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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

 
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 1:29:26 AM   
Canoerebel


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Of those island groups I mentioned, the Aleutians are by far closest to Japan's vitals. Usually the Aleutians are too strongly defended or the risks to great for the reward. But in rare cases, such as think (I think), where the Allied can get the drop on Japan, this region is critical.

Burma is in a different category since it's mainly a land and air campaign. Burma opens up lots of opportunities to further conquest, whereas the Aleutians can be dead end if Japan properly attends to defenses further in. But, in this case, just forcing John to react and to properly defend his interior is worthwhile. The more uncertain a fighter gets - the more he shifts from foot to foot - the more opportunities there are to hit. I think that's what's going to happen here.


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 1:43:15 AM   
Crackaces


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Of those island groups I mentioned, the Aleutians are by far closest to Japan's vitals. Usually the Aleutians are too strongly defended or the risks to great for the reward. But in rare cases, such as think (I think), where the Allied can get the drop on Japan, this region is critical.

Burma is in a different category since it's mainly a land and air campaign. Burma opens up lots of opportunities to further conquest, whereas the Aleutians can be dead end if Japan properly attends to defenses further in. But, in this case, just forcing John to react and to properly defend his interior is worthwhile. The more uncertain a fighter gets - the more he shifts from foot to foot - the more opportunities there are to hit. I think that's what's going to happen here.




This took a lot of effort I know .. analyzing all the SigInt reports, mapping units, and detecting a weak NorPac front .. I love it.
So I am thinking the NorPac strategy is one of opportunity .. If the IJ leave the door open .. then that route is far more valuable route for the Allies then other routes ...
Nice ...


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:21:36 AM   
JeffroK


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This is not the end of the war. It is, as one American officer said after Guadalcanal, the end of the beginning.

More like Churchill after 2nd Alamein.

edit
Now this is not the end.
It is not even the beginning of the end.
But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.
Winston Churchill

http://www.winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1941-1945-war-leader/987-the-end-of-the-beginning

< Message edited by JeffK -- 3/21/2016 6:52:48 AM >


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:27:02 AM   
JeffroK


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Swapping them for some South Pacific/DEI malaria ridden swamp change to Wind and Snow covered rocks is not going to win the game.

Whats the plan after this, a left jab to make JIII run back to the DEI or are you going to slug it out again?

I would be interested where those "missing" Divisions are headed.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:27:35 AM   
JocMeister

 

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I think the Aleutians are a brilliant move at this point. Even if he counter attacks with everything he has (I bet he will) you will have 100 days of prepp to prepare for the onslaught. SLs also prevent John from using superior numbers in a meaningful way. Without looking at the map I think SLs are very low up there?

And once the allies are established...he will have to garrison Hokkaido. That will eat up a tremendous amount of troops.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:35:51 AM   
JeffroK


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

I think the Aleutians are a brilliant move at this point. Even if he counter attacks with everything he has (I bet he will) you will have 100 days of prepp to prepare for the onslaught. SLs also prevent John from using superior numbers in a meaningful way. Without looking at the map I think SLs are very low up there?

And once the allies are established...he will have to garrison Hokkaido. That will eat up a tremendous amount of troops.

I dont think its bad, just not brilliant.

And why worry about SL if you can starve them out, JIII has a dozen or more CV available plus a large number of BB/BC. Once Sabang falls he will also get back 3-4 very experienced Divs to block future moves. Hokkaido & the Kuriles should have been garrisoned anyway, maybe a bit more now but never left bare.

The Aleutians are good if (as I mentioned in crossing) a left jab gets JIII runnig back south, and I hope there are plenty of Subs between the Aleutians and JIII's forces.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 2:19:56 PM   
crsutton


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Of those island groups I mentioned, the Aleutians are by far closest to Japan's vitals. Usually the Aleutians are too strongly defended or the risks to great for the reward. But in rare cases, such as think (I think), where the Allied can get the drop on Japan, this region is critical.

