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"Unused convoys"? - 1/12/2017 7:33:04 PM   
Ubercat

 

Posts: 100
Joined: 12/19/2007
From: Near Allentown, PA
Status: offline 		I'm having another go at the game after a couple of years to let more patching happen.

I'm in the setup phase and just checked on unused convoys in the Production Planning Window to see how I could squeeze out a route to get one more RP to England for a factory. I relocated an "unused" convoy and it inadvertently idled one of the trade Oil RP's from the East Indies, which I'd already set up a route to England for (where it was being saved).

Why would a convoy be listed as unused when it clearly isn't?

Thanks!

Dabrion, your input isn't desired and won't be of any use. We already know that the game sucks and Steve is the devil. You did your job.

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Post #: 1
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 1/12/2017 8:06:36 PM   
juntoalmar


Posts: 601
Joined: 9/29/2013
From: Valencia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ubercat
Dabrion, your input isn't desired and won't be of any use. We already know that the game sucks and Steve is the devil. You did your job.


Lol

Regarding the convoy. I'm not completely sure, but I think that if you set the resource to "Overrided" your decision will be "sticky" and won't be changed after you modify the available convoys units in the sea.

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(in reply to Ubercat)
Post #: 2
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 1/13/2017 12:39:31 PM   
Centuur


Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline 		I haven't seen mr. Dabrion for a long time now...

Production planning has a couple of things one should be aware of. It has a way of doing things on it's own. It really is somewhat of an AI and thinks for you. That means that it is a stubborn part of the program.

The best way to go with production is first to set up the convoy chain you want to be in place during setup. Now, if you are doing this for a scenario starting in S/O 1939, remember that all major powers (except Japan and China) are neutral. That means that France cannot transport CW resources and vice versa. So examining a production planning form before the DoW of France and the CW on Germany might not give you the result you are aiming for (especially if you need French convoy points transporting CW resources and the other way around). This might result in unused convoy points.
This also means that it is better to wait with changing your production planning forms until the war has started.

Personally, I make my calculations on which convoys to put where for myself, and put the convoys on the map. Than I'll see what happens, try to maintain the convoy chain in place and don't look at the production planning form at all. I make my changes during the preliminary production planning phase itself.
This is due to the fact that whenever an attack on a convoy chain occurs, and convoys are lost or aborted, that build in AI will mess things up again.





< Message edited by Centuur -- 1/13/2017 12:41:03 PM >

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RE: "Unused convoys"? - 1/13/2017 3:18:25 PM   
juntoalmar


Posts: 601
Joined: 9/29/2013
From: Valencia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I haven't seen mr. Dabrion for a long time now...



I've heard that if you repeat AI or Multiplayer three times, you can summon him.

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(in reply to Centuur)
Post #: 4
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 4/20/2017 2:55:38 PM   
Dabrion


Posts: 733
Joined: 11/5/2013
From: Northpole
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ubercat
Dabrion, your input isn't desired and won't be of any use. We already know that the game sucks and Steve is the devil. You did your job.


lol

I will spare you my input and just say this: I want my money back!

_____________________________

“WiF is like sex: sure, it may give some practical results, but that's not why we do it.”
- Richard P. Feynman, 'WiF, Sex, and the Dual Slit Experiment'.

(in reply to Ubercat)
Post #: 5
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 4/21/2017 10:13:02 AM   
RFalvo69


Posts: 1380
Joined: 7/11/2013
From: Lamezia Terme (Italy)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur
Production planning has a couple of things one should be aware of. It has a way of doing things on it's own. It really is somewhat of an AI and thinks for you. That means that it is a stubborn part of the program.


This also means that, in all fairness, it is not true that MWIF hasn't an AI opponent: it actually has multiple AIs, and you fight ALL of them...

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"Oh dad... so you were a God-damned cook?"

(My 10 years old daughter after watching "The Hunt for Red October")

(in reply to Centuur)
Post #: 6
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 4/21/2017 10:39:21 PM   
Shannon V. OKeets

 

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline 		I'm in Philadelphia at the moment and having my owns problems, ... see below.

