RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bravo (A)

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bravo (A)

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RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/11/2017 12:30:19 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Does that surprise you, that the Allies can land 4 divisions on each overnight?

What are the ships to the east and south...the tail?

I take it you ate shore bombardments from the invading task forces...any dedicated shore bombardments?

No it doesn't surprise me that he can, it has been mentioned several times here and countless times elsewhere. What surprises me is, why he would want to.

The "tail" TFs are all heading east. Damaged ships I suspect for some. One shows two DDs, another, one PB.

Below is typical. Guam about the same, Rota a little less, but Tinian "only had" three BBs.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Saipan at 108,93

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 8 damaged
N1K1-J George: 4 destroyed on ground
G4M1 Betty: 38 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 23 destroyed on ground
G3M3 Nell: 24 damaged
G3M3 Nell: 14 destroyed on ground
A6M5 Zero: 48 damaged
A6M5 Zero: 27 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-III Dinah: 10 damaged
Ki-46-III Dinah: 9 destroyed on ground
D4Y3 Judy: 17 damaged
D4Y3 Judy: 6 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-II Dinah: 12 damaged
Ki-46-II Dinah: 1 destroyed on ground
D3A1 Val: 12 damaged
D3A1 Val: 11 destroyed on ground
H8K2 Emily: 1 damaged
H8K2 Emily: 1 destroyed on ground
D4Y1-C Judy: 4 damaged
D4Y1-C Judy: 3 destroyed on ground
B5N2 Kate: 5 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground
B5N1 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground

Allied Ships

BB Pennsylvania
BB Arizona
BB Colorado
BB Maryland
CA Chicago
CA Louisville
CA Chester
CA Houston
CL Concord
CL Detroit
CL Raleigh
CL Achilles

Japanese ground losses:
338 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 40 destroyed, 32 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 6 disabled
Guns lost 9 (3 destroyed, 6 disabled)
Vehicles lost 17 (7 destroyed, 10 disabled)

Airbase hits 32
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 73

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 1111

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/11/2017 12:36:09 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

Now would be the time to send in all your surface ships...after he spent a lot of ammo on bombardments and can't fight back as effectively. And before he takes a base and you have to wade thru 100 PT boats.

The question is how much fuel does the KB have, and have close by, and will the bombardment task forces stick around or head back. Important questions, I think.

Or did you have some other plan?

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/11/2017 12:39:36 PM >

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1112

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/11/2017 2:12:55 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Now would be the time to send in all your surface ships...after he spent a lot of ammo on bombardments and can't fight back as effectively. And before he takes a base and you have to wade thru 100 PT boats.

The question is how much fuel does the KB have, and have close by, and will the bombardment task forces stick around or head back. Important questions, I think.

Or did you have some other plan?

You know, sometimes this game drives me crazy. Last turn I had a BB TF sitting just above Saipan, Remain on Station, and I look for it this turn and find it half-way back to Iwo.

I am gathering them all below Pagan and hopefully next turn run them all at his main TFs, still two hexes east of Guam. I should have about six SCTFs, two with two BBs each. I will LRCAP them.

Is that what you were thinking?

PS; KBs fuel OK. Some of the DDs are getting low but Pagan has some fuel. The SCTFs are OK on fuel. I have some AOs at Iwo that can come down a bit.

< Message edited by el lobo -- 5/11/2017 2:18:19 PM >

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 1113

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 12:12:32 AM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: el lobo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Is that what you were thinking?

Not really.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1114

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 3:16:03 AM

PaxMondo

Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: el lobo

PACIFIC Jun 23, 1943 Turn 564

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Saipan at 108,93

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid detected at 158 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 40 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 209
B6N2 Jill x 65
D4Y1 Judy x 81

Allied aircraft
Walrus II x 5
F4F-4 Wildcat x 106
F6F-3 Hellcat x 210
OS2U-3 Kingfisher x 14
SOC-1 Seagull x 11

