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Resupply ship - 5/26/2016 1:12:23 AM

soulstenance

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Silly question but what do I need to research to get the resupply ship. The help file is incredibly cryptic and I can't find anything in the energy research tree which is where is says it is.

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RE: Resupply ship - 5/26/2016 6:03:15 AM

Bingeling

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It depends on bit whether you are playing a mod (that moved it) or the base game.

In any case, it should be a construction tech, which is the "bottom part" of the red (Energy and construction) tech tree. From memory it is a node sitting above the main construction size line, and which requires a couple of construction size techs.

I have seen some mod move it into the main construction size line, to one of the first nodes.

The node description will say "unlocks the Resupply Ship" in some way or other.

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RE: Resupply ship - 5/26/2016 8:53:02 AM

soulstenance

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Found it thank you. :)

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/1/2016 11:35:37 PM

SirHoraceHarkness

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Next question will be how the bloody hell do I use the resupply ship.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/1/2016 11:57:14 PM

soulstenance

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You need to deploy it in a solar system. Then just basically use it as a portable space station.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/2/2016 6:05:07 AM

Bingeling

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A good howto:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3643578

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/6/2016 8:17:29 PM

btd64

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I am experimenting with it as part of a fleet. The idea being, after a long range attack, move the fleet to a gas giant with the fuel you need and deploy the resupply ship to fuel the fleet....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/6/2016 8:52:01 PM

Bingeling

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Do not add it to the fleet. It can of course be in its own fleet if you prefer that in order to find it. But with a long range scanner, they are pretty easy to find unless parked close to your own (long range scanning) colonies.

I enjoy keeping to default fuel cells, in order to give a sense of galaxy size, and potential need for resupply ships to make wars work. Send a resupply ship and a very powerful fleet to set up camp among the enemy's core colonies, and wreck havoc on mines and spaceports.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/7/2016 11:30:36 PM

RemoteLeg

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Here's my main reason for keeping resupply ships in their own little fleets:

If you select a fleet then tell it to refuel at the resupply ship, everything will work smoothly if they are separate.
However, if the resupply ship is part of the fleet you told to refuel, the "refuel" command issued to that fleet will cause the resupply ship to undeploy and this means your fleet cannot refuel there.

Keep resupply ships out of your war fleets. It makes life easier.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/8/2016 12:19:36 AM

Retreat1970

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It hasn't been said, so, a resupply ship is a huge warship. Mining fuel is secondary. Of course this is my opinion.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/8/2016 6:44:37 AM

Bingeling

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Retreat1970

It hasn't been said, so, a resupply ship is a huge warship. Mining fuel is secondary. Of course this is my opinion.

You are of course entitled to your opinion, I do understand the need to trivialize the fuel component in the game to make it easier

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/8/2016 3:47:08 PM

RemoteLeg

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There's a good article by Sirian on how to use resupply ships effectively as refueling stations and there's another by Jacozilla that explains how to use them as battleships.

Personally I've never had much joy with resupply ships in either role. I find they require a lot of micromanagement and I would rather get the energy-to-fuel-converter technology and just build gas mining stations wherever I go.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/8/2016 3:50:23 PM

btd64

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OK. here is what I am trying. Add the resupply ship to my fleet. Attack the enemy until fuel is getting low. Move the fleet to a suitable fuel source. Detach the Resupply ship and deploy. Refuel fleet and resupply ship and have resupply ship join the fleet again. Haven't got to that point yet, but I'll let you all know how it works out....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/9/2016 7:00:52 AM

RemoteLeg

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quote:

OK. here is what I am trying. Add the resupply ship to my fleet. Attack the enemy until fuel is getting low. Move the fleet to a suitable fuel source. Detach the Resupply ship and deploy. Refuel fleet and resupply ship and have resupply ship join the fleet again.

I recommend keeping the resupply ship out of the fleet.

- send the fleet to the encounter site
- deploy the resupply ship nearby at a suitable fuel source
- when ready, select the fleet and tell it to refuel at the resupply ship
- when refueled, send the fleet back to work

This way you're only issuing commands to the fleet. You eliminate micromanaging the resupply ship once it's deployed.
I see what you're trying to do, but I think it's too much work.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/9/2016 8:41:16 AM

Bingeling

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Totally agreed on the above. The only reason I see to add it to the fleet, is to also use it in combat. But in that case, it does not actually have to be fleeted either.

I am an eager abuser of giving single ship orders to fleet members, but this requires quite a bit of concentration in avoiding giving the fleet an order until the "soloers" have completed their mission(s).

My reference is AI designs, and in those the Resupply ship is quite powerful. But best used to "bully" its way to a fuel source in war (destroy mine and refuelers) and repel small forces. The good thing is that the AI puts long range scanner on them, but on little else, so as long as they do not sit in or very near systems with other scanners, they are somewhat easy to spot on the map.

In the Patton-scenario above, I would scout out my refueling spot near the target. I send the resupply ship and possibly a small helper fleet to the system of the refueling spot (to make them bust mines before deploying). There is no need to have enemy spies permanently placed in the resupply ship system... Send the deploy order whenever the system is ready.

