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Question - 7/31/2016 3:14:03 PM

miv792

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In Urumchi a large concentration of resources, thread who solved the problem with the export of these resources? because the road to all the bases with free access to the sea ...

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RE: Question - 7/31/2016 3:27:45 PM

Yaab

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Those huge pushes of oil/res/supply/fuel to biggest ports are observed in economies with a comprehensive rail network( India, Australia, Java, Japan, Malayas, Burma, USA, Canada, Ceylon, Soviet Union, Korea, Thailand, Indochina). China is a bit of grey territory.

From Urumchi to Kweisui,where the railroad starts, that is 30 hexes distance,and another 10 hexes to the nearest port.

Now if Sian were a port, that would be 28 hexes from Urumchi to Tienshui's railhead and 3 hexes to the Sian's port.

Seems Urumchi's goodies are glued to their birthplace for good.

EDIT: Wow, 2000 posts! How time flies...

< Message edited by Yaab -- 7/31/2016 3:29:16 PM >

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RE: Question - 7/31/2016 6:56:31 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: miv79

In Urumchi a large concentration of resources, thread who solved the problem with the export of these resources? because the road to all the bases with free access to the sea ...

Those resources can help the light industry at the more northern of the Chinese bases, and might also be available to the Russians when they activate (or maybe even before that?).

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RE: Question - 7/31/2016 10:37:17 PM

rustysi

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I have had limited success with getting oil out of Urumchi, but it takes a lot of effort. First off I had Siam and the other oil producer (don't recall the name) in between in my possession. Then I drained most of the oil from Port Arthur in order to create a demand there, in addition I set two small tankers there set to load oil. I also set two small tankers to load oil at Hankow(?), the one in China that's up river. At the other oil centers I turned the refineries off/on to let oil be pulled out or drawn in as needed. Urumchis' refinery is always turned off during this operation. At any rate if I played around with the settings I was able to get a good portion of the oil at Urumchi out. Never even attempted to get the resources. I imagine they'll come down when all else dries up.

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RE: Question - 8/1/2016 3:54:20 AM

PaxMondo

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+1

Get resources/oil out of Urumchi all the time. read Alfred's primer on the economy and apply concepts. Works easy peasy lemon squeazy.

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RE: Question - 8/1/2016 4:15:43 AM

miv792

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Siam and base before all Urumchi captured me, just looking at the eyes, and see that it is not reduced resources out there, but only increases. So for two months.

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RE: Question - 8/2/2016 12:54:37 AM

SheperdN7

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quote:

Those resources can help the light industry at the more northern of the Chinese bases, and might also be available to the Russians when they activate (or maybe even before that?).

BBFanboy, is there any way that those resources could even get to the Soviets?

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RE: Question - 8/2/2016 1:50:39 AM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SheperdN7

quote:

Those resources can help the light industry at the more northern of the Chinese bases, and might also be available to the Russians when they activate (or maybe even before that?).

BBFanboy, is there any way that those resources could even get to the Soviets?

Looks like lots of road links on-map and rail links leading off-map. Just not sure if supply flow is enabled for them.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 8/2/2016 1:56:14 AM >

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RE: Question - 8/2/2016 5:12:25 AM

PaxMondo

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They are, but the distance is great. You need to think through how resources move in the game. Then it is obvious what to do to get them to move. ... or just read Alfreds' economy treatise.

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RE: Question - 8/2/2016 7:38:07 AM

BBfanboy

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Ok - I did a test of the supply flow in a Scenario 1 game (from the Allied side).
First I selected Urumchi's hex and pressed the "5" key once to get the supply flow calculation (this can take a long time - minutes).
When the figures came up they ran up to the borders of Russia but did not cross. This also happened at the road running off-map to Alma Alta.
So it appears supply will not flow from China to an inactive Russia.

Then I de-selected Urumchi by pressing 5 again and selected the Russian base down near Tolun, and pressed 5 again. It took much longer for the calculations but supply was flowing into China from the Russian base. Picture below - apologies for the unwanted pop-up nearly covering the selected base (the one with 100 in the hex) but you get the idea.

The numbers appear to be percentages of the supply from the original hex that could reach the hexes shown. Actual supply flow would follow greatest demand rules.

Attachment (1)

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 12:16:09 AM

rustysi

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First off those numbers represent how many times a week supply will flow. Either once, twice, or four times a week. For instance ranges 89-100 I believe mean supply will flow to the hex four times a week. Below that its twice a week and eventually once. Don't know the ranges for those though. You can check in Alfred's 101. Secondly I don't think supply will flow from an inactive Soviet Union into China. Don't know why the numbers cross the border.

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 8:31:19 AM

szmike

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Supply flowing from SU to China was fixed in one of early patches.

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 10:16:50 AM

PaxMondo

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And if you do the same test for Urumchi you will see that resources can flow ... then using the 101 primer you can figure out what you need to do to increase that flow.

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 10:37:08 AM

Yaab

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And play some music while you at it like Suede's "Everything Will Flow".

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 4:46:02 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi

First off those numbers represent how many times a week supply will flow. Either once, twice, or four times a week. For instance ranges 89-100 I believe mean supply will flow to the hex four times a week. Below that its twice a week and eventually once. Don't know the ranges for those though. You can check in Alfred's 101. Secondly I don't think supply will flow from an inactive Soviet Union into China. Don't know why the numbers cross the border.

