Yes, that is truly dirt cheap. And from the screens, future support and simple modding capability, it will probably be my favorite wargame yet. At least that's what I'm hoping
Also, it was supposed to release one year ago, which to me is an excellent sign it might be playable out of the box.
< Message edited by rosseau -- 6/4/2016 12:02:33 AM >
Yes, I just found that out myself a few minutes ago. Here 2x3 games puts together a 200+ page change log for WitE with a few guys, and Paradox not even a PDF manual. It's a bad precedent for a complex wargame like that.
< Message edited by rosseau -- 6/4/2016 5:08:36 AM >
Posts: 2264
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rosseau
Yes, I just found that out myself a few minutes ago. Here 2x3 games puts together a 200+ page change log for WitE with a few guys, and Paradox not even a PDF manual. It's a bad precedent for a complex wargame like that.
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Joined: 2/25/2002 From: Salida, CA. Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore Japan sends divisions to help?
That too is an issue, but the dates I mentioned pertain to the start and end dates of the war for France. A brand new strategic doctrine for Germany is introduced with the new Hearts of Iron game, VP rush... It's a far more devastating doctrine than say Blitzkrieg.
Yes, I just found that out myself a few minutes ago. Here 2x3 games puts together a 200+ page change log for WitE with a few guys, and Paradox not even a PDF manual. It's a bad precedent for a complex wargame like that.
The HOI4 wiki IS the manual
Paradox is starting a new trend by releasing grand strategy games without a manual. Other companies will pick it up and pretty soon there will be no game manuals--.pdf or otherwise--included with a PC game.
I own every Hearts of Iron game that's been released so far, but I won't be buying HoI4 unless it has a game manual.
Yes, I just found that out myself a few minutes ago. Here 2x3 games puts together a 200+ page change log for WitE with a few guys, and Paradox not even a PDF manual. It's a bad precedent for a complex wargame like that.
The HOI4 wiki IS the manual
Paradox is starting a new trend by releasing grand strategy games without a manual. Other companies will pick it up and pretty soon there will be no game manuals--.pdf or otherwise--included with a PC game.
I own every Hearts of Iron game that's been released so far, but I won't be buying HoI4 unless it has a game manual.
Why would you want a PDF manual when there is a wiki integrated into the game itself? It's all the exact same information but linked together for easier navigation and regularly kept up to date.
If you look there you can see what it will look like. Also note the interactive tutorial described which should be a better tutorial than any they have done before. And you can download the wiki as a file which can be accessed offline if you so desire. And they will be putting up instructional videos to help learn the game.
I guess I can understand the desire to have a physical manual in a certain sense, but such a thing would be objectively inferior to what they are offering.
< Message edited by Ranger33 -- 6/6/2016 6:44:54 AM >
Yes, I just found that out myself a few minutes ago. Here 2x3 games puts together a 200+ page change log for WitE with a few guys, and Paradox not even a PDF manual. It's a bad precedent for a complex wargame like that.
The HOI4 wiki IS the manual
Paradox is starting a new trend by releasing grand strategy games without a manual. Other companies will pick it up and pretty soon there will be no game manuals--.pdf or otherwise--included with a PC game.
I own every Hearts of Iron game that's been released so far, but I won't be buying HoI4 unless it has a game manual.
Why would you want a PDF manual when there is a wiki integrated into the game itself? It's all the exact same information but linked together for easier navigation and regularly kept up to date.
If you look there you can see what it will look like. Also note the interactive tutorial described which should be a better tutorial than any they have done before. And you can download the wiki as a file which can be accessed offline if you so desire. And they will be putting up instructional videos to help learn the game.
I guess I can understand the desire to have a physical manual in a certain sense, but such a thing would be objectively inferior to what they are offering.
I don't have to be on the internet to read either a printed paper manual or a .pdf manual. Wikis, YouTube videos, and fan sites are helpful--I use them, too--but Stellaris and Hearts of Iron IV have both been released without a game manual. How long do you thing it will be before every other PC game publisher won't bother to include any documentation at all with the games they publish?
I will probably buy Hearts of Iron IV sooner or later, but not until it's on sale for dirt cheap; Paradox certainly maximized their profits from it by doing away with documentation so why should I buy HoI4 on its day of release and give Paradox more profit than it deserves?
Well, I won't argue further, except to point out that I already pointed out that you can view the wiki offline. And quite the opposite of slashing the budget by getting rid of the manual, they are hosting a website which includes every single bit of info you would find in the manual with the benefit that it will be kept up to date with every single change. I just can't see why you would want a static PDF over an up to date and directly integrated wiki with all the same information.
But I guess if you would prefer a physical manual or PDF that might be months/years out of date, more power to you.
I can't remember the last time I read a manual. It might have been the pacific panzer general game when I couldn't figure out what was an objective. It didn't help anyway.
i much prefer a decent tutorial and a link to the other pages.
As I get older (ahem), manuals aren't as fun to read as they were before. I did like the PDF because you could search for the exact word if you had a question. Doesn't work as well on a Wiki.
Well, time to download the game and figure it out!
As I get older (ahem), manuals aren't as fun to read as they were before. I did like the PDF because you could search for the exact word if you had a question. Doesn't work as well on a Wiki.
Well, time to download the game and figure it out!
"Ctrl + F" works well on most pages and things for searching.
There is no Paradox game where the manual didn't become hopelessly out of date within 6-12 months of release. That's why there's no manual. They could have done better with the tutorial information, but wasting time on a manual that most people wouldn't read and would almost immediately become defunct would have been a bad decision.
I've only got 3 hours in it, and I hate that they axed the in-depth organization, but so far I've really enjoyed it. Tutorial has been good so far, and there's loads of helpful pop ups. Battle plans are a lot of fun to set up and execute. I can't help but wonder if they took some cues about preparation for battle plans and naval invasions from WitW
< Message edited by gexmex -- 6/7/2016 6:14:07 PM >
I've only got 3 hours in it, and I hate that they axed the in-depth organization, but so far I've really enjoyed it. Tutorial has been good so far, and there's loads of helpful pop ups. Battle plans are a lot of fun to set up and execute. I can't help but wonder if they took some cues about preparation for battle plans and naval invasions from WitW
I've played a few hours now as well, it's a lot of fun and much easier to play than HoI 3. I would recommend all of the grizzled grognard types to steer clear. The game is way too streamlined and user friendly for you
Only complaint so far would be that the AI can certainly do some very silly things with troop movements and I really don't like how military access works currently.
I'm playing my first game as Romania. I went fascist and then attacked Bulgaria (I mean, why not?) to get some extra factories and such. Then I lined up against Hungary. I really should have lost that war since my army got all but pocketed and then Hungary slipped a dozen divisions into Romania proper. Instead of going for my undefended capital they were happy to loiter in the north for several months, giving me time to reach somewhat undefended Budapest, forcing them to capitulate.
A later oddity was when Germany attacked Poland. The Soviets did not attack Poland and the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact was still on. They instead attacked Estonia, who was allied with Poland, which for some reason caused 50 German divisions to travel around Poland and into the SU, then they reversed course and then 50 SU divisions cruised into Germany. Then Germany won against Poland, then the next day declared war on SU, leaving dozens of SU divisions hundreds of miles from supply. So, yeah, some work to be done there. Or AI Hitler is just a very sneaky trickster.
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