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 19 destroyed
B6N2 Jill: 24 destroyed, 10 damaged
B6N2 Jill: 1 destroyed by flak
D4Y1 Judy: 21 destroyed, 13 damaged
D4Y1 Judy: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
Walrus II: 1 destroyed
F4F-4 Wildcat: 10 destroyed, 1 damaged
F6F-3 Hellcat: 6 destroyed
OS2U-3 Kingfisher: 4 destroyed
SOC-1 Seagull: 6 destroyed

Allied Ships
xAK Peter Kerr
BB Pennsylvania, Bomb hits 1
DD Bennett
xAP Rangitiki, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
xAK Glenn Curtiss
BB Colorado, Bomb hits 3, on fire
xAK Red Jacket, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires
BB Arizona
DD Anthony
xAK Malancha
APA Warren
xAK Shirina, Bomb hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Trade Wind
APA La Salle
AK Eridanus
xAK Andrea Luckenbach, Bomb hits 1
xAP Mataroa, Bomb hits 1
CA Houston
xAK George Westinghouse, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires
xAK Harpoon, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
BB Maryland, Bomb hits 2

Allied ground losses:
3375 casualties reported
Squads: 82 destroyed, 25 disabled
Non Combat: 221 destroyed, 68 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 56 (54 destroyed, 2 disabled)
Vehicles lost 44 (20 destroyed, 24 disabled)

So, roughly 10% hit rate against LRCAP ... pretty much what I would expect. I would consider you quite lucky that most of the hits were against transports as opposed to the BB's, I rarely get that results. Instead, all 14 hits would have been on the BB's and those 250kg bombs just bounce off.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1115

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 3:17:44 AM

PaxMondo

Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: el lobo

Night Naval bombardment of Saipan at 108,93

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 8 damaged
N1K1-J George: 4 destroyed on ground
G4M1 Betty: 38 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 23 destroyed on ground
G3M3 Nell: 24 damaged
G3M3 Nell: 14 destroyed on ground
A6M5 Zero: 48 damaged
A6M5 Zero: 27 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-III Dinah: 10 damaged
Ki-46-III Dinah: 9 destroyed on ground
D4Y3 Judy: 17 damaged
D4Y3 Judy: 6 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-II Dinah: 12 damaged
Ki-46-II Dinah: 1 destroyed on ground
D3A1 Val: 12 damaged
D3A1 Val: 11 destroyed on ground
H8K2 Emily: 1 damaged
H8K2 Emily: 1 destroyed on ground
D4Y1-C Judy: 4 damaged
D4Y1-C Judy: 3 destroyed on ground
B5N2 Kate: 5 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground
B5N1 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground

Airbase hits 32
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 73

Again, this is fairly typical ground bombardment losses for this point in the game. It gets worse in '45 is all I can say.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1116

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 5:34:50 AM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Not really.

After a good night's sleep, I knew you were not thinking that, even before I read you post.

But, I'm wondering if Rio may be thinking that I would not try that. Hummm.

But, I'm thinking that Rio is thinking that he should close the air field at Pagan. That is a logical step and he certainly has the horse-power in the area to do it. So that is for what I am preparing.

Thanks.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 1117

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 5:38:49 AM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

Thanks Pax.

I haven't received the turn back yet but I got an email from Rio saying it would be late as he needed extra time to rearrange some ships as I "dented" some of his.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1118

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 7:30:42 AM

adarbrauner

Posts: 1496
Joined: 11/3/2016
From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: el lobo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Does that surprise you, that the Allies can land 4 divisions on each overnight?

What are the ships to the east and south...the tail?

I take it you ate shore bombardments from the invading task forces...any dedicated shore bombardments?

No it doesn't surprise me that he can, it has been mentioned several times here and countless times elsewhere. What surprises me is, why he would want to.

The "tail" TFs are all heading east. Damaged ships I suspect for some. One shows two DDs, another, one PB.

