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RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 10:46:03 AM

Alpha77

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Might be a good sign, if he uses these still in 44 ? Guess the Allies had also some higher air losses... so nice bit of intel we got here.

Btw, I had the habbit while playing PBM to go to the worst and hottest areas last and was then already a bit tired and made mistakes(in my game the south where I lost many big ships and my fields was trashed by 4Es, even later I was able to repair it all and bring lots of fighters back to shoot dozens of his down, only the 4E do not suffer much, 42 IJ have mostly too weak weapons, but he gets OP losses for them. This will accumulate over time).

So I understand that J3rd rather fights in a area where he can have easier success. Sometimes the tention is also so huge if you receive a turn where you expect something bad happen and you might rather avoid the area in the game instead tend more to "unimportant" things. This is quite normal psychological seen

In my last PBM turn, I made one of the worst mistakes one can imagine, somehow the Kates on the CVs used bombs... there were NOT set to torpedoes. I don�t know how I missed that, and this would have been not as bad if they were set low, so many bombs would hit. But in this turn I experimented with vh alt for Kates, they flew at 25k and did not hit much....

But... the Allies were taken by surprise I had upgraded 2 of the fgr units to M5 Zero already which flew a reliable CAP at 0 range. The M2s escorted and the Vals hit good. And he had only 2 CVs and 1 CVE, this was the best CV battle for me in the whole game...in terms of own losses. Only a handful of his bombers got through and scored A SINGLE hit on a BB (which actually destroyed an AA gun!) we probably sunk the CVE and 1 CV, but if we had torps, the whole fleet might be slaughtered. Also the BBs and CAs...

.. but made no difference as the Allies gave up after that (for lack of time ofc), losing Kunming and noted they can not easily close my airfields in the south and 40-50 of his fighters there shot down, while we lost a dozen pilots. And 20 planes or so. Most were still ZeroM2 or the early Tojo, so not even honest losses. However he before destroyed many on the ground, but only by means of 4Es and nav bombardements, 1E or 2E bombers we could fight easily...

Re. the above CV battle, I also believe that the one CV which already upgraded (and participated there) to RADAR made a difference in terms of getting CAP in good position. Also this time I brought with me much more SF assets to missdirect his planes and for more AA (with the latest scen update they even hit something)

Sorry bit OT :)

So back to you game: Are you certain the Allied Luganville area activity is not a missdirection?

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 4/23/2017 12:34:17 PM >

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RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 11:47:09 AM

Lowpe

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Good luck. It is a nifty little plan.

But remember you are playing not only for VP, but to delay the Allies.

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RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 2:58:48 PM

John 3rd

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There is no DELAYING the Allies. We've got enough placed in the path for speed bumps. That is about it.

Have got to start seriously looking at my ground deployment in the Home Isles. Never too early to work on that. Want those prep levels at 100%.

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Post #: 3933

RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 3:02:13 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd
Heck. He still does this all the time presently. Currently have single ship TFs around the Aleutians, the Marshalls, and Marcus.

The Devil really is in the details for this sort of behavior. I agree that using xAKLs in singletons or pairs to soak off carrier sorties is gamey as Hell. But I've got no problems with using PB,PC,DD,PG,AMc,AM or other 'military' versions of ships on picket duty.

The common cry is that the Allies don't get enough of these to convert for picket duty? Too bad. So sad. Use a Fletcher then.

The game engine still does a poor job of disregarding these singletons when putting together anti-ship packages. So you have a couple xAKLs that *still* get targeted with 15DBs or TBs from a carrier strike.

CR uses YMS's for this task. They are misnamed as they are not yard craft, but instead are deep water capable ships with 3500 endurance.
I see no issue with using YMSs for picket duty.
xAKLs sure, but minesweepers no.
My two pennies for what its worth.

I agree. As YMSs also carry an ASW rating of 1 (IIRC), they also provide a useful submarine screen around harbors, further rationalizing their presence outside of Allied ports.

It's a lousy duty to draw-akin to the dreaded radar picket DDs and DEs at Okinawa-but is fair game as far as I'm concerned.

If they were used for PICKETS then I would be OK--somewhat--about this. They are not. He uses them as long-range, sacrificial scouts probing my defenses and trying to provoke a reaction. A line of them would be OK. Makes some sense. But sending them within 2-3 hexes of many bases TRYING to provoke something is another thing.

Some of you may remember I had hunting parties tracking these guys down fairly relentlessly until I realized I was just using up precious fuel trying to catch an endless amount of YMS.

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RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 3:03:01 PM

John 3rd

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Alpha77: I did remember to order Torps on Jill Daitai. Have made the exact mistake you did several times.

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Post #: 3935

RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 3:28:36 PM

HansBolter

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

Might be a good sign, if he uses these still in 44 ? Guess the Allies had also some higher air losses... so nice bit of intel we got here.

They are serviceable planes with a relatively deep pool for the allies, so why not leave a few CVEs operating them to relive strain on pools of Hellcats and FM-1s.

Smart resource management rather than an indication of desperation.

However, desperation regarding pool depth is a constant state for an Allied player.

