn, and there's just no way with the combat engine as it is for the Allies to make real headway. Or maybe there's some way to bring in all
the bombers and break that deadlock? But I mean while playing largely within historical parameters.

The counter to this observation might be that history suggests that's exactly how it would have been had the Germans adapted that strategy. But the historical Allies
managed to make headway even in bad weather and even at unimpressive paper odds. The game engine simply doesn't adequately model the engineering and artillery
assets the Allies were able to bring to the fight.

Neither does it model the kinds of fluidity that can occur when somebody does mount a concentrated attack. The Germans can hardly get two hexes deep into the Allied line
in the Bulge scenario, for instance.

The key to all this might be to make the combat results table bloodier, especially for whoever draws the short straw when it comes to artillery and air support.
Mostly that would be the Germans...

Monty estimated that during the grind in Normandy, the Germans were losing 3 for 1. That was probably pretty accurate, and the German lines were getting threadbare
as a result. Later on it was more equal for a while, as air power's effects faded with the arrival of bad weather. But even then, the Germans were getting ground down and
pushed back.

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Post #: 365

RE: WitE 2 - 2/24/2016 5:20:49 AM

shermanny

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Unless the combat results table is bloodier, the game will tend to deadlock. Now there's a balancing act here. Combat in which at least one side has fresh, well supplied, well supported troops and the weather is conducive to ground operations---that should be bloody for the loser and maybe for the winner if the defender had good positions to start with and anything like enough men to make a fight of it.

Once supply tails off, the fighting can become anemic. You can't shoot somebody if you don't have any more bullets.

(in reply to HMSWarspite)

Post #: 366

RE: WitE 2 - 2/24/2016 6:51:57 AM

loki100

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I'm sorry but I have seen Allied players in WiTW make substantial gains. The key is to keep your CV very high in a few selected formations and you do that by managing all the tools in the supply system. This is not just about setting HQ supply priority but also about how you construct your depot network. Add in, sometimes waiting for a turn is a good idea (ie let supplies build up) and pulling units off the line and back to the rear can make a huge difference.

Also the Western Front did gridlock a few times, not least from November 44 to March 45?

In WiTW its rarely a good idea to attack 'just because you can', best to wait till you have the optimal supply situation (with this balanced against the need to make progress)

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Post #: 367

RE: WitE 2 - 2/24/2016 3:19:44 PM

swkuh

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KUDOS, Loki100: "rarely a good idea to attack 'just because you can'"

Memo to General Staff: change methods immediately.

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Post #: 368

RE: WitE 2 - 3/1/2016 10:04:42 AM

sh0nyu

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From: Germany
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Hello John,

the idea of "increased MP" is a good one - we had a very interesting AAR in the german Forums, but using DC:CB.
You figured one very good Situation with "staff members". What about command structure? The OKH/AG commander gives strategic Targets and the army commanders have to reach them.
We had the problem that just one player was able to manage the counters. So in this special case the Army commander executed the orders of his Corps commanders which is the "wrong" way.

It will be very special and I think your way to seperate the staff branches may be easier to handle ;)

(in reply to RedLancer)

Post #: 369

RE: WitE 2 - 3/1/2016 2:53:51 PM

verdugo94

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When could we expect the game to come? This year? 2 or 3 years?

Thanks

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Post #: 370

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 11:42:43 AM

RedLancer

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I'll try and answer most things but never questions on time and money.

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Post #: 371

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 1:53:50 PM

verdugo94

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Excuse me then Red Lancer

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Post #: 372

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 7:16:16 PM

uw06670

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Two feature requests, UI/UX related. Maybe you'll tell me they already exist and I just don't know where to find them...

1) When in Air Recon mode, please show me the hexes which I have already conducted Air Recon missions in. Currently I end up going back and forth between F11 and F5 to do this, which is annoying.