I do not accept your explanation regarding the numbers. The number of times per week is clearly not represented by numbers starting at 100 and declining as they move out from the selected base (presumably supply attrition with distance).

If the supply does not flow from Russia (the USSR was post-war) to China, then why did the map from my Urumchi selection show the flow stopping at the Russian border - i.e. why would it show "no flow" in that instance but NOT show "no flow" in the posted map?

As for the supply flow not happening - I am running the official update, not the latest Beta if the change was made since December 2014.
Again, the USSR probably does not have supply to spare on their side of the map so regardless of the POTENTIAL flow that the map indicates, the ACTUAL flow may be nil. When I check Russian bases they seem to have just enough to meet their needs and slowly upgrade/fill out TOE.

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 6:45:44 PM

GetAssista

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When I started constantly sucking oil and fuel out of Shanghai and Fusan, Urumchi gave up in a month and let stuff flow out
I got some oil stockpiled in PA to make sure refineries always run, other than that no additional settings

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 7:31:27 PM

szmike

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The numbers are declining by the cost of move of supplies through particular terrain. The highlight shows the cheapest path to a hex, not whether it actually flows. The number in particular hex probably determines how often supply flows (as in guide) and spoilage. Although I don't remember all the changes regarding spoilage of supplies through all patches, I think there is still some.

The fix to no supply from Soviet Union to China was in 2nd or 3rd official patch, certainly not beta.

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RE: Question - 8/3/2016 11:00:11 PM

rustysi

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quote:

The number in particular hex probably determines how often supply flows (as in guide)

Right, that's what Alfred's guide tells us. From game experience (no tests) I would have to confirm that is how it appears to be working. I check a unit and its supply is a bit low after a combat. Next turn it receives (in a good supply hex) supply and its back in business.

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RE: Question - 8/4/2016 1:07:21 AM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi

quote:

The number in particular hex probably determines how often supply flows (as in guide)

Right, that's what Alfred's guide tells us. From game experience (no tests) I would have to confirm that is how it appears to be working. I check a unit and its supply is a bit low after a combat. Next turn it receives (in a good supply hex) supply and its back in business.

Ok - I was understanding frequency of supply flow as being the weekly frequency - i.e. large bases get it daily, medium bases a few times a week and small bases once a week. That is why the numbers to me did not indicate frequency, just flow potential.

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RE: Question - 8/4/2016 4:25:47 AM

rustysi

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Yeah, I'm not talking bases here, I'm talking outflow to those hexes with the numbers. Although it may be the same for the bases, not really sure. One of the many grey areas for me.

Of course for anything to flow out to the hexes the base needs adequate supply or all bets are off.

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RE: Question - 8/5/2016 1:06:47 AM

jolly_pillager

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Oil comes out fine for me...fuel not so much.

Resources don't matter, there is plenty coming in from elsewhere.

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RE: Question - 8/5/2016 4:47:54 AM

rustysi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jolly_pillager

Oil comes out fine for me...fuel not so much.

Resources don't matter, there is plenty coming in from elsewhere.

That's been my experience too. I imagine the fuel could flow, but there would have to be demand somewhere up there, and that would probably mean that HI would need it. There's not much up there, although I guess you could try and tanker it out. I bet if you let it sit there long enough it'll come out at the end when things begin to dry up. Kinda like a last gasp reserve.

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RE: Question - 8/23/2016 6:35:49 PM

AW1Steve

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I have a special request and appeal to anyone asking "general questions", "stupid questions" or any question that doesn't really ASK THE QUESTION. This forum has a barely functioning search function at best. Unless we wish to have an endless array of the same , exact question asked again, and again and again..... let's at least TRY to make it possible for a newbie , or perhaps even an oldie to research the answer to a question. I'd imagine that it's usually the same people who have to answer the same question , they'd support me in this. While we appreciate the attempt to be self denigrating and humble how about phrasing the question as "a stupid question about----", or better yet how about "SQA----" as in "stupid question about". I don't know about other forumites , but I'd appreciate anything that makes it easier to search a subject without reading every single entry. Thank you.

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RE: QuestionClarification on asking Questions ~ Please ... - 8/23/2016 8:41:18 PM

Macclan5

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Hi Steve

I think what you are asking is for posters to use the specific "terminology" in the subject line ??

This makes it easier to search using the search engine.

Is that the point of the post ? Or am I off base ?

This sort of thing?

RE: Reference clarification please... APA vs AP or xAP ...

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4079176

Logistics 101 continued - clarification

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4068928

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RE: QuestionClarification on asking Questions ~ Please ... - 8/23/2016 9:00:47 PM

AW1Steve

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Macclan5

Hi Steve

I think what you are asking is for posters to use the specific "terminology" in the subject line ??

This makes it easier to search using the search engine.

Is that the point of the post ? Or am I off base ?

This sort of thing?

RE: Reference clarification please... APA vs AP or xAP ...

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4079176

Logistics 101 continued - clarification

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4068928

Pretty much. Terminology is great if known, but even a header like "A question on pilot training" would be much, much more helpful. The problem with a general heading like "questions" is that it generates, if you'll pardon the pun, Too many LOOSE threads.