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RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 5:57:47 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

Might be a good sign, if he uses these still in 44 ? Guess the Allies had also some higher air losses... so nice bit of intel we got here.

They are serviceable planes with a relatively deep pool for the allies, so why not leave a few CVEs operating them to relive strain on pools of Hellcats and FM-1s.

Smart resource management rather than an indication of desperation.

However, desperation regarding pool depth is a constant state for an Allied player.

Almost limitless pools of the the late war FMs, DB and TB for carriers. I bet I destroyed around 5 thousand in my last game...but the Allies get tons of them.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 4/23/2017 5:58:47 PM >

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Post #: 3937

RE: July 1944 - 4/23/2017 6:06:45 PM

Alpha77

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Hans meant desperation Allies have so much stuff, they do not know where to store it anymore.... well I only know my pools in 8/42 were quite filled as Allied (eg. 100 4e + bunch of Mathilda, Lees, 25pdr, masses of AA, 2pdr, all sortof 105,155 or 75mm guns ...etc after convois arrived, only Brits seemed a bit scarce) but that was vs. AI (and even the "old" suicidal AI,so no comparison with PBM) ah and I had 6,5 Mio supply or so alone in SanFran (LOL

)

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 4/23/2017 6:08:22 PM >

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 4:24:51 AM

John 3rd

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Dan's home so the turn is sent. We'll see what happens with that attempted ambush!

Promised a screenshot of current production so here it is with Frank-B starting up. The -A factories have not converted yet. Should see that pretty quick.

Attachment (1)

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 12:28:59 PM

Lowpe

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I seem to recall that the Frank A upgrades to the Frank B in this game...is that right?

With the DS hanging around, where are your large tanker convoys...still near Singers? What are your plans for them?

And finally, it seems like you have a production of 30 night fighters a month?

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 1:57:39 PM

ny59giants

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Since the Frank A upgrades directly to the B model, you should be able to go into the Economy (J button) and upgrade directly rather than wait for the AI to do so.

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 2:19:18 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

I seem to recall that the Frank A upgrades to the Frank B in this game...is that right?

With the DS hanging around, where are your large tanker convoys...still near Singers? What are your plans for them?

And finally, it seems like you have a production of 30 night fighters a month?

TK Convoy 5 is just passing Cam Rahn Bay.

Don't have many night fighters since he isn't doing any form of night attacks.

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 4:02:14 PM

Chickenboy

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This discussion about night fighter pools is all very interesting...BUT WHAT ABOUT THE AMBUSH?

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Post #: 3943

Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 4:07:27 PM

John 3rd

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July 5, 1944
Luganville

Japan's plan works to PERFECTION! We get our first clean victory since losing the war (Battlestar Galactica quote).

The High Speed run places the Japanese within striking distance of multiple TFs. We react towards the Allied carriers and for the first time in a year, Japan's CVs turn into the wind and launch! Into the skies climb 69 Sam/M8, 49 Judy, and 44 Jills. They easily brush aside the Allied CAP of 29 Fighters and PLASTER the Allied CV TF. An afternoon strike of 45 F, 13 Judy, and 33 Jills add to the carnage while a second afternoon strike (11 Zero and 22 Judy) hits an Allied STF.

Allied counter attacks are 15 F, 10 SBD and 3 Avenger, and 15 Fighters and 11 SBD. They are crushed by 60 Sam/ZERO without a single bomb/TT hitting the water or any AA fire needed.

At the end of the day--for sure sunk--the totals are:
CVE Copahee, CVE Altamaha, CVE Long Island, CL Kenya, and 2 DDs

Heavily Damaged/Sinking condition:
CVL Hermes 4 B/2TT, CL Newfoundland 3 B/1TT and a DD

Damaged:
CA Suffolk, CL Gambia, and 2 DD

Japanese air losses are 1 ZERO, 6 Judy, and 1 Jill.

A clean cut victory. In the greater picture it means nothing but FOR TODAY the Japanese flag flies high.

Banzai!

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 3944

RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 4:08:20 PM

John 3rd

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There is lots of other action in the turn but I've been called into work and will not be able to get the turn to Dan. RATS!

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 4:13:35 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

This discussion about night fighter pools is all very interesting...BUT WHAT ABOUT THE AMBUSH?

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 4:15:30 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

Might be a good sign, if he uses these still in 44 ? Guess the Allies had also some higher air losses... so nice bit of intel we got here.

They are serviceable planes with a relatively deep pool for the allies, so why not leave a few CVEs operating them to relive strain on pools of Hellcats and FM-1s.

Smart resource management rather than an indication of desperation.

However, desperation regarding pool depth is a constant state for an Allied player.

Yep, good point. I don't think many Japanese players realize just how critically low on aircraft the Allies pools always are. This really does not change until late 44 or even 45. Every plane in the pool has to be used. And the F4F is just as good as the FM Wildcat. I just rolled into 1/44 in my campaign and there are zero heavy and medium bombers in my pools. Not to mention about a dozen bomber units that have nothing to fly but obsolete aircraft. Fighters are the same with only a handful of planes of any type as reserves. This is how the Allies roll...

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 5:02:42 PM

Chickenboy

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Nice shootin' Tex!

