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RE: July 1944 - 5/15/2017 7:27:55 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Seems to me that you should have an MRE or some sort of 'ration-like' item to eat when you go to someplace like that!

The Subway is very close, walking distance, to the Cemetery where the Gettysburg Address was given and then you are on parts of the battlefield right after.

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Post #: 4231

RE: July 1944 - 5/15/2017 11:05:37 PM

cwemyss

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120 bombers. 80 fighters.

Stop talking about food!!!!

:-)

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Post #: 4232

RE: July 1944 - 5/15/2017 11:05:49 PM

cwemyss

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Edit... Sorry, double post.

But still. What's the heck?????

< Message edited by cwemyss -- 5/15/2017 11:07:02 PM >

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Post #: 4233

RE: July 1944 - 5/15/2017 11:19:24 PM

Bearcat2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cwemyss

Edit... Sorry, double post.

But still. What's the heck?????

Feeling jilted?

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Post #: 4234

RE: July 1944 - 5/15/2017 11:44:46 PM

Lowpe

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In areas you want to have naval strike planes operating, John, and the danger of either the deathstar or cap traps show up, instead of having multiple squadrons on attack...just use one torpedo bomber squadron at high altitude escorted by 3 squadrons of your best fighters all at high altitudes.

You may want to consider using the KB planes to strategic bomb Oz for victory points as an option.

Lot of Jugs gone...

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Post #: 4235

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 3:13:00 AM

cwemyss

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termite2

quote:

ORIGINAL: cwemyss

Edit... Sorry, double post.

But still. What's the heck?????

Feeling jilted?

No, not jilted, just curious. John lost 200+ airframes in air-air action in one turn, and barely mentioned it.

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Post #: 4236

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 3:15:46 AM

John 3rd

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OK. Fine. Here comes a quick Post.

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Post #: 4237

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 3:21:04 AM

John 3rd

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The 1.0x10^6 moved into the actual Strait of Formosa. This move triggered a pair of 36 plane Jill Daitai to attack. The attack was escorted by about 24-30 Fighters and ran into 7,000,000,000,000,000 Fighters. You see the results.

Those were later Jills. If you deeply look at the losses Posted on that screenshot ALL the Nell M4-Q, Anns, and N2 Jills were lost to Allied CAP. Those three groups were flying ASW/Air Search and proceeded to fling themselves as moths to a flame for death by Allied CAP. Always amazes me how the computer throws out search arcs and concentrates search aircraft in one spot the moment something is discovered. If it has CAP then even more search planes come in.

Am serious---count the Nells, Anns, and N2 Jills. The number is staggering. For quick counting, it was 40 Jills, 19 Nells, and 13 Anns: TOTAL--72 Planes shot down IN ONE HEX on search.

< Message edited by John 3rd -- 5/16/2017 3:23:37 AM >

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Post #: 4238

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 3:25:06 AM

John 3rd

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On the OTHER hand, I have concentrated some SS up in Alaska and have a group heading to western Indian attempting to hunt in friendlier waters. This Ro- does well:

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 4239

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 3:26:18 AM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cwemyss

120 bombers. 80 fighters.

Stop talking about food!!!!

:-)

Food is VERY important. What do you have against food?

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Post #: 4240

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 11:40:10 AM

Bearcat2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cwemyss

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termite2

quote:

ORIGINAL: cwemyss

Edit... Sorry, double post.

But still. What's the heck?????

Feeling jilted?

No, not jilted, just curious. John lost 200+ airframes in air-air action in one turn, and barely mentioned it.

It was a bad pun

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Post #: 4241

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 12:54:33 PM

Andav

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quote:

Am serious---count the Nells, Anns, and N2 Jills. The number is staggering. For quick counting, it was 40 Jills, 19 Nells, and 13 Anns: TOTAL--72 Planes shot down IN ONE HEX on search.

72 is a bit excessive but like many things can be mitigated. What altitude did you have them set? If you are flying them at 10k or something, those planes will get chewed up by CAP. They are not fast enough to evade when at low altitude. Fly them high and hope for the best. Also, use faster planes for search. Dinahs and such.

Not to be Debbie Downer since that is Lowpe's job but soon he will be able to build a couple of these types of TFs. It is one of the reasons why you have been encouraged to build a ton of air frames. You need thousands of planes to break the Death Star CAP or survive sweeping Jugs or have anything left when B-29s visit your air fields.

Wa

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Post #: 4242

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 5:25:07 PM

John 3rd

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July 27, 1944

I was going to congratulate Dan on his use of Strategic Bombers for actual STRATEGIC purposes over the last couple of turns until I watch nearly 100 B-29 attack the Brigade holding Foochow. The whole Allied navy is two hexes away and they couldn't fly strikes or bombard the base? Really?

OK.

The Allies begin landing at Foochow after they air search and/or throw some bombers (4EB of course) to see what is defending the bases at each location. He stays away from Amoy and the base to the east of it (good choice) and then lands at Foochow. It is defended by a Brigade with an ID that started air lifting in two days ago. With the 1,000+ Casualties caused by the B-29s the base will fall tomorrow. Have several divisions of troops moving in from the Shanghai Area as well as from the Hong Kong Area. Would be kind of cool to bottle up the Allied army on the coast of China.