Below is typical. Guam about the same, Rota a little less, but Tinian "only had" three BBs.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Saipan at 108,93

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 8 damaged
N1K1-J George: 4 destroyed on ground
G4M1 Betty: 38 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 23 destroyed on ground
G3M3 Nell: 24 damaged
G3M3 Nell: 14 destroyed on ground
A6M5 Zero: 48 damaged
A6M5 Zero: 27 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-III Dinah: 10 damaged
Ki-46-III Dinah: 9 destroyed on ground
D4Y3 Judy: 17 damaged
D4Y3 Judy: 6 destroyed on ground
Ki-46-II Dinah: 12 damaged
Ki-46-II Dinah: 1 destroyed on ground
D3A1 Val: 12 damaged
D3A1 Val: 11 destroyed on ground
H8K2 Emily: 1 damaged
H8K2 Emily: 1 destroyed on ground
D4Y1-C Judy: 4 damaged
D4Y1-C Judy: 3 destroyed on ground
B5N2 Kate: 5 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground
B5N1 Kate: 1 destroyed on ground

Allied Ships

BB Pennsylvania
BB Arizona
BB Colorado
BB Maryland
CA Chicago
CA Louisville
CA Chester
CA Houston
CL Concord
CL Detroit
CL Raleigh
CL Achilles

Japanese ground losses:
338 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 40 destroyed, 32 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 6 disabled
Guns lost 9 (3 destroyed, 6 disabled)
Vehicles lost 17 (7 destroyed, 10 disabled)

Airbase hits 32
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 73

The Betties should not really have been there

Your strike though was good, many transports badly hit

On the other side, the Carrier fleet is now severly bleeded in fighter, I think you're left with 40 % of the fighter force?

Time to take a breath and reorganize? Air reinforcements, land based, on their way?

I would have waited to unleash the main air strike...also, weather was thunderstormy, so bound to penalize greatly the attacker;
use it at your advantage.

On the other side though again, Rio's carrier fighter force, and replenishment, went down (not a lot, but a good start, and he cannot replenish or rotate as easily as you!)

I 100% agree the remaining northern islands airports constitute n 1 concern for Rio. If you've gathered enough Cap, Rio's going to be badly bleeded there, and if so...then he's yours (thumbs crossed)!

As Lowpe has remarked, very good time to unleash your surface fleet.

I'd suggest you though not to throw it in, if some more big (BBs, Cruisers; maybe some DDs and Cls squadrons) surface reinforcements are due to arrive soon, but wait for their arrival;

If i'm going to send the ships for a surface engagements, I'd send in ALL the air support and assets I could gather, muster and available.

That'd the mythical Decisive Battle (for an year and a half only...) so sought for by IJN. Marianas waters was IJN's n.1 candidate for it!
Banzai.

You'd send in also your subs lurking for prays, cripples, or otherwise ops points expended ships.

All for all!

Mind the weather.

Mind the weather.

Mind weather.

thank you for allowing comments on your thread.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1119

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 7:34:17 AM

adarbrauner

Posts: 1496
Joined: 11/3/2016
From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
Status: offline

Please try keeping the KB out of US's strike range.

mind weather, bad weather advantage air defense,use at your advantage.

I think weather is determined by west-east direction and winds mainly, in game's mechanic...so here you're advantaged too in weather prediction....

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1120

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/12/2017 1:38:45 PM

Andav

Posts: 474
Joined: 5/8/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Walrus II: 1 destroyed
OS2U-3 Kingfisher: 4 destroyed
SOC-1 Seagull: 6 destroyed

Were these guys actually flying cap or were they "Caught up in the battle" or how ever the message reads? I see them in the screen shot you posted and in the combat results so I believer they are not from something which sunk.

Wa

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1121

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/13/2017 11:07:10 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

The Betties should not really have been there

Your probably right but I had to give them another chance.

quote:

Your strike though was good, many transports badly hit

On the other side, the Carrier fleet is now severly bleeded in fighter, I think you're left with 40 % of the fighter force?

Time to take a breath and reorganize? Air reinforcements, land based, on their way?

Fighter were down to about seventy percent but TBs and DBs were about forty. The fighters are now about ninety and the TBs and DBs about sixty. They will be higher in a turn or two.

quote:

I would have waited to unleash the main air strike...also, weather was thunderstormy, so bound to penalize greatly the attacker;
use it at your advantage.