2) Be nice to have a Range Tool to aid AB deployment and Air Attack planning. I'd like to be able to go into 'range tool' mode and select a hex. then as I move the mouse around it shows me the actual # of hexes from selected hex to the currently mouse hovered hex. It could look like the movement path mode but instead of MPs left it shows actual air range (no MPs). An enhanced version of this tool would show me the range of the a/c in a selected AB so I can see easily if they are out of range for escort or bombing.

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Post #: 373

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 7:34:21 PM

RedLancer

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Mark

Do you have WitW? I guess from your requests you don't. If you do, I apologise, but without knowing the answer I can't reply effectively.

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WitE & WitW Dev

(in reply to uw06670)

Post #: 374

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 8:01:23 PM

uw06670

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No I haven't played WitW. Does it have these features or similar?

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Post #: 375

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 10:02:08 PM

RedLancer

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WitW (from which WitE2 is being developed) has a hugely more developed air system. The air system runs as WEGO before the ground phase for most missions apart from ground support.

You don't order missions you set air directives - for example recon this area using these squadrons on these days and look for the following targets. The system then calculates and runs the missions to deliver your directive. When you set up air directives the system advises you if aircraft are not in range.

So although you won't get what you request - you don't need it anyway. More detail here: http://www.matrixgames.com/amazon/PDF/MG_WitW_Materials_Manual_Handbook_Ebook.pdf

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WitE & WitW Dev

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Post #: 376

RE: WitE 2 - 3/2/2016 11:15:45 PM

uw06670

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thanks

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Post #: 377

RE: WitE 2 - 3/5/2016 9:39:02 AM

robinsa

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For WITE 2 I would like to request a system where users easily can extract the own sides data from the game to use for analysis.

I would also request that there was an easier way to look at specific armies to see how they are doing one by one compared to the current combat report where you get huge reports without any really good filters.

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Post #: 378

RE: WitE 2 - 3/5/2016 4:27:15 PM

Tejszd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Lancer

WitW (from which WitE2 is being developed) has a hugely more developed air system. The air system runs as WEGO before the ground phase for most missions apart from ground support.

It seems a bit odd to have mixed turn and WEGO in one game but must admit I haven't tried WitW as I'm more interested in the East Front.

Any chance/plan to make WEGO available as an option for land units?

I played the V for Victory and the World at War games years ago which used WEGO and found them to be very good! Love how both sides plan their moves at the same time, speeding play by mail games, and the surprises as both sides try anticipate what the other will do....

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Post #: 379

RE: WitE 2 - 3/5/2016 6:08:41 PM

RedLancer

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No - IGOUGO is at the heart of the design philosophy that underpins this current string of games.

If you want WEGO, and assuming you are not already very rich, then my advice is to win the lottery and pay morvael to develop a game from scratch. That is my plan - unfortunately despite my best efforts I never seem to buy quite the right ticket.

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WitE & WitW Dev

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Post #: 380

RE: WitE 2 - 3/5/2016 7:06:21 PM

morvael

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This is 100% truth. Not a joke.

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RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 12:50:34 AM

drkarl143

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Hey guys,

im sorry to post into the wrong thread but since my other two posts have been ignored for hte last few days ill post it in here anyway.
I am playing the 1941-bitter end campaign (v1.08.07) as the Axis. This is my 3rd playthrough and right now im in turn 8. Since i progressed much better than the last two times i had the feeling that there were too few enemy units. So i turned off fog of war just to check and i noticed that there were 0 units in the rear areas of the enemy territory. Also the Soviets have 500! administration points available. Is this a bug? If so, should i start a new campaign or is there a fix for this problem?

Thank you,

drkarl143

(in reply to morvael)

Post #: 382

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 9:37:43 AM

sillyflower

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What I want from WiTE 2 is a game as opposed to the management/spreadsheet exercise that WiTW is. WiTW's tedious air + logistic systems put me right off playing a 2nd game of that.