We'll give that a try.

Heavy air action of Kagi and Takao. Fairly even fighting but I will need to rotate my Daitai and Sentai after this next turn.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 6:02:20 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andav

quote:

Am serious---count the Nells, Anns, and N2 Jills. The number is staggering. For quick counting, it was 40 Jills, 19 Nells, and 13 Anns: TOTAL--72 Planes shot down IN ONE HEX on search.

72 is a bit excessive but like many things can be mitigated. What altitude did you have them set? If you are flying them at 10k or something, those planes will get chewed up by CAP. They are not fast enough to evade when at low altitude. Fly them high and hope for the best. Also, use faster planes for search. Dinahs and such.

Not to be Debbie Downer since that is Lowpe's job but soon he will be able to build a couple of these types of TFs. It is one of the reasons why you have been encouraged to build a ton of air frames. You need thousands of planes to break the Death Star CAP or survive sweeping Jugs or have anything left when B-29s visit your air fields.

Wa

What, me Debbie Downer? Are you implying gender?

Yep, use Dinah's sky high where you expect the Deathstar to show up., curtail all ASW etc., to very short ranges where the Deathstar is not likely to show up....a definite game.

Only fly that kind of search when you go all out attacking the Deathstar...

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Post #: 4244

RE: July 1944 - 5/16/2017 6:10:36 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

July 27, 1944

I was going to congratulate Dan on his use of Strategic Bombers for actual STRATEGIC purposes over the last couple of turns until I watch nearly 100 B-29 attack the Brigade holding Foochow. The whole Allied navy is two hexes away and they couldn't fly strikes or bombard the base? Really?

I think you need to look at it as an abstraction...those 4E's are disrupting the roads, supply, infrastructure, and command across a 45 mile hex...greatly degrading the units ability to fight.

If you didn't want to see B29s used this way, you should have opened up night strategic bombing long ago.

Why use the Deathstar to bomb a hex...he will use it to protect, maybe sweep, maybe attack naval targets, maybe strategic bomb. But he won't waste the ammo on ground troops when all those big airbases are within range.

I hope you have a lot of Type 3 Medium Tanks in the area, along with lots of AA and ART in addition to those divisions you are moving. An Army infantry division, even the heavy ones with 43 squads simply cannot stand up to the Allies....they need lots of support troops and x2 or x3 terrain.

Good luck! You have pulled bigger miracles out of your hat this game!

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Post #: 4245

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 11:12:07 AM

adarbrauner

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Whatever you'd state about allied air and land superior firepower, I feel and think that such a move by Dan in southern China is a quasi suicide;

comparable to a Normandy invasion with Wehrmacht not involved in the Russian front, you could imagine thew results if you understand what I mean;

I'd give a 60-70% this is a diversionary move by Dan (and still a welcome one!); the other possible objectives may be in northern Japan, besides Formos of course.

Please John, roll this quasi ridicolus invasion.

Do not please save in assetts and efforts, as you did in Luzon, not this time, please give full fight.

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Post #: 4246

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 1:36:22 PM

Panther Bait

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Whether this is the main thrust or a diversion, as long as he brought engineers, the Allies will have several functional air bases up and running almost immediately. If he transfers beau-coup fighter and DB/TB squadrons from Luzon, he'll have point defense and interdiction local. An 4E from Luzon will cream any reinforcements as they transition through clear terrain bases on the way or at Foochow (not sure on the terrain there).

And with the fleet away, there won't be any nuclear bombardments in the short term, even if you could get past the 1x10^6 death start

This may not be the main thrust, but I wouldn't call it a suicide diversion from Dan either.

Mike

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Post #: 4247

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 1:46:58 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

Whether this is the main thrust or a diversion, as long as he brought engineers, the Allies will have several functional air bases up and running almost immediately. If he transfers beau-coup fighter and DB/TB squadrons from Luzon, he'll have point defense and interdiction local. An 4E from Luzon will cream any reinforcements as they transition through clear terrain bases on the way or at Foochow (not sure on the terrain there).

And with the fleet away, there won't be any nuclear bombardments in the short term, even if you could get past the 1x10^6 death start

This may not be the main thrust, but I wouldn't call it a suicide diversion from Dan either.

Mike

My feelings as well.

John: recon, recon and more recon to see what you're dealing with. By its very definition, any attack with base forces, beaucoup engineers/SeaBees/AV support and 10 divisions (this is an example only, I've no idea what's there) won't be a diversion.

Like others have said, don't feel compelled to fight on good terrain near the landing site. But I'd start setting up a perimeter in 'rough' or 'forested' terrain ASAP. Slow his adventure to a crawl and diminish its value.

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Post #: 4248

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 1:57:35 PM

Lowpe

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Let us not forget that refineries do push out 1 supply...and the upper SRA is mostly in Japan's hands....