Burma is in a different category since it's mainly a land and air campaign. Burma opens up lots of opportunities to further conquest, whereas the Aleutians can be dead end if Japan properly attends to defenses further in. But, in this case, just forcing John to react and to properly defend his interior is worthwhile. The more uncertain a fighter gets - the more he shifts from foot to foot - the more opportunities there are to hit. I think that's what's going to happen here.




In the past, I was not a big fan of the Aleutians as a major theater. But with a minor and unheralded change in the last patch the North can be significant. The reason is that with the Aleutians cleared there there is a big clear ocean path to the Japanese mainland. With the recent patch it is now much easier to carry out a large carrier raid against strategic targets and if a Japanese industrial city is left weakly defended it would not be too easy to run in and smash up some aircraft and engine production facilities. An early grab of the Northern Islands forces a wise Japanese player to hold some of his air and AA assets back. However, with stacking limits it is tougher to launch major amphibious operations from the North.


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 3:26:41 PM   
Lecivius


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Dang, I was gonna give myself a cookie if you actually got to the HI (that was my guess ) That would have knocked the stuffing out of Johns entire game

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:35:49 PM   
Canoerebel


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5/31/43

Operation Circus: The Allied landings continue in good order, unmolested by the enemy. Here's a synopsis from west to east, the direction that the campaign is unfolding:

Ulak: 100 AV ashore in the form of a RCT. LSTs willl land supply tonight.
Adak: Deliberate attack by 9th Aus. Div. almost overcomes five forts. This base with its big airfield will fall tomorrow.
Atka: Held by 4th Marine Raiders, who will now disperse in small contingents to seize dot-base islands.
Umnak: Landings commence here preceeded by several big bombardments. The defenses are more meager than expected - once again just a naval guard unit rather than the expected mixed brigade. 2nd Marines and two base forces are ashore. This base might not fall for several days (due to fort level), but it'll fall soon.
Dutch Harbor: No enemy garrison. Landings commenced here, including a very big naval support unit. This base will fall tomorrow. The hope is that the nav support, level three port, and AKE/AEs (inbound) will allow re-arming of the BBs.
Akutan: No enemy garrison. It'll be a few days before I have forcs available to land here.
Cold Bay: The last enemy base is helded by an assault division (Karfuto or something like that). 41st USA Div. is inbound. This might be a relatively tough nut, but it's proximity to existing big airfields at Kodiak and other islands (also proximity for bombardments) should make it doable in short order.

No sign of enemy combat ships or carriers. They're probably inbound. My fleet carriers are stationed just SE of Adak and will remain there another turn or two. The CVEs are covering the landings at Umnak and downed three Bettys, the only enemy air raid of the day.

Battle of Sumatra: Enemy bombardments have grown more sporadic and ineffective. The runway is 100% operational and service damage is down to 76%. I think BBs are inbound tonight. If they don't trash the field, I might load it up tomorrow with fighters and some bombers, including Beuforts with torps, plus perhaps some 4EB to hit Singers. But I need to think this through - making clear to John that Sabang is an offensive threat will only renew or refresh his opinion that it needs to be vanquished. But if I let it lie quietly he might not be quite as aggressive or strong. Eight enemy units are in the hex now and will bombard tomorrow. The Allies army is 1600 AV (and growing daily as disablements recover). I bet John has 5 or 6 divisions with some HQ or arty. Supply is holding steady due to the decrease in enemy activity of late. There is still the slimmest of chances that Sabang could hold out - and it was a close thing even if it falls. The Allied lodgement will have held at least seven months. Had I another month to work with, I'm pretty certain it would have held.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:52:25 PM   
Encircled


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Don't overthink it, if you can get aircraft to Sabang, get them there.

He's going to have left holes for you to exploit and it forces him to think about multiple vectors. The more he's got to think about, the more likely it is that he'll make a mistake.