I know the saying that amateurs study tactics, but professionals study logistics. Problem is that I'm an amateur gamer who plays to have fun, not a professional logistics expert or dedicated exploit finder/user and I want to stay that way. Fine to have a complex system if you must, but it needs to be kept under the hood IMHO, and ideally exploit-free although that seem to much to ask for with a complex system. Nor am I interested in planning which squadrons fly which type of missions on which days, especially as I can't then decide their targets below a level of 'bomb random enemy units in Belgium' or similar. It's not what the the commander of several million troops should be doing.

Some may well argue that the WiTW systems are more 'realistic'. They may well be correct - and I'm in no position to disagree. I just don't care. Historic wargames are always fundamentally unrealistic because the players know what happened in real life. Both player know why the battle/war was won or lost and will do their best avoid making the same key mistakes.

WiTE is the best computer game I know. I love the madness of having umpteen versions of the Mk III panzer represented and the way that the combat system treats almost every shot fired as an event to be calculated separately, but because these are things I can ignore because I (rightly) cannot influence.

If 'inappropriate' fiddling/micromanagement is to be allowed, why not allow it for something interesting like altering unit TOEs?

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RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 12:43:05 PM

Kharkov

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Totally agree with sillyFlower, make the game interesting and fun for us amateur players. Cater for both types of gamer, those that want a handsoff approach to the detail and those that enjoy looking at speadsheets for 6 hours planning a turn.

I still think allowing users to command a subset of units whilst allowing the AI to control remaining forces is a feasible approach to this issue (e.g. allow me to play only Army Group North in Grand Campaign whilst AI control rest of the German forces)

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Post #: 384

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 1:48:53 PM

SigUp

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

What I want from WiTE 2 is a game as opposed to the management/spreadsheet exercise that WiTW is. WiTW's tedious air + logistic systems put me right off playing a 2nd game of that

I think you are overdramatising. The air system of WitW is no more tedious in my eyes. If I want to bomb three units in three adjacent hexes two times per unit for example I have to manually select the staging base, the target units, the air units to participate in the attack plus the launch button six times in WitE. In the WitW system I select the one target unit, extend the box by one hex, select the units to participate and the number of attacks and that was it. Frankly, I think the WitE system of bombing specific units and hexes is more inconvenient. The air game in WitW doesn't take long at all and then you factor in that on the Eastern Front you don't have strategic bombing... The air system will do great in WitE2.

And I don't get the complaint about the logistics system. The logistics system of WitE is one of its biggest problems. Why can the Germans run rampant throughout Russia where one bad mistake costs you the game? Because the of logistics. Why can the Soviets from 1943 onwards snowball west if the German player screws up once? Because of logistics. Implement halfway decent logistical constraints - and the WitW system does that quite well - and the game experience will improve tremendously. The game will give you more chances to recover from mistakes as logistical constraints will slow down operation tempo.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kharkov

I still think allowing users to command a subset of units whilst allowing the AI to control remaining forces is a feasible approach to this issue (e.g. allow me to play only Army Group North in Grand Campaign whilst AI control rest of the German forces)

Looking at how the AI is doing things I don't think you get your desired result. The AI gives a damn about efficient command&control for example, just mixing all over the place. It's one reason why you need to give it significant bonuses. Have one part on human control and you'll notice the game getting out of balance rather fast with the AI just not being able to keep up with what you are doing. Also, the AI is cheating to a certain degree.

< Message edited by SigUp -- 3/7/2016 1:49:24 PM >

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Post #: 385

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 3:29:05 PM

sillyflower

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Sigup:

It may just be a matter of personal taste but my views are as they are and they are not unique to me. I agree about the WiTE logistics system and the need to improve, but I do not want to spend my gaming time faffing with supply dumps. I want to eat my cake without having to cook it first.

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RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 5:12:34 PM

Peltonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

Sigup:

It may just be a matter of personal taste but my views are as they are and they are not unique to me. I agree about the WiTE logistics system and the need to improve, but I do not want to spend my gaming time faffing with supply dumps. I want to eat my cake without having to cook it first.

