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RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/3/2016 10:24:23 PM   
btd64


Posts: 9973
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From: Mass. USA. now in Lancaster, OHIO
Status: offline 		Pax, are you talking about the bombing raids? I have made it to the day after Xmas and haven't seen it yet. What is the time frame for that?....GP

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(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 121
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/4/2016 1:16:38 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline 		The old tier 3 landed and took Victoria which triggered the US reinforcements. Wanted to be sure he got that out of the script with this update.

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Pax

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Post #: 122
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/4/2016 12:08:32 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		thanks guys also running a game myself v the Tier 3 so I have a few adjustments to make to the Japanese opening

Going to play out another 6 months myself to see how it pans out before I do anything

Andy

(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 123
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/4/2016 12:10:10 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Good a lot a of variation is a good thing - I lost all the BB's and Enterprise in th efirst week of my game so looks good
quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

I wouldn't say "Goodbye Hawaii". In this case if you respond quickly enough, you will be fine.
Andy, the AI (scripts) seem to be going well. I'm not giving up ground unless I have to or I lose it. The PH attack this time was lame though. Didn't lose a single BB. In fact the worst damage was 32,12,17. Though I did lose one of my CV toys....GP


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Post #: 124
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/4/2016 5:11:45 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I think I have the new Scen1 AI more or less done for Japan going to start work on Allied scen 1 AI next so I have a complete new baseline

Feedback still very welcome

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Post #: 125
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/10/2016 6:42:18 AM   
Yaab


Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline 		AndyMac, will there be any variants to scen100? I have your scen100.dat file, but there are no variants ( scen100-01.dat, scen100-02.dat etc.) files.

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Post #: 126
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/11/2016 4:21:46 AM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		Hi Andy,

Just curious how the Tier 3 is coming along.

EDIT: I'd be happy to test a new iteration of the scenario.

Cheers,
CC

< Message edited by Commander Cody -- 4/11/2016 9:41:18 AM >

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Post #: 127
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/14/2016 2:52:38 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		There will be variants but I have learned my lesson not to start doing them until I have the core scenario done 1st

I am waiting on feedback and am also playing the scen myself on 4 day turns - up to Jan 43 so far.

To test and look for tweaks

My biggest gripe so far is the sheer number of Betty losses the range is simply to great on them and causes too many easy VP losses

Going to have to think about how I deal with it - I may end up reducing the range on the Betty in Mid 42 to mitigate losses or increase the range on some sort of fighter - not sure yet.

Andy

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Post #: 128
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/14/2016 3:28:54 PM   
btd64


Posts: 9973
Joined: 1/23/2010
From: Mass. USA. now in Lancaster, OHIO
Status: offline 		Andy. In scenario 104, tier 3 nasty, I have seen 2 Japanese tf's sail into Bataan and get plastered by mines and CD guns. They had no escorts and no troops. Also 1 at Singapore. TF composition was landing barges mostly. These were in December 41 and beginning of January 42....GP

< Message edited by General Patton -- 4/14/2016 3:30:57 PM >

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"Do everything you ask of those you command"....Gen. George S. Patton

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Post #: 129
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/14/2016 4:07:02 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Yup we do what we can to stop that but sometimes cannot be helped.

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Post #: 130
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/14/2016 6:01:14 PM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

There will be variants but I have learned my lesson not to start doing them until I have the core scenario done 1st

I am waiting on feedback and am also playing the scen myself on 4 day turns - up to Jan 43 so far.

To test and look for tweaks

My biggest gripe so far is the sheer number of Betty losses the range is simply to great on them and causes too many easy VP losses

Going to have to think about how I deal with it - I may end up reducing the range on the Betty in Mid 42 to mitigate losses or increase the range on some sort of fighter - not sure yet.

Andy

My vote: Boost the A6M3 DT range for Tier 1. Then for Tiers 2 & 3 simply allow it to arrive earlier. And boost the Nettie production/pools.




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Post #: 131
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/14/2016 6:02:30 PM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline 		When do you expect to put out an allied tier 1 for testing? Starting to see some light at the end of my tunnel and want to plan out some testing time for you.