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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 6:55:25 PM   
paullus99


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If he overreacts to your northern adventure, any chance you might be able to shove some supply or reinforcements into Sabang?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 7:02:46 PM   
Canoerebel


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Encircled, I think that's good advice.

Paullus, reinforcements really aren't needed. The limiting factor is supply (still good at 53k, but starting to get low). I have seven divisions (plus several RCT, tanks, etc.). Most of these are at half strength or so but quickly recover disabled squads (due to supply and HQ). I long ago turned off replacements to conserve supply, but would get big boosts quick if supply wan't an issue.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 7:13:36 PM   
witpqs


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Get aircraft in there, yes, but not 4EB IMO. Too fragile (service rating-wise) for the situation.

53k supply will evaporate much faster than you like once ground combat starts. Get some in if you can. That mitigates in favor of fighters and DB/TB. They can even have secondary missions to ground bomb IJ troops at Sabang (clear terrain, right?).

You know John's psychology far better than I, but do you really think he will so much forget about Sabang if you don't do anything there? Seems like a plan over-relying on him cooperating. I say "bring in supply and air cover!".

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 7:20:25 PM   
Canoerebel


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That Allies are running a long string of supply subs from Koggala to Sabang (and have been for months).

Getting supply in by ship is going to be tough, only because John holds the surrounding islands with big airfields. So it's possible but it's probably not a long term solution. I doubt the Allies will have enough success to materially alter the supply situation. So if John keeps his BBs in theater, there's really no hope and using any more xAKs isn't worth it. But if he pulls back the BBs (unlikely but remotely possible) I'll give it a few tries.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 8:02:26 PM   
traskott


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Dunno if its feasible but 5k of supply worht 10 xAKs.... Besides, remember, bad weather can give u some room to maneouver.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 8:07:05 PM   
BillBrown


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You can always tee him off a bit, use single small xAKLs. Often a single one will not be targeted by aircraft.
He does hate single ship TFs.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 9:19:03 PM   
Canoerebel


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6/1/43

Operation Circus: The Allies now have Ulak, Adak (fell on a 7:1 attack), Atka, and Dutch Harbor. Adak is the anchor of the defensive line at the moment, but Dutch is key in that it will allow BBs and subs to replenish. Umnak will take a few more days to fall. Amphibs are heading to Cold Bay, the final remaining contested landing. No enemy air or sea attacks today.

Enemy carriers sighted west of Midway - showing CVEs, but clearly John is sending alot (he wouldn't send just Mini KB into waters occupied by Death Star, naturally). I should have two or three more days clear. By then I just don't think John can dare to raid into the newly conquered region. But his highest priority is to stop the Allies from going further, though by now he must suspect that's not the plan.

SigInt continues to reveal the extent of his unease, with 15th Div. now reported headed to Attu (which is already garrisoned by 7th Div.). So John's going to tighten up his Aluet and other NoPac defenses and is bringing his carriers.

Battle of Sumatra: See combat report below for the unpleasant news John recieved when he bombarded -his losses unusually high. But it did drop supply from 53k to 49k. If only...if only! I'm trying to get more supply, but's its just going to be nearly impossible.

The Four Kongos bombarded today, again to minimal effect. Therefore, I'm staging my airforce forward for the first time since February. Fgihters, torpedo bombers, dive bombers, 2EB and 4EB. The torp and divebombers are set to naval strike. Mitchells are set to naval strike with ground strike at Sabang secondary. Bolos set to hit Georgetown port. 24 B24s set to hit Singers port.

