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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> Unit weight calculation? Page: [1]
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Unit weight calculation? - 7/16/2016 4:02:38 PM   
NikolaiEzhov


Posts: 738
Joined: 7/23/2014
Status: offline 		The weight of Truck is always calculated as 3,000 kg, whatever I have changed the data by Equipment Editor.
Likely, the weight of all Artillery Pieces are always calculated as 2,000 kg, squads are 1,000 kg.
I added 1000 APC of 22,500 kg weight each, and end up with a unit of 13500 ton.
However, 1000 BMP-3 of 18,700 kg weight make a unit of 18,750 ton.
Why?

< Message edited by NikolaiEzhov -- 7/16/2016 4:06:18 PM >

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Post #: 1
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 7/16/2016 7:21:47 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 5104
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline 		One truck is not one truck. It is an unspecified number of trucks. One 'truck' can move an entire division. However, if you have a truck that has weapons it is one truck for combat purposes. So, one truck is an unspecified number of trucks except in combat when it becomes one truck. Try and wrap your head around that logic. Whenever I try to get someone who has anything to do with this game to explain this they just blow me off as though it were an unimportant question. But it isn't unimportant because half tracks are combat vehicles and 'trucks' at the same time. So one half track 'truck' is any number of trucks and can carry a whole division but in combat it's only one vehicle. I think by the time Norm got to this part of the game he was either totally fatigued and didn't care or was a bit tipsy. And evidently it's either too hard to fix or people are too lazy to fix it or it's considered unimportant because with all of the iterations of the game it has never been addressed.

Also, I too have never been able to solve the weight puzzle of this game. I just shrug my shoulders and go on as with most other things considered unimportant by certain people.

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Post #: 2
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 7/16/2016 9:03:19 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 12969
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NikolaiEzhov

The weight of Truck is always calculated as 3,000 kg, whatever I have changed the data by Equipment Editor.
Likely, the weight of all Artillery Pieces are always calculated as 2,000 kg, squads are 1,000 kg.
I added 1000 APC of 22,500 kg weight each, and end up with a unit of 13500 ton.
However, 1000 BMP-3 of 18,700 kg weight make a unit of 18,750 ton.
Why?


I discussed this a bit in my article (found in the "Manuals" folder) "How to Edit the Equipment Database.pdf". See pages 9 & 10.

The "weight" parameter is not actually used. Rather, armored vehicle weights are determined from their DF parameters.

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Post #: 3
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 7/17/2016 2:21:17 PM   
NikolaiEzhov


Posts: 738
Joined: 7/23/2014
Status: offline 		Many thanks.
I should have read the manual....
But what about the unarmored vehicles and towed artillery? Totally not mentioned in the manual.
I am working on a sea-lift-critical scenario so I have to define the weight of all types of ordnance.

< Message edited by NikolaiEzhov -- 7/17/2016 2:48:48 PM >

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RE: Unit weight calculation? - 7/17/2016 3:22:43 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 12969
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NikolaiEzhov

Many thanks.
I should have read the manual....
But what about the unarmored vehicles and towed artillery? Totally not mentioned in the manual.
I am working on a sea-lift-critical scenario so I have to define the weight of all types of ordnance.


It seemed like you had that figured out.

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Post #: 5
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 7/17/2016 7:34:42 PM   
NikolaiEzhov


Posts: 738
Joined: 7/23/2014
Status: offline 		Not really.
I don't know if I have missed anything, but the DF value does not effect on unarmored vehicles such as Trucks or artillery pieces at all.

< Message edited by NikolaiEzhov -- 7/17/2016 7:38:28 PM >

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Post #: 6
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 12/9/2016 12:49:23 PM   
Rescue193

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 6/13/2016
Status: offline 		Here's another little wrinkle to the 'weight' problem.

In the "A Bridge too Far" scenario as incorporated in the last up-date, the 9 Field Engineering Company of 1 Air Landing Brigade has 45(!) Marmon-Herrington IV armoured cars allocated to it. The number and type notwithstanding (and both are highly fanciful) if you load the unit and then unload it - Presto! - the total lift capacity is increased by the unit's weight. Do this multiple times and you can fly all three airborne divisions to Holland on the first lift!

The same glitch exists with the engineering units in the 52 Lowland Div. Load and unload the engineers multiple times and you can fly the whole division into Holland in one turn!

I'm not sure why this works but its obviously something to do with armoured cars because, if they are deleted from the unit strength, this rather useful (but, I assume, totally unintended and wholly unfair) little bonus disappears.

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Post #: 7
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 12/9/2016 1:53:46 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 5104
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline 		I suspect there is a hard coded transport capability for recon vehicles. Just a guess on my part. But yeah, bugged.

< Message edited by Lobster -- 12/9/2016 1:54:07 PM >

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Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity and I’m not sure about the universe-Einstein

Q: What do you call a boomerang that doesn’t come back?
A: A stick.

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Post #: 8
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 3/8/2017 2:18:15 AM   
Grognard


Posts: 216
Joined: 6/24/2004
From: Madison, Wisconsin
Status: offline 		Quick reply off the top of my head - still with a bug.

In my remembered experience - also from "A Bridge too Far":
Unit weight prior to airlift/airborne embarkation reflects vehicular transport.
Upon embarkation the vehicular transport weight is subtracted from the airlift weight used and (the transport) not landed when flown.
(Put into the equipment pool???)
If you disembark in place that transport weight is (mistakenly) added back (an exploit rather than a glitch?).

This is why you can embark units much heavier than the remaining airlift available - 52nd Lowland Engineers being an excellent example....
- but not an exploit as long as you fly them.
Units will arrive at the DZ/LZ minus the transport which appears (again, from the equipment pool??) subsequently.

The bug being - deuce & a half, M3, any prime carrier, etc, et al in numbers in the air at all? Always a very guilty pleasure for me.

The Red Devils were doomed from the git-go... The Deelen option is the ONLY way they survive...






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Post #: 9
RE: Unit weight calculation? - 5/9/2017 4:21:22 PM   
KungPao


Posts: 333
Joined: 4/25/2016
From: Red China
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NikolaiEzhov

Many thanks.
I should have read the manual....
But what about the unarmored vehicles and towed artillery? Totally not mentioned in the manual.
I am working on a sea-lift-critical scenario so I have to define the weight of all types of ordnance.

How about this? Adding some new equipment with 0 attack and 0 defense into the units.

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Post #: 10
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