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Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 4:55:27 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Yes, I said it. For those of you who are familiar with Group Solitaire Advanced Squad Leader you probably think you know where this is headed and you would be right. If you have experience with any of those GSASL games, your feedback would be especially valued.

For those unfamiliar, let me explain . . .

Group Tigers on the Hunt would be a refereed campaign where each 'player' takes the role of a Company Commander of a larger unit, probably a Battalion as we would need to start off small and run a test first. This may also require a 'player' Battalion Commander who would likely not fight any scenarios but would allocate out Battalion level assets to the individual companies before each mission. So we are talking 3-5 players at minimum but I could probably do with less to start.

Essentially, the players would fight out their assigned custom missions and provide the referee with a Save Game file at the mission and as an AAR. The overall results are then transferred to a strategic map (if I go that route) and new missions (custom Scenarios) generated from that map and operational situation for the players to play next. Basically think of an operational situation where each player is playing their own, linked, custom campaigns.

For those unfamiliar with what I am proposing , please take a look at this "Group Solitaire Advanced Squad Leader (GSASL) Campaign website" to get an idea of the concept. This may, at first, be a once sided campaign as I am not sure I can properly 'balance' things for a group vs group game if I try running it from both sides. Another obstacle to a larger game is remembering that I would have to manually build each custom scenario for each player involved and that the 'storyline' would need to feel that its a continuous part of a bigger operational game.

I guess the big question is, how many would be interested in participating, and how complicated should this thing be?

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 5:27:22 PM   
Paullus

 

Posts: 1058
Joined: 6/9/2015
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		I'm in

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 5:44:46 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1662
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: offline 		I just downloaded GSASL rules and looks really intriguing.

I have a couple questions before signing in: how often are missions issued to players? How much time have players to complete a scenario?


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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 8:37:10 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UP844

I have a couple questions before signing in: how often are missions issued to players? How much time have players to complete a scenario?

In this game, I am honestly not sure but I expect each 'round' to take no more than 1 month total. Each round is I create the scenarios, players complete them, players report AAR (end game results) and I update the operational map.

The biggest 'delay' would be with the time it takes me to create each player's scenario, work up the operational order telling them their objectives, etc, and then providing the files to the players. I figure most scenarios will be able to be played through in 1-2 days at most so that part will be a quick turnaround.

Basically, I will use my copy of Solitaire ASL to generate each scenario and using VASL as a visual reference to help me build out the activated units, reinforcements and VPO hexes, etc. Then will take that finalized information , tweaking it, and inputting it into TotH to create the scenario. Right now I am working on the process to do that using the 'Otto Carius Campaign' as my test subject and I have the base rules started from when I did this when I tried to run a GSASL game many years ago but got overwhelmed (had over 40 people sign up and there was no way I could run that by myself).


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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 9:23:21 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		For the campaign, I am leaning towards the opening days of Operation Barbarossa and 3 scenarios long. I guess one of the next questions is, which side do interested players want to command, German or Russian?

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/23/2016 10:55:39 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Ok, I'm thinking played from the German side for this test run since I have the general idea in my head already. Each player, Company Commander, will fight 3 missions (scenarios). How well you do in each mission will determine what the next mission will be for your company. Suffer a defeat and you will be put on the defense, win and you will go on the offense.

For the 'campaign', each player defeat = 0 points, draws count as 1 point, a victory = 2 points. The team (3 commanders x 3 missions) must reach 12 points for the "company" to succeed in their overall mission (this is just a "tentative goal" though until I work out the final victory conditions math).

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 2:07:05 AM   
UP844


Posts: 1662
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: offline 		Thanks for the clarification: I have very irregular work schedules, and I was afraid some kind of immediate reply would be required. Even if I am in the middle of a work frenzy, however, I will be able to take the time required to play the scenario within 48 hours at most.

Sign me in!

As for the campaign setting, since you will be doing all the administrative work anyway (thanks in advance!), select whatever you prefer (and you were preparing for). If it's Barbarossa, it's fine for me.

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Post #: 7
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 2:39:51 AM   
okiefire1

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 3/1/2016
Status: offline 		I would be interested in this, also. Played GSASL several years ago and always enjoyed it. Count me in, and thanks for the effort!

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Post #: 8
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 3:06:35 AM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UP844

Thanks for the clarification: I have very irregular work schedules, and I was afraid some kind of immediate reply would be required. Even if I am in the middle of a work frenzy, however, I will be able to take the time required to play the scenario within 48 hours at most.

Sign me in!

You would have plenty of time, the 1-2 days I mentioned was for what it should take you to complete the scenario itself, maybe a day or more than that at most with 10-15 turns at most. Friendly forces would be a company+ with the enemy variable, could be less, could be more, could be a ALOT more. ;-)

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 3:07:00 AM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: okiefire_ssl

I would be interested in this, also. Played GSASL several years ago and always enjoyed it. Count me in, and thanks for the effort!