Here's the combat report:

Ground combat at Sabang (44,70) Japanese Bombardment attack
Attacking force 55724 troops, 505 guns, 273 vehicles, Assault Value = 1913
Defending force 66718 troops, 1485 guns, 1727 vehicles, Assault Value = 1606

Japanese ground losses:
1107 casualties reported
Squads: 36 destroyed, 56 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 11 disabled
Guns lost 18 (3 destroyed, 15 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (2 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
8 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
16th Division
38th Division
14th Division
5th Division
4th Ind. Engineer Regiment
15th Ind. Engineer Regiment
21st Ind. Engineer Regiment
34th Ind. Engineer Regiment

Defending units:
182nd Infantry Regiment
20th Indian Division
34th Combat Engineer Regiment
193rd Tank Battalion
37th Infantry Division
132nd Infantry Regiment
2nd USMC Parachute Battalion
763rd Tank Battalion
503rd Parachute Regiment
18th British Division
27th Infantry Division
164th Infantry Regiment
99th Indian Brigade
32nd Infantry Division
21st Marine Rgt /1
102nd Combat Engineer Regiment
9th Marine Rgt /5
1st RM Heavy AA Regiment
2nd Ceylon H AA Regiment
205th Field Artillery Battalion
78th Light AA Regiment
Southwest Pacific
8th Belfast Heavy AA Regiment
804th Engineer Aviation Battalion
221st USN Base Force
198th Field Artillery Battalion
97th Coast AA Regiment
15th USN Naval Construction Battalion
175 Wing
VII US Bomber Cmnd

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 3/21/2016 9:32:14 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 10:01:38 PM   
HansBolter


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He doesn't have enough artillery to win bombardment duels with you.

I have seen the same thing with the Russians in Focus Pacific.

You get 1100 to 1500 guns in a siege hex and the enemy loses considerable killed squads every day.

You have 1485 guns to his 505.

You really need artillery shells badly!

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/21/2016 10:43:03 PM   
Canoerebel


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The vast majority of those guns are AA.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 3:05:56 AM   
CaptBeefheart


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Can we see a picture of this brilliant operation? (Edit: I mean Circus, of course.)

Cheers,
CC

< Message edited by Commander Cody -- 3/22/2016 3:17:06 AM >


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 5:22:09 AM   
Canoerebel


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At your request, Commander Cody.




Attachment (1)

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 5:38:31 AM   
Canoerebel


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6/2/43

Operation Circus: A relatively quiet day, but the end of the quiet is near. The Allies took some vacant dot hexes today and continued to land troops and supply, commenced amphibious assault at Cold Bay, and prepared to land at vacant (but very desirable) Akutan. BBs will bombard Umnak tomorrow prior to the Allied assault, which probably won't succeed quite yet. Additional BBs will bombard Cold Bay, where the Allied amphibious troops won't be strong enough to attack for awhile yet. I don't think John can cobble together a counterattack using amphibious troops anytime soon. If he wants to counterattack (I'm not sure he would, but he's very aggressive) he'll try to use KB to take control of the theater until he can bring in troops. But that's not necessarily a great option for him, I think. Adak is too strongly held for him to mess with already, with more than 500 AV. By tomorrow it should have 100k supply. Dutch is also strongly held. I'd feel better if I had already wrapped up Umnak, but there's a chance it will fall in the next day or two. But if John focuses too much here, I'll slide south where even now three Allied divisions are inbound to position that will permit quick movement elsewhere.

Would I accept a KB vs. Death Star battle at this point? Yes, if it were to take place in the vicinity of Kodiak Island, where the Allies have four big airfields (three of them on what used to be dot bases). I just can't see John frothing at the lips that much, but it's remotely possible.

Lots of enemy bombers tested the leaky CAP from the USN CVs that covered shipping at Adaks, downing a host of Bettys and stuff. One Betty did score a torp hit on a merchantmen. It did only moderate damage.

I had a few good Forumites express questions as to whether or not John would react strongly to Circus. I felt that he would, knowing him as I do. I think I was right on.

Battle of Sumatra: I mistimed the insertion of my airforce, as another set of BBs came in and this time the bombardment was effective, tearing up the field and disabling a host of aircraft. No supply was hit, so it remains at 49k. I'll remove my aircraft to the extent that I can. John revealed that most of the KB is off in the Pacific, so I'm going to try to insert some supply. This is pretty much a lost cause, but I gotta try, right? So three intrepid bush-league carriers are sortying with meager fighters. APDs are en route along with xAKs. I hate adding fuel to the "Banzai! Fest" that's coming soon, but I just gotta try.