On the other side though again, Rio's carrier fighter force, and replenishment, went down (not a lot, but a good start, and he cannot replenish or rotate as easily as you!)

I 100% agree the remaining northern islands airports constitute n 1 concern for Rio. If you've gathered enough Cap, Rio's going to be badly bleeded there, and if so...then he's yours (thumbs crossed)!

As Lowpe has remarked, very good time to unleash your surface fleet.

I'd suggest you though not to throw it in, if some more big (BBs, Cruisers; maybe some DDs and Cls squadrons) surface reinforcements are due to arrive soon, but wait for their arrival;

If i'm going to send the ships for a surface engagements, I'd send in ALL the air support and assets I could gather, muster and available.

All you suggested are on the way, days to weeks out.

quote:

That'd the mythical Decisive Battle (for an year and a half only...) so sought for by IJN. Marianas waters was IJN's n.1 candidate for it!
Banzai.

You'd send in also your subs lurking for prays, cripples, or otherwise ops points expended ships.

All for all!

Mind the weather.

Mind the weather.

Mind weather.

thank you for allowing comments on your thread.

Thanks. Your always welcome here.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Andav)

Post #: 1122

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/13/2017 11:10:25 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andav

quote:

Walrus II: 1 destroyed
OS2U-3 Kingfisher: 4 destroyed
SOC-1 Seagull: 6 destroyed

Were these guys actually flying cap or were they "Caught up in the battle" or how ever the message reads? I see them in the screen shot you posted and in the combat results so I believer they are not from something which sunk.

Wa

I think caught-up in the battle. He had/has a lot of recon there also.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Andav)

Post #: 1123

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/13/2017 11:11:43 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

PACIFIC Jun 24, 1943 Turn 565

Another couple of dents.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1124

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/13/2017 11:12:54 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

PACIFIC Jun 24, 1943 Turn 565

That didn't take long.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Saipan (108,93)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 42700 troops, 973 guns, 1115 vehicles, Assault Value = 1959

Defending force 6406 troops, 64 guns, 29 vehicles, Assault Value = 90

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Guam (106,95)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 65871 troops, 1727 guns, 1324 vehicles, Assault Value = 3165

Defending force 14988 troops, 109 guns, 5 vehicles, Assault Value = 328

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tinian (108,94)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 16153 troops, 180 guns, 223 vehicles, Assault Value = 803

Defending force 833 troops, 8 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 8

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Rota (107,95)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 15620 troops, 320 guns, 260 vehicles, Assault Value = 658

Defending force 1277 troops, 0 guns, 39 vehicles, Assault Value = 2

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by el lobo -- 5/13/2017 11:13:51 PM >

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1125

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 1:23:18 AM

Rusty1961

Posts: 1219
Joined: 2/4/2010
Status: offline

Yikes. He really chopped wood that day with all four taken.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1126

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 1:39:14 AM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
Status: offline

Yes he did indeed!

PACIFIC Jun 25, 1943 Turn 566

Too many subs. Time to leave.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Pagan at 109,87

Japanese Ships
CVL Ryujo, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
DD Arikaze

Allied Ships
SS Flying Fish
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack near Pagan at 109,87

Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima, Torpedo hits 2
DD Oyashio
DD Urakaze

Allied Ships
SS Cisco
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Pagan at 109,87

Japanese Ships
CV Kaga, Torpedo hits 1
DD Arikaze

Allied Ships
SS Bowfin

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to Rusty1961)

Post #: 1127

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 4:51:38 AM

PaxMondo

Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline

Well, now you've got an idea of what is needed and why. Review the posts that Lowpe and I gave you and get ready. I suspect you lost a lot of units here ... learn from this and be ready for the PI/Bonins/Kuriles next.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1128

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 2:15:49 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

Ouch...

Assuming 100 prep on Marianas, the troops may get 25 prep on their next target so you have some time to prepare before he invades somewhere else. Most likely. There are AFBs that push speed over prep -- and a lot of times they aren't wrong. Why prep if you can take an empty base quickly and reinforce with fresh troops that don't need no stinking prep?

