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To Win, Just to Lose

 
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To Win, Just to Lose - 12/2/2016 8:31:15 PM   
BMBUSWELL

 

Posts: 4
Joined: 10/12/2016
Status: offline
Old Time Gamer here and have enjoyed this new release - thoughtful and entertaining.

Would suggest a few things to improve game play. This is from playing from 1939 on only, can not comment on shorter scenarios.
1) I took Poland, took France. Used 3/4 research, 1/4 new units. Accepted Vichy and Russian owning 1/2 Poland. While I questioned some of the battle outcomes it generally seemed balanced except for that fact that the capitals had to be taken in all cases for the troops to be significantly de-moralized.
2) I eliminated the British navy in the Mediterranean once the Italians came in and I eliminated the British and American navy in several battles in the English channel while preparing for English invasion - my comment is 'so what', other than facilitating the invasion, which is only needed briefly, defeating their navies helped me not in Malta, Gibralter, Egypt, nor any other area. My navy ruled the seas until I got tired of the game in late '45, focusing on sinking the unending invasion transports from America.
3) I conquered England, got Spain and Ireland on my side and thought that removing the second front would be advantageous - wrong.
4) I conquered Egypt and Iraq, thinking the oil would be good for me, but it is only related as MPP, and limited at that.
5) So with England, Egypt, Iraq gone, Spain and Ireland on my side, oh yes, I conquered Iceland too, English Navy Gone and my combined Italian and German fleets killing anything coming out of America, you would think the game is pretty much well in hand, but no - so I have a major gripe with that, no peace terms, no advantages other than limited MPP garnering in killing/winning all of this.
6) With Russia, they enter the war in late '41 as I am about two months from finishing off England, but I have many Corp stationed back east just in case, but surprise/surprise, the Russians are better than I am. Within 12 months they have flooded the Eastern front with so many armies and various troops that they are 4 deep from anywhere on the front line. Not only that, they research at a huge pace, going to level 3, 4, then 5 by early 1944?? This is a large problem for anyone playing the campaign. By 1943 I cannot attack at all and have to use 600MP per turn to recover forces, not allowing any more research and limited unit building. Russian units were NEVER as good as German counter parts, given equal forces, at any time in the war. They NEVER had jets (especially by 1944) nor tanks better than early IS series before the end of the war. With level 5 on seemingly everything, and unlimited troops, I have found the game totally unwinnable for the German.
7) As mentioned before, the rate of research and types of research available to the Allies is unreasonable and unrealistic - I had a level 5 American troop transport 'evade' 3 wolf pack attacks with 10 strength level subs in hunting mode. And they were surrounded and sighted by aircraft carrier (Graf Spee) aircraft (which attack they also 'evaded'). That comes across so silly as to eliminate the joy in playing.
8) So the Russians win in late '45 with unending attacks, starting at their border (I never invaded), with troops that are equivalent to Germans and being replaced at a seemingly unlimited pace, the report puts the combined Russian/allied troop loss at four times that of the Germans. But bit by bit they crawl forward, even with fortifications built, plenty of tanks and other units. Can not use my air force as everything the allies have is level 5 jet aircraft that shoots down 100% of my aircraft every time, even if it is level 5 as well.
9) Research on the allies should be limited and longer, no quick research, and no level 5 for ANY of the allies until mid '45, and then only for tanks, please! Not only is that more historical, it enhances the game play.
10) Figure in the morale, production, and diplomacy better so that if the Germans conquer Everything as I did (except America and Russia), there is some benefit to that. I CAN NOT believe that after I sank 20 corp and 5 armies (not including the tanks, additional types and Eisenhower, Patton, etc.)at sea throughout 43 and 44 that America would in any way be in the mix.
11) I destroyed the English and American navies in 41 and 42 (the pacific fleet was moved to the Atlantic according to the dialogs), and yet the Americans did just fine against the Japanese??? No impact to the pacific region, which would impact whatever the Americans are doing with the Russians???
12) I also find it an issue that my production costs never go down, from 41 to 45 it costs the same, and excessively for units, even though I am never bombed. While I realize there is research to lower unit costs, I would suggest you can not use that research, ever, and hope to contain the allies in a reasonable fashion, plus, industry improvement and growth happens at a minimum level automatically in a society, not by allocating research time and money at it. It should not cost me 200 to build a basic tech based unit in 45. Also, researching infantry weapons should not cost so much and take so much time either, that is very much not reflected in history. If you are using that aspect for 'balancing' I might suggest another area.
I am impressed with your AI, it was well rounded, but the surrounding engine and values I think need to be re-evaluated if this game is to become a standard. I want to play the strategy aspect of the game, but can not due to the weight given to the Allies. Did you design the game with the underlying premise that the Axis can not win under any circumstance?