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Post #: 132
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/15/2016 4:36:39 AM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		One problem I've come across is fewer pilots than airframes in quite a few IJ squadrons after a few months of combat. I have no idea if that can be helped.

Cheers,
CC

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Post #: 133
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/15/2016 10:41:56 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Months probably still working on the jap AI
quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

When do you expect to put out an allied tier 1 for testing? Starting to see some light at the end of my tunnel and want to plan out some testing time for you.


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Post #: 134
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/15/2016 10:42:43 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
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From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline
Its a common AI problem doesn't seem to affect raid density

quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody

One problem I've come across is fewer pilots than airframes in quite a few IJ squadrons after a few months of combat. I have no idea if that can be helped.

Cheers,
CC


(in reply to CaptBeefheart)
Post #: 135
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/15/2016 10:51:39 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Tier 3 is progressing nicely I now have 2 full AI scripts up and running just testing the second one mysefl
quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody

Hi Andy,

Just curious how the Tier 3 is coming along.

EDIT: I'd be happy to test a new iteration of the scenario.

Cheers,
CC


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Post #: 136
RE: Tier 3 Ironman - 4/16/2016 12:00:47 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Tier 3 is progressing nicely I now have 2 full AI scripts up and running just testing the second one mysefl


WOW!!!



That is massive progress. CONGRATS!!!

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Pax

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Post #: 137
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/16/2016 12:17:55 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Thanks Pax actually play as you want I want to see what works and doesnt work.

Re new bases how are they working out ??



Missed this, sorry.

NEw bases in Malay work good. The AI moves consistently which is a great improvement.

Forward deploying some Netties/Zeros to hinder Sir Robin from Singers would be a great thing. Allies simply cannot cover those TF's and the Netties will have a field day.



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Post #: 138
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/16/2016 12:19:11 AM   
PaxMondo


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Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline 		Andy,

Have you posted new files or are the ones in the first three posts still the ones to test?

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Post #: 139
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/19/2016 12:24:56 AM   
Lecivius


Posts: 4845
Joined: 8/5/2007
From: Denver
Status: offline 		A bit of misery here. I loaded the scen 10 file, ran a turn, PH got clobbered etc etc etc...spent an hour going through the clicks working my way across to the PI. I saved it under save 1 to finish up today. It's there, but fails to load OK, sucks to be me. I just did another scen 10, ran the turn, saved it to 2 without doing anything, still will not load. These are both Non Historical starts, if that matters. Scen 1 & 2 work OK, I have not tried any others. I noticed the new Ironman load to the 102 file.

I had just loaded the new files to the scenario files, adding them in rather than deleting any old ones. Is that where I broke this?

(in reply to DD696)
Post #: 140
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/19/2016 1:44:04 AM   
btd64


Posts: 9973
Joined: 1/23/2010
From: Mass. USA. now in Lancaster, OHIO
Status: offline 		Do you mean save slot 001 and 002?....GP

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Post #: 141
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/19/2016 4:14:28 AM   
Lecivius


Posts: 4845
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From: Denver
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Do you mean save slot 001 and 002?....GP


Correct, I'm sorry. I should have been much more descriptive. The saved games went into the 001 and 003 saved game slots. And now that I type that, that seems weird. I don't think I'm supposed to be able to save to the 001 saved game slot. The 002 is the Pre-turn, which has nothing of the previous combat turns in my Ironman games. But as I said, it works on the 001 and 002 scenarios. It's only on the 010 scenario that I have problems. I have not tried the 102 scenario yet. Perhaps I'll try that & see what works, and what does not.

(in reply to btd64)
Post #: 142
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/21/2016 9:18:54 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Weird this is the latest with the working version of script 2 still testing it myself but just in case it helps

ps I have said it before I really recmmmend helping the allies a bit in these scens (a large selection of ironman Allied Naval and Air units as well as aircraft have been left IN the scen files but disabled to make it easier to add in.

I play on 4 day turns un less something important is happening and I recently was in deep crap by Oct 42 v this script with a few extra allied toys.....