Troops do gain prep while loaded on ships however, so not as much time as you may think.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1129

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 3:03:54 PM

adarbrauner

Posts: 1496
Joined: 11/3/2016
From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
Status: offline

Yes but how many depth charges attacks have you gained until know?

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 1130

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 11:54:48 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
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So far I have lost eight Engineer units. I shouldn't lose too many more. (15 PPs) I lost seven air units, five of which I bought back, two I don't need. (~250 PPs)

I am already much better shape air wise. Haha-jima is General Defense which will allow me to bring a Restricted Betty and Zero unit down. All my Georges and Jacks are here.

I have more ground troops here but still lack Arty, some on the way but never enough. No Armor available.

Lots more ships coming, and more mine-layers this time. Still can't make midgets.

Junyo is in Iwo, will go to Y/Y in a couple of days. Less damage on the recent hits on the CVs and BB than there was on Junyo so they should make it back if not attacked again.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1131

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/14/2017 11:56:26 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

Yes but how many depth charges attacks have you gained until know?

Lots of reported hits by a/c and some DC action but we won't know how effective they were until later.

Captain Haggard and I have been pretty open with each other about our sub attacks and losses during the game as it is fun to discuss and gibe each other. We are always interested in the sub vs sub attacks. As a note, there was only one successful sub vs sub torpedo attack during the war, and that was in the Atlantic.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1132

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/15/2017 2:00:16 AM

PaxMondo

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Bonins are much harder to defend ... but the principles all still apply. You already know from the Marianas you can't hold with a static defense. You also know that you have to prevent bombardment TF's from reaching your bases. You have a better understanding of the aircraft commits required. The last piece that needs to be in place is your reaction force (elastic defense) that has to be able to arrive within 2 days of his landing.

Don't commit forces unless you are prepared to be in, half commits only lose forces. You have at most 60 days until the next landing, and it could be a LOT less. Good Luck!

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1133

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 10:57:06 AM

adarbrauner

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Joined: 11/3/2016
From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
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quote:

ORIGINAL: el lobo

quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

Yes but how many depth charges attacks have you gained until know?

Lots of reported hits by a/c and some DC action but we won't know how effective they were until later.

Captain Haggard and I have been pretty open with each other about our sub attacks and losses during the game as it is fun to discuss and gibe each other. We are always interested in the sub vs sub attacks. As a note, there was only one successful sub vs sub torpedo attack during the war, and that was in the Atlantic.

El Lobo, there wewre a number of submarines against submarines attacks (and sinking) in the war, also in the pacific. Ther was even one instance of a Japanes sub torpdoing a US one, near Truk!

I don't think you have to retreat and give way now, in any way.

Rio's fleet is vulnerable now, very vulnerable. Particularly for surface assault, a la japanese. Odds are stiil at your advantage, if you've managed to gather and rally enough of your assets.

Please...

I understand fully that enemy subs are an issue, a bothering one to its least, but still.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1134

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 11:49:23 AM

el lobo

Posts: 825
Joined: 7/20/2013
From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
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PACIFIC Jun 27, 1943 Turn 568

We get a good hit but Rio quickly returns the favor. His sinks, ours is still alive.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Tinian at 108,95

Japanese Ships
SS I-170, hits 3

Allied Ships
CVE Prince William, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Quincy
CL Santa Fe
CL Nashville
CLAA San Juan
DD Converse
DD Waller
DD Taylor

Fuel storage explosion on CVE Prince William
SS I-170 launches 4 torpedoes at CVE Prince William

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Pagan at 111,90

Japanese Ships
BB Hiei, Torpedo hits 2, heavy damage
DD Niizuki

Allied Ships
SS Tullibee

SS Tullibee launches 6 torpedoes at BB Hiei

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1135

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 11:50:54 AM

el lobo

Posts: 825
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From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
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PACIFIC Jun 28, 1943 Turn 569

We take a run at Saipan. Lowpe was right. a day or two too late and we hit the PTs. Five eventually sunk.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Saipan at 109,92, Range 5,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Ise
BB Hyuga
DD Michishio
DD Yamagumo
DD Minegumo
DD Asagumo
DD Kasumi
DD Mutsuki

Allied Ships
PT-62
PT-63, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-64
PT-65

Poor visibility due to Thunderstorms
Maximum visibility in Thunderstorms: 6,000 yards

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1136

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 12:25:32 PM

adarbrauner

Posts: 1496
Joined: 11/3/2016
From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
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Kudos for the run.