Pickets Ships: John is frothing about my use of picket ships. I haven't replied to him as he's now backed off and apologized. But I will explain it in a post later tonight or tomorrow in case any readers wonder about it. The use I'm making is minimally invasive and minimizes a much greater weakness that's just part and parcel of the game that few players think about. Picket ships are appropriate and fine. And I don't use them to soak off sorties and nothing of that sort has taken place. P.S. John has used picket ships in this very operation, I think. My TFs stumbled across two APDs far to the north of Marcus Island a week back, as I mentioned. There would be no other reason for APDs way out there. I didn't see anything wrong with it.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 3/22/2016 5:40:26 AM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 6:04:22 AM   
Canoerebel


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AE, the Magic 24 Hour Movement Feature, and Picket Ships

There is a glaring flaw with AE that we all live with happily and seldom think about: Magic 24 Hour Movement. When orders are entered, we cannot countermand them for 24 hours even if something stunning becomes apparent one minute later. Our troops, planes, and ships have to continue on for those 24 hours even if doing so is the height of stupidity (or would be in real life) and would never happen (in real life).

Thus, I issue orders for a key transport TF to steam from Ceylon to Sabang. At the time the orders are issued, my patrols out of Sabang report the KB has been stationed near Padang for days. But John issues orders for KB to spring at Full Speed to the sea lanes between Ceylon and Sabang. At that rate, the carries can make 600 miles in a single day. And every single mile those ships are under surveillance of my patrol planes. But I can't issue orders to recall my ships for 24 hours. They just have to steam ahead to commit suicide.

None of us complain about that feature. It's just part of the game. But it is one of the game's greatest abstractions (or weaknesses). One way we can try to deal with that is to give orders to "fall back or retire if threats appear," but those are imprecise and seldom if ever model anything like what would happen in real life. But we just accept it, loving the game for what it is.

John used this very tactic in this game once, to launch the KB into the midst of the sea lanes between Ceylon and Sabang. I knew he might come, but I wasn't sure when or exactly where. So I had lots of ships in between - empties fleeing Sabang for Ceylon, ships inbound with troops, and my carriers stationed far enough back to avoid the Free 24 Hour Movement Abstraction. When John pounced, he then bitterly complained that I was the one abusing the game, because my scattered shipping "soaked off" some of his sorties and confused the mission selection. He was backed up in his accusations by some other Forumites, including one who just flat out said I was a liar (he later apologized).

This left me dumbfounded and disappointed. I hadn't done what they had accused me of doing and, in fact, it was John who was taking advantage of the game mechanics (though I didn't complain about that as it's just part of the game).

So I routinely employ picket ships to minimize the dangers of the Free 24 Hour Movement Feature. I use these judiciously and effectively. I pull them out of the way when they'd done their job. And not once have they "soaked off sorties." I just pull them out of the way, because I want to save them because they are valuable and have done their job.

Some players (including John, as he reiterated in an email tonight) contend that it's "okay" to use military vessels as pickets but not merchants. I disagree and think that works a disadvantage on the other player. It's usually easier to kill an xAK than a YMS, and they are more valuable to boot. So that's a false distinction, in my book. But whenever possible I do use military vessels just to appease the sensibilities of those who haven't thought this through.

The game involves lots of abstractions. Given all features of the game, it is reasonable to use assets judiciously to protect more valuable assets. The military would do the same thing in the real war. The military didn't have to do what I do simply because they (at least the Allies) nearly always knew where the KB was (or where it wasn't, which was usually sufficient). But the military did use DDs and other vessels to screen carriers. Since the military didn't have to deal with a 24 Hour Free Movement Feature, however, it didn't have to send picket vessels out 250 or 500 miles. It could turn around when danger appeared. It didn't have to wait until tomorrow.