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Andy Mac -- 4/21/2016 9:22:32 PM >

(in reply to Lecivius)
Post #: 143
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/22/2016 6:20:05 AM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		Thanks. I'll try to find some time this weekend to fire this new one up.

Cheers,
CC

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Post #: 144
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/22/2016 10:54:53 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		ps I mean what I say Tier 3 is almost an AI autovictory in 42 without some allied help depending on what kind of game you want to play some help is advised.

I really hadnt realised how annoying the marauding japanese raiders were until I had to hunt them down and extermiante them myself

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Post #: 145
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/22/2016 12:48:15 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		I can't imagine how tough it is playing four day turns.

I usually play 1 day turns for the first day; then 2 day turns thereafter. Just playing 2 day days from day 1 increases the difficulty factor so much!

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Post #: 146
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 4/22/2016 12:55:48 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		AI allow myself to step down to 1 or 2 day turns or interupt a turn via F9 key if something happens so its not totally crazy

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Post #: 147
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 5/27/2016 3:00:38 PM   
Lecivius


Posts: 4845
Joined: 8/5/2007
From: Denver
Status: offline 		Just curious, did you tweak Japanese aircraft performance? I'm getting to August in this little gem ( and having a BLAST btw) and noticing Zeros, as well as Rufes, climbing at well over 4000 FPM, and up to a B-17's max altitude of 36k. I've lost entire bomb groups to fighters on CAP at 8-10000 ft with 6 minutes warning

Not complaining (any more than the typical AFB would ) Just curious as to what is going on.

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 148
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 5/29/2016 5:15:36 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Nope not a lot a little speed up I think but nothing dramatic - yet.....

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Post #: 149
RE: I need Help - AI Testing - 6/8/2016 3:02:24 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Anyone playing scen 1 or 2 feedback would be helpfull

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

I think I have articulated a few times that I am working on a new revised base Ai to try and reduce the waste in the AI or at least minimise it.

The background was the old WITP AI was much maligned as being too easy too predictable not worth playing too passive etc etc.

I don't actually agree with that what they achieved with what they had for a game of this compeity was spectacular

When we went into developing the AI for AE we tried to make it more dynamic but in essence because we couldn't get it to work
ended up reverting to a scripted AI which in essence has meant everyone has been playing me via proxy of the Ai for a number of years !!!

To try to get a bit of shock and awe in the AE AI I realised quite quickly that given time a player can set up roadblocks in bases that will stop the AI
taking "must take" bases

So as we got closer and closer to Gold the AI kept getting more and more aggressive as I ramped up the pressure and raided HI and other theatres for resources to
try and keep up the skeer while the Allies were weak.

For about 6 months after release all those years ago this worked and worked well - we are all used to the AI now and probably don't remember the initial shock when the AI
went back to PH for a 2nd strike - or hit PM in Dec 41 - or tried the Mersing Gambit or or or

However there was a price to the aggression

As players learned the game some or most of those early AI "lunges" and not fully supported invasions or the AI's tendency not to provide sufficient escorts made them horribly vulnerable

So after 6 months the Ai became a punchbag in Scen 1 and Scen 2

So the began my Ironman series where I give the AI enough resources to kaje a hit and keep swinging.

Anyway the reason for going through all this is that I have been working on a new baseline AI script I only have one variant so far and I need some folks to try it out while I keep testing

So I am attaching three scenarios to this thread

A New Scen 1
A new Scen 2

and a
new Tier 1 Ironman (i.e. Scen 10 equivalent where the AI does not get out right free stuff ie hidden supply but it does get large amounts of extra on map stuff and a much stronger starting
economy.

They all have the same AI script at present so I don't mind which scen people play but I need feedbhack to improve the script and KI simply don't have the time anymore to do it all myself.

So this is a plea for help

I will post the scenarios next

I need help on either assessing the scens so PBEM players telling whether especially Scen 2 is out of wack and the impact of the new bases

or

AI player telling me how the Ai plays out

Scen 1 (set to Scen 100) is in this post




(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 150
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