The attack fleet(s) get their attack orders, and can chain them until out of fuel. The resupply ships(s) sit at good nearby mines, and fuel is at hand. I would say that in somewhat "dense enemy areas" there can be a fuel spot within easy range of quite a few good enemy attack targets.

See the image below, the purple long range scanning resupply ship (near the bottom) is in good range of most of the "Red" enemy core worlds. If multiple fleets are to run rampant, it may be necessary to use more than one resupply ship.

(in reply to RemoteLeg)

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/9/2016 2:08:14 PM

btd64

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Easier to control the refit for the constructor when it's in the fleet. Moving in and out of a fleet is easy enough to do....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/9/2016 2:23:53 PM

Bingeling

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I would say it is best to not have Resupply ships refit alongside fleets. They don't need it that often, and may be busy filling their holds while the fleet refits :)

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/11/2016 9:27:45 PM

btd64

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bingeling

I would say it is best to not have Resupply ships refit alongside fleets. They don't need it that often, and may be busy filling their holds while the fleet refits :)

The added fire power is a plus....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/11/2016 9:33:39 PM

btd64

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OK. These are my test results. I moved the fleet to a nearby system with a gas giant of the proper type. Had the resupply ship leave the fleet and deploy. After the resupply ship deployed I ordered the fleet to refuel. It chose the nearest starbase instead of the Resupply ship. The fleet had enough fuel to go to the starbase. Tried again after fuel was low. This time the fleet chose the resupply ship. All ship refueled and I undeployed the resupply ship and reattached it to the fleet and moved on. So yes it works and it is worth having one in a fleet....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/11/2016 9:43:21 PM

Bingeling

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Was the resupply ship full when they picked the starbase?

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/11/2016 10:03:20 PM

btd64

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bingeling

Was the resupply ship full when they picked the starbase?

Its own fuel was full....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/11/2016 11:00:14 PM

Aeson

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quote:

Its own fuel was full

Probably not what Bingling was asking. A fleet will generally prefer to refuel at points which have enough fuel for the fleet under the assumption that the fleet's fuel tanks are completely empty, rather than just checking to ensure that the place that they're going to try to refuel at has sufficient fuel to top off their tanks (either at current levels or after accounting for fuel consumed in traveling to the refueling site); if the resupply ship had too little fuel in its cargo bays at the time that you ordered the fleet to refuel, then the fleet going somewhere else to refuel is expected behavior. Thus, if your fleet contained 10 ships with 500 fuel capacity, and your Resupply ship had less than 5000 fuel of the appropriate type available in its hold at the time you issued the order to refuel the fleet whereas the space station that the fleet decided to refuel at did have at least 5000 fuel of the appropriate type available in its hold, the fleet choosing the space station instead of the resupply ship in spite of the greater proximity of the resupply ship is expected behavior even if the resupply ship did have sufficient fuel in stock to top off the fleet's tanks.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/12/2016 7:50:18 AM

Bingeling

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What Aeson said. Also, if you happen to know that "But they do not need 5000 fuel, the resupply ship got enough", you can manually target the refuel at the resupply ship and they will refuel there. Which probably requires actually right clicking the resupply ship, and can be annoying to do if there is a fleet sitting on top of it, for instance.

This is also the reason why mining stations rarely can resupply a large fleet unless you have "lots of fuel", actually so much that no one is bothering reserving the mining stations fuel to move it to a spaceport. And unless you "swim in fuel" you are likely to see fleets move a long distance to refuel, especially if you order many large fleets to refuel at once in the same area. Why, because a refueling fleet reserves its full requirement (5000 in the example Aeson gave), until it is done refueling. And reserved fuel is not available when the next fleet gets its refuel order. Even if the first fleet is "almost full" before refueling.

It takes some time to fill the cargo of a resupply ship with fuel. Which means that for instance one ship may not be able to resupply for instance 3 fleets doing travel and fighting, and also means that I prefer to have my resupply ship deployed at all times. Because if they are always deployed, I know they will be full when they take off, and ready to just "deploy and refuel", compared to "deploy, mine (wait), and refuel".

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/13/2016 9:06:17 PM

RemoteLeg

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Of course if you keep two Resupply Ships together you get double the fuel because they can both mine the same gas giant at the same time.

An added bonus is that they can refuel each other, which sounds odd until you find out that Resupply Ships have no way of refueling themselves from the gas they have collected. You'd think they could just run a garden hose from the cargo bay to the gas tank, but I guess that technology is beyond them.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/13/2016 9:38:43 PM

Bingeling

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I have never noticed a Resupply Ship being out of fuel or refueling, but maybe that is just mine. I believe they fill their tank while mining?

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/13/2016 10:11:14 PM

btd64

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My resupply ship DID refuel itself. I watched it happen as that was required for my test to work....GP

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/14/2016 9:58:44 AM

Bingeling

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It probably refuels itself while mining, so the issue arises if it is abused by deploying to barren rocks and such.

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RE: Resupply ship - 6/14/2016 9:40:41 PM

RemoteLeg

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You're right - they DO refuel themselves!
I checked this a year ago and I could not get them to refuel on their own so I just assumed "that was that".
Admittedly I was trying to order them to refuel while they were not deployed and mining, so perhaps that's what I did wrong. I was trying to force them to refuel when all I had to do was wait long enough for them to do it when they were ready.

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Resupply ship