Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ormbane

The question of what makes or keeps a forum friendly is interesting. It seems, however, that no matter how friendly and welcoming a forum is in our modern world sooner or later trolls happen. I recently read a synopsis of one study that was done on the nature of trolls. Some people were identified and interviewed that frequently troll forums, and their "real lives" were examined as well. Unfortunately the synopsis didn't go into what psychological factors may or may not have led people to become trolls, but the synopsis reported that the study concluded that trolls, in general, are "losers" (their word, not mine) in real life. So, given that trolls happen, the common folk wisdom that has grown up is simply, "don't feed the trolls" in order to keep a discussion on track and friendly, whereas the purpose of trolls is normally to get things off track and argumentative (or worse).

That said, I personally enjoy this forum and treasure the straight, matter-of-fact input from people like Geofflambert and the gentle, patient but precise responses from people like Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Timotheus

They are bad even by 1980 BBS standards! Disorganized, unhelpful mess for every game.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

People always left when I entered a bar and wanted to talk with em They said behind my back "not this guy again wanna talk about his latest carrier battle in some BS computer game"

quote:

ORIGINAL: Timotheus

In the USA and Western Europe, anytime someone states something challenging and/or controversial there are usually two reactions:
1) He's a troll, ignore what he wrote, usually followed by
2) Ban him and delete what he wrote.

Pathetic. Scary that old marines and soldiers have reached this level of "I need my safe space". Expected better... Shouldn't have. I guess western society is worse off now than I expected.


I stand by what I said, several attempts at derailing and (just terrible) puns and jokes notwithstanding.

This game is an incredibly complicated one. But whereas in other games/hobbies people who love said games/hobbies make every effort to promote, entice, and then to help new "recruits" (so to speak), here there is none of that.

The "old guard" does zero effort to help their hobby (i.e. WITPAE).

Their effort, such as it is, is limited to deigning to a reply to a forum post asking for help on a specific topic... or making a joke about it. Or putting down a complete newbie who does a youtube series to promote the game (granted, he was terrible, but he is learning and actually not making many mistakes now).

There was some effort at tutorials/guides.... but that happened roughly 10-15 years ago.

What is needed is actual guides and tutorials, ones that are hopefully after the year A.D. 2000!

What guides there are are scattered all over the place, some are in the (terrifyingly mismanaged, just a mess) sticky section - many are not and so are lost in the forum.

I expect a comeback of "troll" and "ban" - par for the course, when there are no arguments and dealing with a modern western "man".
I also expect the "Use the forum search function!", which is also expected due to lazy, zero effort of the "old guard" to grow the community and help newcomers.

A lot of this stems from matrix forums - they are godawful and their design is the worst I've seen. Clutter everywhere, sticky topics of a sale that happened 5 years ago blocking the page, actual helpful posts and tutorials and guides either very hard to find in the "stickies" topics or not there at all ("Use the forum search function!" - yeah, right, good luck with that).


So, zero effort to grow and help the community, those who do their efforts are lost in the ether and hard to find.


PS
Someone make a youtube guide with voice over that can be actually understood, for ***** sake. That's the minimum that should happen.
I would argue that matrix, the company, SHOULD ITSELF do this - video tutorials on youtube/matrix page.

But we're dealing with a company stuck in the 1980's boardgame era who are proud to sell/move as few units as possible (despite having some fantastic games, like Distant Worlds which I wrote a guide for), and zero marketing and promotional know how.


So, I expect some pithy, terrible puns and jokes, perhaps a ban and nothing to change ("We are working on the stickies" - yeah, when in an American company an exec/employee says to expect something to happen as they are "working on it".... it will happen...after 25 years or so).


Extra:
Look up Steam. See that GUIDE tab on every game? If a game is complicated and the community needs it, members will STEP UP and write/post a guide or two to help new players. See how easy it is to organize something like that ("But we have WAR ROOM" - yeah, it's not clear what the **** it is, really, and what should go in there. GUIDE is much clearer).

Look up Distant Worlds on Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/app/261470/guides/?searchText=&browsefilter=mostrecent&browsesort=creationorder&requiredtags%5B%5D=-1

One of these guides is mine, actually, as I really loved this game and played the heck out of it and wanted others to experience it - and they were stopped by "game plays itself" and "what do I do, there are no guides and it's so complicated".

Seriously, matrix, I love your hardcore, niche games, but your website and forum suck. They are bad even by 1980 BBS standards! Disorganized, unhelpful mess for every game.

Grab your ***** and fix your ****, matrix.

quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson
This game has one of the toughest learning curves of any game out there, even with help. It takes a while just to get competent and I'm not sure it can be mastered.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Timotheus

In the USA and Western Europe, anytime someone states something challenging and/or controversial there are usually two reactions:
1) He's a troll, ignore what he wrote, usually followed by
2) Ban him and delete what he wrote.

Pathetic. Scary that old marines and soldiers have reached this level of "I need my safe space". Expected better... Shouldn't have. I guess western society is worse off now than I expected.


I stand by what I said, several attempts at derailing and (just terrible) puns and jokes notwithstanding.

This game is an incredibly complicated one. But whereas in other games/hobbies people who love said games/hobbies make every effort to promote, entice, and then to help new "recruits" (so to speak), here there is none of that.

The "old guard" does zero effort to help their hobby (i.e. WITPAE).