Speaking of exploits Silly check this out, not going to take long to get to
Berlin when Infantry divisions have 47 MP's or Moscow for that matter.

to be honest I really just started screwing around with "things"

and found this as can be seen by time stamp.

Now got to figure out which switch or bug I tripped,

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 387

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 5:18:33 PM

robinsa

Posts: 183
Joined: 7/24/2013
From: North Carolina
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

What I want from WiTE 2 is a game as opposed to the management/spreadsheet exercise that WiTW is. WiTW's tedious air + logistic systems put me right off playing a 2nd game of that

I think you are overdramatising. The air system of WitW is no more tedious in my eyes. If I want to bomb three units in three adjacent hexes two times per unit for example I have to manually select the staging base, the target units, the air units to participate in the attack plus the launch button six times in WitE. In the WitW system I select the one target unit, extend the box by one hex, select the units to participate and the number of attacks and that was it. Frankly, I think the WitE system of bombing specific units and hexes is more inconvenient. The air game in WitW doesn't take long at all and then you factor in that on the Eastern Front you don't have strategic bombing... The air system will do great in WitE2.

And I don't get the complaint about the logistics system. The logistics system of WitE is one of its biggest problems. Why can the Germans run rampant throughout Russia where one bad mistake costs you the game? Because the of logistics. Why can the Soviets from 1943 onwards snowball west if the German player screws up once? Because of logistics. Implement halfway decent logistical constraints - and the WitW system does that quite well - and the game experience will improve tremendously. The game will give you more chances to recover from mistakes as logistical constraints will slow down operation tempo.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kharkov

I still think allowing users to command a subset of units whilst allowing the AI to control remaining forces is a feasible approach to this issue (e.g. allow me to play only Army Group North in Grand Campaign whilst AI control rest of the German forces)

Looking at how the AI is doing things I don't think you get your desired result. The AI gives a damn about efficient command&control for example, just mixing all over the place. It's one reason why you need to give it significant bonuses. Have one part on human control and you'll notice the game getting out of balance rather fast with the AI just not being able to keep up with what you are doing. Also, the AI is cheating to a certain degree.

I totally agree. "cooking the cake" is what I enjoy when playing these games. It's the planning process that I find enjoyable and its what makes executing the plans fun.

However, I totally agree that being allowed to influence TOE's to some extent and to allow the player to just play a specific army group would add to the game. Reducing the number of clicks needed is also fine, but don't remove the complexity.

For those that want a "simpler" game where everything is going on under the hood there are a ton of games out there to your taste already.

< Message edited by robinsa -- 3/7/2016 5:20:54 PM >

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Post #: 388

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 6:50:26 PM

Ridgeway

Posts: 139
Joined: 2/21/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pelton

quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

Sigup:

It may just be a matter of personal taste but my views are as they are and they are not unique to me. I agree about the WiTE logistics system and the need to improve, but I do not want to spend my gaming time faffing with supply dumps. I want to eat my cake without having to cook it first.

Speaking of exploits Silly check this out, not going to take long to get to
Berlin when Infantry divisions have 47 MP's or Moscow for that matter.

to be honest I really just started screwing around with "things" and found this as can be seen by time stamp.

Now got to figure out which switch or bug I tripped,

Out of curiosity, why wouldn't a US Infantry Division have the same number of MPs as an Armored division? They were fully motorized.

(in reply to Peltonx)

Post #: 389

RE: WitE 2 - 3/7/2016 7:22:38 PM

Peltonx

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Joined: 4/9/2006
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WA HQ's are 27 hexes past closest RH and Tank Corps (27) are full of gas and units (32 from RH) full of MP's/Gas.

Allot of play in logistics system for sure and I am a complete newbie still at WA side of things.

Only thing stopping me being in Berlin already is the combat delay, but looks like there are ways to limit that -getting better at it.

Doing normal 1.0 rail line converting that puts Germans just out side Gates of Leningrad before turn 6 moves and past D-town.

Unless RC is 1 hex per turn.

Systems work the same RedLancer or is WitW logistics system completely different then 2.0?