Before I left yesterday I almost finished my rewrite of the overseas routing of resources. They no longer use 'extra' convoys. The routes the program finds use the minimum number of convoys to get resource R to destination D. The last bug I was working on - but couldn't fix before I left - was that the program permitted routing resource over sea areas twice. For example, the Alaska oil was shipped to Canada, across Canada, then to the East Coast and eventually to the Bay of Biscay from where it reached England. While on the plane, I figured out the solution to that bug, but I won't be back in Hawaii for another week.

I've also fixed a half dozen other bugs in Production Planning. The only big one remaining is to store 'modified' routes separately in memory and try to use them before searching for new routes. The code already stores override, default, and last turn routes so adding another won't be a big deal. That should clear up any remaining problems with player specified routes being 'forgotten' by the program.By 'routes' here I include the destination and action (i.e., save/produce) also.

It will be a couple of weeks before these changes are available for customers - I want the beta testers to beat on the changed code for a week before releasing a Public Beta. All of this is for creating a new official Update. Note that these fixes are for problems reported in Solitaire/Head-to-head play [they will also affect NetPlay obviously].

===

My problem with my laptop is that I didn't install the full game. Nor do I have all the ancillary files I need to download stuff from the Members Club, or other Matrix FTP sites for MWIF development. Sigh, ... All I wanted to do was play the game. If I had just brought the CDs, ... I have several computers at home with the full game, but I never put it on the laptop, ... I have the latest MWIF.exe and several saved games, ... Back to reading the books I brought for the 12 hour plane rides.

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Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to RFalvo69)
Post #: 7
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 6/8/2017 2:35:05 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
Before I left yesterday I almost finished my rewrite of the overseas routing of resources. They no longer use 'extra' convoys. The routes the program finds use the minimum number of convoys to get resource R to destination D. The last bug I was working on - but couldn't fix before I left - was that the program permitted routing resource over sea areas twice. For example, the Alaska oil was shipped to Canada, across Canada, then to the East Coast and eventually to the Bay of Biscay from where it reached England. While on the plane, I figured out the solution to that bug, but I won't be back in Hawaii for another week.

I've also fixed a half dozen other bugs in Production Planning. The only big one remaining is to store 'modified' routes separately in memory and try to use them before searching for new routes. The code already stores override, default, and last turn routes so adding another won't be a big deal. That should clear up any remaining problems with player specified routes being 'forgotten' by the program.By 'routes' here I include the destination and action (i.e., save/produce) also.


As v2.5.1 gets ready for official release and players get back into the game, could we get a quick summary of how the recent changes may be different than how things are described in the rules or shown on the tutorial video? Could we maybe get an updated tutorial video included in the official release to help us understand the new steps for setting up and changing convoys and production? Thanks.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)
Post #: 8
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 6/8/2017 11:25:57 PM   
paulderynck


Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline 		I doubt there are enough changes to require a tutorial. Things still work as they were supposed to... or maybe things work now when before they didn't, or maybe they work even better.

< Message edited by paulderynck -- 6/9/2017 2:22:50 AM >

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Post #: 9
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 6/9/2017 12:28:55 AM   
davidachamberlain

 

Posts: 326
Joined: 1/21/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pzgndr

As v2.5.1 gets ready for official release and players get back into the game, could we get a quick summary of how the recent changes may be different than how things are described in the rules or shown on the tutorial video? Could we maybe get an updated tutorial video included in the official release to help us understand the new steps for setting up and changing convoys and production? Thanks.


If anything, it should work more like the documentation and the tutorials.

What has happened is when you did it (the proper way), it did not save them as expected. This usually resulted in losing out on a few resources and build point.

There is nothing in how things are done that has changed.

Use the existing documentation.

Dave

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 10
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 6/9/2017 12:42:39 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck
Things still work as they were supposed to... or maybe things work now when before they didn't, or maybe they work even better.


Thanks, just wanted to check if there were any UI differences now that might have needed clarification. Standing by for the official update.

(in reply to paulderynck)
Post #: 11
RE: "Unused convoys"? - 6/9/2017 6:07:40 PM   
paulderynck


Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline 		It is here... well the public beta is here... unless you meant an official public release...

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4296085

< Message edited by paulderynck -- 6/11/2017 9:01:20 PM >

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Post #: 12
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