Their effort, such as it is, is limited to deigning to a reply to a forum post asking for help on a specific topic... or making a joke about it. Or putting down a complete newbie who does a youtube series to promote the game (granted, he was terrible, but he is learning and actually not making many mistakes now).

There was some effort at tutorials/guides.... but that happened roughly 10-15 years ago.

What is needed is actual guides and tutorials, ones that are hopefully after the year A.D. 2000!

What guides there are are scattered all over the place, some are in the (terrifyingly mismanaged, just a mess) sticky section - many are not and so are lost in the forum.

I expect a comeback of "troll" and "ban" - par for the course, when there are no arguments and dealing with a modern western "man".
I also expect the "Use the forum search function!", which is also expected due to lazy, zero effort of the "old guard" to grow the community and help newcomers.

A lot of this stems from matrix forums - they are godawful and their design is the worst I've seen. Clutter everywhere, sticky topics of a sale that happened 5 years ago blocking the page, actual helpful posts and tutorials and guides either very hard to find in the "stickies" topics or not there at all ("Use the forum search function!" - yeah, right, good luck with that).


So, zero effort to grow and help the community, those who do their efforts are lost in the ether and hard to find.


PS
Someone make a youtube guide with voice over that can be actually understood, for ***** sake. That's the minimum that should happen.
I would argue that matrix, the company, SHOULD ITSELF do this - video tutorials on youtube/matrix page.

But we're dealing with a company stuck in the 1980's boardgame era who are proud to sell/move as few units as possible (despite having some fantastic games, like Distant Worlds which I wrote a guide for), and zero marketing and promotional know how.


So, I expect some pithy, terrible puns and jokes, perhaps a ban and nothing to change ("We are working on the stickies" - yeah, when in an American company an exec/employee says to expect something to happen as they are "working on it".... it will happen...after 25 years or so).


Extra:
Look up Steam. See that GUIDE tab on every game? If a game is complicated and the community needs it, members will STEP UP and write/post a guide or two to help new players. See how easy it is to organize something like that ("But we have WAR ROOM" - yeah, it's not clear what the **** it is, really, and what should go in there. GUIDE is much clearer).

Look up Distant Worlds on Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/app/261470/guides/?searchText=&browsefilter=mostrecent&browsesort=creationorder&requiredtags%5B%5D=-1

One of these guides is mine, actually, as I really loved this game and played the heck out of it and wanted others to experience it - and they were stopped by "game plays itself" and "what do I do, there are no guides and it's so complicated".

Seriously, matrix, I love your hardcore, niche games, but your website and forum suck. They are bad even by 1980 BBS standards! Disorganized, unhelpful mess for every game.

Grab your ***** and fix your ****, matrix.

quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

We need to defend the game and the forum so that people who stop by to look don't swallow what the odd Timotheus says, someone who is into fantasy games and not historical games. I think that is his fundamental problem. This is the best historical wargame in existence bar nothing, even trolls. He should return to the games he likes and the forums he likes and stop vandalizing this one. Our moderator will not block him and shouldn't. He's clearly intelligent but hasn't been particularly abusive in a personal fashion, hasn't talked about politics or religion. He doesn't understand that this is not just a game. It's the best simulation I've ever seen attempted of historical fact. Gorns are not real, I just do that for laughs. What is STEAM? Is that for laughs too?

quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson
This game has one of the toughest learning curves of any game out there, even with help. It takes a while just to get competent and I'm not sure it can be mastered.

quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958
How would you compare this game's learning curve and ability to play competently to that of MWiF?

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Are you talking about "world in flames"?....GP

quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson
This game has one of the toughest learning curves of any game out there, even with help. It takes a while just to get competent and I'm not sure it can be mastered.

How would you compare this game's learning curve and ability to play competently to that of MWiF?

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: Timotheus

In the USA and Western Europe, anytime someone states something challenging and/or controversial there are usually two reactions:
1) He's a troll, ignore what he wrote, usually followed by
2) Ban him and delete what he wrote.

Pathetic.

quote:

yeah, when in an American company an exec/employee says to expect something to happen as they are "working on it".... it will happen...after 25 years or so).

quote:

I expect a comeback of "troll" and "ban" - par for the course, when there are no arguments and dealing with a modern western "man".

quote:

A lot of this stems from matrix forums - they are godawful and their design is the worst I've seen.

quote:

So, zero effort to grow and help the community, those who do their efforts are lost in the ether and hard to find.

quote:

The "old guard" does zero effort to help their hobby (i.e. WITPAE).

quote:

This game is an incredibly complicated one. But whereas in other games/hobbies people who love said games/hobbies make every effort to promote, entice, and then to help new "recruits" (so to speak), here there is none of that.

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

People always left when I entered a bar and wanted to talk with em They said behind my back "not this guy again wanna talk about his latest carrier battle in some BS computer game"

quote:


This game is an incredibly complicated one. But whereas in other games/hobbies people who love said games/hobbies make every effort to promote, entice, and then to help new "recruits" (so to speak), here there is none of that.

The "old guard" does zero effort to help their hobby (i.e. WITPAE).

Their effort, such as it is, is limited to deigning to a reply to a forum post asking for help on a specific topic... or making a joke about it. Or putting down a complete newbie who does a youtube series to promote the game (granted, he was terrible, but he is learning and actually not making many mistakes now).

There was some effort at tutorials/guides.... but that happened roughly 10-15 years ago.