In the real war the Allies did crazy things like leave civilians on remote islands for months at a time to report on enemy troop movements, or send frogmen in to enemy beaches before invasions, or risk submarines to rescue downed airmen within range of enemy artillery, etc. The military isn't stupid. It does what it has to do at the least expense and risk possible. That's what we're doing with picket ships.

What this boils down to is that some players want to be able to send carriers vast distances without risk of detection until they can attack an unprepared opponent who didn't act prudently to protect his assets.

And this is a game!


< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 3/22/2016 6:06:23 AM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 6:10:09 AM   
Mike McCreery


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I managed to avoid being catty in his AAR.

He has a scenario that he designed and is agreeably weighted toward the Japanese. He had you agree to some insane HR about no strategic bombing for which I cannot possibly conceive of a real life reason for.

My argument would be that you do not control 'merchant shipping' What is controlled in the game is ships that have been comandeered by the military for military use. What is included in the game is by no means the total shipping that was occuring during the war. There was plenty of private shipping that is not modeled in the game. I contend that all the ships in the game are crewed by the military for military uses.

John has some good qualities but he is a bad winner and a bad loser...

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 7:11:35 AM   
CaptBeefheart


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Thanks for the big picture. As they say, such a thing can be worth a thousand words. Also, regarding the big maskirovka, I think forumites expect that kind of thing. I've seen some comments in some AARs which are dangerously close to opsec breaches (no doubt unintentional, of course).

On the picket ships, I agree that the game doesn't give the Allies nearly enough intel on the KB compared to history. Against the AI, I find it helps to send subs in the general area where I'm wary of a KB incursion. When they start picking up DLs of 10, you know the beast is nearby. Of course, all a human IJ player has to do is to keep his Vals and Kates on deck.

Cheers,
CC

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 7:18:09 AM   
BBfanboy


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John also overlooks the fact that Japan can convert enormous numbers of small xAKLs into PBs, AMcs and other throwaway "military vessels" while the allies are much more limited in this. So the argument to use as pickets 'military types only' is stacked in Japan's favour.

And, you were not just using the small fry as pickets, you used them as part of the mental game to keep him guessing about which vector had the invasion TFs. You also used them carefully as intelligence gathering - to find the holes in his search coverage. Any of these justify their use without even considering the picket trip-wire.

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(in reply to Mike McCreery)
Post #: 5126
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 9:20:24 AM   
Encircled


Posts: 2024
Joined: 12/30/2010
From: Northern England
Status: offline
Picket ships are fine.

If its lots and lots of single MTBS to soak up sorties and ops points then no, but it isn't.

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Post #: 5127
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 9:21:20 AM   
Encircled


Posts: 2024
Joined: 12/30/2010
From: Northern England
Status: offline
Sorry CR, you were right, you should have waited before sending in the aircaft.

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Post #: 5128
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 10:15:39 AM   
JohnDillworth


Posts: 3100
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

I managed to avoid being catty in his AAR.

He has a scenario that he designed and is agreeably weighted toward the Japanese. He had you agree to some insane HR about no strategic bombing for which I cannot possibly conceive of a real life reason for.
yeah, that was kind of my take. This scenario was made for a Japanese fan boy. Dan was supposed to get extra fighters if I recall, but that didn't work out in the mod so almost all the advantages are to the Japanese. Hey Dan, if he gives 1,000 fighters or so will you stop using pickets and call it even?

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Today I come bearing an olive branch in one hand, and the freedom fighter's gun in the other. Do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. I repeat, do not let the olive branch fall from my hand. - Yasser Arafat Speech to UN General Assembly

(in reply to Mike McCreery)
Post #: 5129
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/22/2016 11:54:53 AM   
paullus99


Posts: 1985
Joined: 1/23/2002
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So, John - who has designed this mod (originally) as a magic win button for the IJN is complaining about single ship pickets?

Sorry, but cry me a river.

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Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon...

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Post #: 5130
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