BANZAI!!!!

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 5:04:56 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

There is lots of other action in the turn but I've been called into work and will not be able to get the turn to Dan. RATS!

I know it will be difficult if not impossible for you to *not* trumpet this turn loudly to your opponent. For greatest effect, I'd ask you to consider returning this turn with minimal commentary or foreshadowing. Let his heart shoot into his throat with the surprise of it during the running of the turn instead!

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 5:21:47 PM

MakeeLearn

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quote:

A clean cut victory. In the greater picture it means nothing but FOR TODAY the Japanese flag flies high.

"Discipline - the spirit of Japan's aviation"

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by MakeeLearn -- 4/25/2017 12:09:20 AM >

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Post #: 3950

RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 6:32:29 PM

Alpha77

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quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Yep, good point. I don't think many Japanese players realize just how critically low on aircraft (my) pools always are. This is how (I) roll...

I corrected "Allies" blanket statement to "your pools"... it depends how good both players are and how much they throw planes away. I had never a problem with Allied pools of any sort. Or are you playing an early version of silver scen (with reduced repl rates) I am not aware of?

But I understand also Allies want to keep that meme going so IJ might underestimate them and make mistakes

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 8:06:38 PM

Chickenboy

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Hey John,

Why doncha ask Lowpe about the dangers of upgrading R&D factories to models not yet in production?

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 8:11:00 PM

Lowpe

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No point in being stupid if you can't show it!

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RE: July 1944 - 4/24/2017 10:50:49 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Yep, good point. I don't think many Japanese players realize just how critically low on aircraft (my) pools always are. This is how (I) roll...

I corrected "Allies" blanket statement to "your pools"... it depends how good both players are and how much they throw planes away. I had never a problem with Allied pools of any sort. Or are you playing an early version of silver scen (with reduced repl rates) I am not aware of?

But I understand also Allies want to keep that meme going so IJ might underestimate them and make mistakes

Well, it really depends on your opponent and play style. We have been going at it since day one. An early invasion of India has kept that front active ever since. That is where the drain on aircraft has been. Still his losses for the game are 3 to my 2 so I can't complain. But if there are protracted campaigns then the losses will be there.

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Post #: 3954

RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 11:46:47 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

There is lots of other action in the turn but I've been called into work and will not be able to get the turn to Dan. RATS!

I know it will be difficult if not impossible for you to *not* trumpet this turn loudly to your opponent. For greatest effect, I'd ask you to consider returning this turn with minimal commentary or foreshadowing. Let his heart shoot into his throat with the surprise of it during the running of the turn instead!

I was very good. This is what I sent:

This is a hugely long turn.

I got called into work so I can not finish the 007. Wanted to send the 001/CR so you have that. Will get it done ASAP when I get home. Sorry about that.
John

His response:

Thanks for sending that early. I haven't watched the replay, but I did read the Combat Report, enjoying every line about the "invigorating" action in SoPac.

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/24/2017 11:49:26 PM

John 3rd

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Turn not sent as I just got home and have to make dinner for the family.

QUERY: Do I pursue???

Don't think there is much at Suva or Noumea because I would have seen it over Luganville...

This question is open for comment for about two hours. Have at it!

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/25/2017 12:23:07 AM

BillBrown

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If I read everything right, he is about to take all of Luzon, he is taking islands to the North of Luzon and you are worried about what to do with your CVs around Luganville?

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/25/2017 12:24:59 AM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Turn not sent as I just got home and have to make dinner for the family.

QUERY: Do I pursue???

Don't think there is much at Suva or Noumea because I would have seen it over Luganville...

This question is open for comment for about two hours. Have at it!

What do you think you can gain by putting the hammer down for another day? Will his key target ships be under an LRCAP umbrella at the beginning of next turn?

You did a nice job of kicking him in the complacency by delivering an effective surprise attack. Tomorrow won't be a surprise, so do you think you can brute force your will to your advantage still? It would be a shame if your modest attacks met a wall of top flight aircraft in defense tomorrow. That would be throwing away your victory. Still, if you *can* pull off additional VP scores on the cheap, that would be worth considering.

Other than a damaged CL or two, I didn't get a feel from your post what's here that's worth pursuing. Can you post the combat report section verbatim, John?

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/25/2017 12:27:40 AM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

If I read everything right, he is about to take all of Luzon, he is taking islands to the North of Luzon and you are worried about what to do with your CVs around Luganville?

I think John has correctly identified that, in the big picture, this is a sideshow. Still, it's worth considering in order to ravage an underdefended supply line or vulnerable CVE or two. Any CVE sunk is a nice 'bank' of VPs that forestall Allied autovictory another day or so.

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RE: Banzai!!! - 4/25/2017 12:33:15 AM

MakeeLearn

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Getting the entire KB under the umbrella of your Kamikazes/AirDefense may be wise in preparing for the defense of the Home Islands. Along with the SCTFs, even if you just float around the Sea of Japan before giving battle. Make the Allies bleed for every inch of Nippon.

< Message edited by MakeeLearn -- 4/25/2017 12:56:34 AM >

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Post #: 3960