Thanks and keep up the good work!
Post #: 1
RE: To Win, Just to Lose - 12/3/2016 3:16:32 AM   
n0kn0k

 

Posts: 564
Joined: 6/23/2007
Status: offline
What difficulty level was this at? I did the same except I beat the Sovjets before taking out anything other then the UK.
Doing a Sealion + iceland and Ireland will hurt your chances in the east as it costs time. It will be a slugfest then for sure. Sinking the transports is what I did also. That works.

(in reply to BMBUSWELL)
Post #: 2
RE: To Win, Just to Lose - 12/4/2016 9:04:17 PM   
BMBUSWELL

 

Posts: 4
Joined: 10/12/2016
Status: offline
Straight up default difficulty. Agreed that the consequences to the East was time, it just seems on the surface that completely eliminating the second front has no benefit, only consequences, which defies my internal logic.

(in reply to n0kn0k)
Post #: 3
RE: To Win, Just to Lose - 12/17/2016 2:27:49 PM   
Yogol

 

Posts: 199
Joined: 11/30/2016
Status: offline
Hi,

I intend to replay this (Sealion and no Russian invasion), except for this part...


quote:

ORIGINAL: BMBUSWELL

12) I also find it an issue that my production costs never go down, from 41 to 45 it costs the same, and excessively for units, even though I am never bombed. While I realize there is research to lower unit costs, I would suggest you can not use that research, ever, and hope to contain the allies in a reasonable fashion, plus, industry improvement and growth happens at a minimum level automatically in a society, not by allocating research time and money at it. It should not cost me 200 to build a basic tech based unit in 45. Also, researching infantry weapons should not cost so much and take so much time either, that is very much not reflected in history. If you are using that aspect for 'balancing' I might suggest another area.


Researching your techs is VITAL for Germany. With only 600 MPP in "Production Technology", you will (eventually) get a 25% discount on all repairs and units instead of the 5% you start with.
That has a HUGE effect on your military MPP efficiency. You cannot ignore that and hope to win.

The same for the 800 MPP investment in Industrial Technology. Those 800MPPs will eventually more than DOUBLE your MPP income (making your Industrial Modifier going from going from 55 to 115 with Germany).
This is an absolute must-do.

The "Logistic Technology" is also needed because when you have so many more MPPs and military units cost so much less, you will have a lot of units, so you need more HQs: every army, bomber, fighter, mechanised, artillery and tank should always be under HQ control. And you max out at 7 units per HQ, so you'll need all the HQs you can to command them all.



The last one ("Spying and Intelligence") is more debatable, but a pretty solid investment.
I didn't do the exact math, but Spying helps raises the % that the other techs advance each turn.
So, the more things your researching, the higher advantage you get from Spying, because it raises the % per turn for EACH ongoing research.
With a total investment of 750MPP in it, all your other research will go so much faster (at least until one of your enemies get to 5 too).

< Message edited by Yogol -- 12/17/2016 2:57:48 PM >

(in reply to BMBUSWELL)
Post #: 4
RE: To Win, Just to Lose - 12/18/2016 3:13:10 AM   
Capitaine

 

Posts: 1043
Joined: 1/15/2002
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BMBUSWELL

Straight up default difficulty. Agreed that the consequences to the East was time, it just seems on the surface that completely eliminating the second front has no benefit, only consequences, which defies my internal logic.


It doesn't have any effect, as I alluded to in my "British Defeat" thread. Completely nullifies any strategic decisions in the game. If you can't gain an advantage by knocking Britain out of the war what's the point of playing the Axis? Conquest rules are poorly thought through.

(in reply to BMBUSWELL)
Post #: 5
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