I will add you to the list.

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 2:12:59 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		There will be 3 Companies involved, all from the German 2nd BN/233 RGT/102 ID. The 3 of you (Paullus, UP844 and okiefire_ssl) are free to choose which of the company's you want to command from 1, 2 or 3. First post gets first choice but be aware, they are all the same, at least starting off on the morning of June 22, 1941.

Working up the 1st Mission now which, if you are familiar with SASL, will be a Cautious Advance. It's the morning of June 22, 1941 and your Battalion will lead the Division across the German/Russian border, North of Kolno. The Russian 8th Rifle Division is defending in this sector.

Be advised, building the scenario file and setting the Victory Conditions will be the most time intensive step of this process so do not expect them to be available right away.

More details will follow as I have them but please feel free to ask any questions. That goes for anyone not named above who might want to jump in later when we run another, longer campaign as this one will be a 3 Mission test run to work out the bugs.

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 3:03:34 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1662
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: offline 		#3 company, reporting for duty!

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Post #: 12
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 4:20:13 PM   
idjester

 

Posts: 369
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		Interesting idea and I'm glad your putting this together. Get all of the details put together and create a info sheet and I will use it in my next live stream to introduce it to players who watch the video.

I would also be interested in playing in the campaign game and would live stream my results so everyone can see it...

Should be a fun thing to do.

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Post #: 13
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 7:41:23 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Thanks. Everything is pretty much just in paper notes all over my man cave. I have my SASL stuff out to use for generating/building the scenarios. Rulebook and charts all over the place here. Once I get more put together I'll send it your way.

< Message edited by Double Deuce -- 3/24/2016 7:42:12 PM >

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 9:29:24 PM   
rickier65

 

Posts: 14231
Joined: 4/20/2000
Status: offline
i'm also watching this thread to see how this works.

Thanks
Rick

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Post #: 15
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/24/2016 9:58:37 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Missions for 1 and 3 Company's is about complete, just have to write up the briefing text. In the meantime, building the scenario for 2 Company.

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 5:32:43 AM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Double Deuce

There will be 3 Companies involved, all from the German 2nd BN/233 RGT/102 ID. The 3 of you (Paullus, UP844 and okiefire_ssl) are free to choose which of the company's you want to command from 1, 2 or 3. First post gets first choice but be aware, they are all the same, at least starting off on the morning of June 22, 1941.

Just wanted to clarify that while the "Missions" are the same, Cautious Advance, the scenarios themselves are very different, the Russian 8th Rifle Division might be a tough nut to crack . . I love the variables SASL brings!


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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 8:06:36 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		All 3 scenarios are built, just need to do up the briefings. I just hope my Victory Conditions formula is not to far off.

Starting OOB's for the 3 German Infantry Companies will be posted shortly.

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Post #: 18
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 8:40:21 PM   
UP844


Posts: 1662
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Double Deuce

All 3 scenarios are built, just need to do up the briefings.


Great!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Double Deuce

I just hope my Victory Conditions formula is not to far off.


That's what experiments are for

I have carefully studied the GSASL Bessarabia campaign, but I do not have the core SASL rules, so I have a couple doubts:
- will units retain any hardening/worsening in subsequent scenarios?
- since TotH scenarios can end suddenly (e.g. because the last enemy is eliminated unit without the player knowing it was the last one), I think company commandere should have to keep track of abandoned SW, leader/squad hardening/worsening/casualty reduction.

Looking forward to the OOB, and thanks for your effort! :inchino:


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Post #: 19
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 8:40:40 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Starting Company OOB's for 2nd Battalion, 233rd Infantry Regiment, 102nd Infantry Division

1st Company, 2nd Battalion, 233rd Regiment, 102nd Infantry Division

1x LEADER: Lieutenant B*
1x LEADER: Sergeant C*
1x LEADER: Sergeant C
12x SQUAD: 1st Line
2x HALF-SQUAD: 1st Line
2x CREW
2x SW: LIGHT MG
2x SW: AT RIFLE
2x SW: LIGHT MTR

*- 1st Company has Priority of Fire from the Battalion Mortars (81mm) so will have an attached LEADER: Sergeant C w/ Radio

+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +

2nd Company, 2nd Battalion, 233rd Regiment, 102nd Infantry Division

1x LEADER: Lieutenant B**
1x LEADER: Lieutenant B*
1x LEADER: Sergeant C
12x SQUAD: 1st Line
2x HALF-SQUAD: 1st Line
2x CREW
2x SW: LIGHT MG
2x SW: AT RIFLE
2x SW: LIGHT MTR
+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +

3rd Company, 2nd Battalion, 233rd Regiment, 102nd Infantry Division

1x LEADER: Lieutenant B*
1x LEADER: Sergeant C*
1x LEADER: Sergeant C
12x SQUAD: 1st Line
2x HALF-SQUAD: 1st Line
2x CREW
2x SW: LIGHT MG
2x SW: AT RIFLE
2x SW: LIGHT MTR

+ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - +

Each Company will have the following attached to them from the Battalion Machine Gun Company;
2x CREW
2x SW: MEDIUM MG

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 8:51:37 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UP844

I have carefully studied the GSASL Bessarabia campaign, but I do not have the core SASL rules, so I have a couple doubts:
- will units retain any hardening/worsening in subsequent scenarios?
- since TotH scenarios can end suddenly (e.g. because the last enemy is eliminated unit without the player knowing it was the last one), I think company commandere should have to keep track of abandoned SW, leader/squad hardening/worsening/casualty reduction.

Yeah, I am trying to work up how to track that information. I figure if the commanders save their end game file and send me that file to me as a save file I can poke through and get most of the information I need. I will probably also require completing an AAR and sending that in, so I can use it to update the master OOB's and stuff. Any unit's condition will carry over from scenario to scenario so if you are not doing well, you many not want to throw the rest of your men away for that one last Victory Objective.

The GSASL Bessarabia rules are only a framework I am using for reference. The main thing I plan to do here is see if the format is workable and confirm if the necessary information can be transferred between players and GM without too much backend paperwork. I want players to be very involved since I want it to be fun for them too but not so involved that they feel they are writing dissertations at the end of each mission. ;-)

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/25/2016 11:55:41 PM   
Peter Fisla


Posts: 2503
Joined: 10/5/2001
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UP844

quote:

ORIGINAL: Double Deuce

All 3 scenarios are built, just need to do up the briefings.


Great!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Double Deuce

I just hope my Victory Conditions formula is not to far off.


That's what experiments are for

I have carefully studied the GSASL Bessarabia campaign, but I do not have the core SASL rules, so I have a couple doubts:
- will units retain any hardening/worsening in subsequent scenarios?
- since TotH scenarios can end suddenly (e.g. because the last enemy is eliminated unit without the player knowing it was the last one), I think company commandere should have to keep track of abandoned SW, leader/squad hardening/worsening/casualty reduction.

Looking forward to the OOB, and thanks for your effort! :inchino:




I will make the "scenario ends because a side lost all of its units" feature optional (you will be able to enable/disable this before you start a scenario) in the coming Update 1.

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Post #: 22
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 12:01:40 AM   
UP844


Posts: 1662
Joined: 3/3/2016
From: Genoa, Republic of Genoa (occupied by Italy)
Status: offline 		Thanks Peter, that will be a nice addition (and will make life easier for Double Deuce )

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Post #: 23
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 5:14:48 AM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Peter Fisla

I will make the "scenario ends because a side lost all of its units" feature optional (you will be able to enable/disable this before you start a scenario) in the coming Update 1.

Nice, I hadn't thought about that being an issue but with some of the Victory Conditions I am working up being taking objectives having a priority over killing enemy I can see where that might be a problem.


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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 5:15:15 AM   
okiefire1

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 3/1/2016
Status: offline 		I'll take #2 company. Paullus can have the mortar. Thanks.

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Post #: 25
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 5:16:38 AM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Paullus and okiefire_ssl, please let me know which of the 2 remaining company's you each want to command from between Company 1 and Company 2.

Nevermind, looks like we posted at about same time.

< Message edited by Double Deuce -- 3/26/2016 5:56:51 AM >

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 11:55:39 AM   
Doraniner


Posts: 22
Joined: 3/4/2016
From: Canada
Status: offline 		I would like to join but I think all the spots are taken...
Anyway if you need a backup or anything let me know ...
I will keep an eye on this post to see how things go.

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Post #: 27
RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 1:48:41 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		Yeah, I already have 3 victims, err I mean playtesters. ;-)

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 9:20:56 PM   
DoubleDeuce


Posts: 1247
Joined: 6/23/2000
From: Crossville, TN
Status: offline 		For anyone following along, once the 1st set of missions is completed I will post the scenario file for everyone else to have access to. Please note that these are NOT supposed to be balanced in any way, shape or form.

< Message edited by Double Deuce -- 3/26/2016 11:28:09 PM >

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RE: Group Tigers on the Hunt - 3/26/2016 10:37:55 PM   
Stardog765


Posts: 160
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		DD its really great of you to put this together for everyone.

I am still learning now to play the game but would be interested in checking it out at some point.

Great job!

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Post #: 30
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