I suspect though there's much more than Pts there, so maybe a run with 2 BBs only may not suffice, be careful....

Thuynderstorm may advantage greatly IJN in surface combat I think, what the experts say?

Good hit to the CV, 25 Wildcats less, this is CRITICAL for Rio at this stage.

Prince William? Is it English??

where are Yamato and Musashi? The Kongos? Where are the heavy cruisers?

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1137

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 12:30:12 PM

el lobo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

El Lobo, there wewre a number of submarines against submarines attacks (and sinking) in the war, also in the pacific. Ther was even one instance of a Japanes sub torpdoing a US one, near Truk!

Capt. Haggard is an ol' Navy guy and somewhat of a history buff. He sent me an article quite awhile back about the sub vs sub torpedo attack. I don't have it anymore but it was very interesting. The article stated that this was the only successful sub vs sub torpedo attack so that is why I mentioned it.

However if you have more stories I would be interested and know Capt. Haggard would be very much also. You can post them or your sources here or PM them to me.

quote:

I don't think you have to retreat and give way now, in any way.

Rio's fleet is vulnerable now, very vulnerable. Particularly for surface assault, a la japanese. Odds are stiil at your advantage, if you've managed to gather and rally enough of your assets.

Please...

I understand fully that enemy subs are an issue, a bothering one to its least, but still.

I think you are right.

I needed to retreat the KBs as for now their air is not effective against his forces.

Rio and I have been discussing this attack, just the strategy of it, and how he has been planing this since day one. However he let slip the fact that he has taken precautions to guard against the KB. He said that we could discuss that latter or after the war. But I think we can pretty much figure it out. Pax alluded to it earlier, that he may load his ships with fighters. If you look at the CVE Prince William above, she had all fighters.

Which means that you are correct in that he is more vulnerable to surface attacks.

I have sent all my capital ships back to Chichi-jima to rearm. Three BBs will be in the yard for awhile but two more are a day out. I have taken pains to group the same class DDs together and once I have all of my SCTFs armed and organized, I will go at him again.

As I mentioned earlier, we are getting good hits and DC attacks on his subs. He moved them in around Pagan to go after the KBs and capital ship and now I am busy hitting them as fast as the AI will allow. If one in ten is effective, we are sending some back to the yard.

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1138

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 12:35:34 PM

adarbrauner

Posts: 1496
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From: Zichron Yaaqov, Israel; Before, Treviso, Italy
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CaptHaggard

"Too, I also want to take this opportunity to salute our opponent, El Lobo. That guy has had zero exposure to wargames prior to this campaign, neither boardgames or computer games. He's doing an amazing job and proving himself to be a most cunning and intelligent opponent."

(in reply to el lobo)

Post #: 1139

RE: The Gamiest Game in Town. El Lobo (J), vs. Rio Bra... - 5/17/2017 2:51:44 PM

el lobo

Posts: 825
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From: Khon Kaen, Thailand (orig: Sacramento, CA)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

CaptHaggard

"Too, I also want to take this opportunity to salute our opponent, El Lobo. That guy has had zero exposure to wargames prior to this campaign, neither boardgames or computer games. He's doing an amazing job and proving himself to be a most cunning and intelligent opponent."

Not quite adarbrauner. Go back and read my post #1087.

Capt. Haggard has been playing board games most of his life. He started with his brother when he was a kid with those games that used the paper hexagon shaped playing pieces.

However this is his first witp-ae experience and you are right, he is a good opponent.

< Message edited by el lobo -- 5/17/2017 2:53:03 PM >

_____________________________

El Lobo (J) vs Rio Bravo (A)
Rio Bravo's AAR - "The War College"
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3851786

Gamey is not a game style. It is someone's definition.

(in reply to adarbrauner)

Post #: 1140

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