I wonder if you made any SSTs? They would be great for running supply back and forth because it looks like you will be supply and fuel rich at Palembang. Additionally, Tabbys might be used to air lift supply safely too, instead of troops....tough decision there.

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Post #: 4249

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 2:35:54 PM

ny59giants

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No supplies from Refineries in RA. This mod based on DBB where JWE/Symon took it out. Its back in in latest BTS Lite.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 2:46:10 PM

Crackaces

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

No supplies from Refineries in RA. This mod based on DBB where JWE/Symon took it out. Its back in in latest BTS Lite.

Although a nice idea on the surface .. refining can not produce beans or bullets ... that modification in my opinion makes the DEI too hard to supply for IJ and opens the DEI too much for the Allies ...

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Post #: 4251

RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 3:51:28 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait

Whether this is the main thrust or a diversion, as long as he brought engineers, the Allies will have several functional air bases up and running almost immediately. If he transfers beau-coup fighter and DB/TB squadrons from Luzon, he'll have point defense and interdiction local. An 4E from Luzon will cream any reinforcements as they transition through clear terrain bases on the way or at Foochow (not sure on the terrain there).

And with the fleet away, there won't be any nuclear bombardments in the short term, even if you could get past the 1x10^6 death start

This may not be the main thrust, but I wouldn't call it a suicide diversion from Dan either.

Mike

My feelings as well.

John: recon, recon and more recon to see what you're dealing with. By its very definition, any attack with base forces, beaucoup engineers/SeaBees/AV support and 10 divisions (this is an example only, I've no idea what's there) won't be a diversion.

Like others have said, don't feel compelled to fight on good terrain near the landing site. But I'd start setting up a perimeter in 'rough' or 'forested' terrain ASAP. Slow his adventure to a crawl and diminish its value.

He has only--as of last turn--dropped off 2 ID and 8th Army HQ. Running turn to see what comes next.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 3:55:27 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

July 27, 1944

I was going to congratulate Dan on his use of Strategic Bombers for actual STRATEGIC purposes over the last couple of turns until I watch nearly 100 B-29 attack the Brigade holding Foochow. The whole Allied navy is two hexes away and they couldn't fly strikes or bombard the base? Really?

OK.

The Allies begin landing at Foochow after they air search and/or throw some bombers (4EB of course) to see what is defending the bases at each location. He stays away from Amoy and the base to the east of it (good choice) and then lands at Foochow. It is defended by a Brigade with an ID that started air lifting in two days ago. With the 1,000+ Casualties caused by the B-29s the base will fall tomorrow. Have several divisions of troops moving in from the Shanghai Area as well as from the Hong Kong Area. Would be kind of cool to bottle up the Allied army on the coast of China.

We'll give that a try.

Heavy air action of Kagi and Takao. Fairly even fighting but I will need to rotate my Daitai and Sentai after this next turn.

I don't use 29s for land units and we have a HR that forbids Allied 4Es from attacking land units in the open. A good rule because it just gets out of hand. However, if any Japanese player had used massed bombing attacks in support of land campaigns in 1942 (yes, you all know you do it) then there is not any room for complaint. To use 300 Japanese mediums to pound Allies ground units in preparation for an attack is even more unreasonable than the Allies using 1,000 4Es in 1944. At least the Allied bombers had decent bomb sights. This is a situation that needs to be addressed before the game starts but if you have used massed attacks yourself then... well it is time to pay the piper.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 5:04:46 PM

John 3rd

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July 28, 1944

Over the skies of Takao, weather closes in on the American Fighters bases so two raids of B-24s come in UNESCORTED and before any form of sweep. Japanese Fighters take down a good number and then the AA adds a bunch more. Pretty nice day for Japan and NOT a nice day for American bomber pilots.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 5:07:13 PM

John 3rd

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Air losses for the Day:

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 5:11:55 PM

John 3rd

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In the continuing spirit of 'hitting them where they ain't,' Japan deploys five long-range subs to the coasts of Canada and the United States. The first two days of hunting yields a total of 3 AKs (Cape Flattery, Cape Lambert, and Taiping).

NICE!

Six I-Boats are in the process of moving to the west coast of India to hunts shipping around Karachi.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 5:30:47 PM

John 3rd

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This is a busy screenshot.

Dan takes Woochow with two ID and a HQ. Paras take Pucheng to the north.

The Kitchen sink begins to move towards the fighting area. I was waiting for a break with the Allied Fleet moving away but since that isn't happening, Haiphong has 3 ID and a TK Division depart moving east. Indochina will be held by small forces but everything--of importance--will be moving up to Haiphong and departing. From Canton an ID moves out. From the SW corner of the Chinese Line another TK Division moves east. Shanghai sees 3 ID, 5 TK Reg, and a HOSTE of other units move out as shown. Coming down from the north are two more ID.

This will take time but the hope is to engage Dan on this ground and OCCUPY his ground forces as long as possible.

The Allied Fleet splits with the heavy CVs moving slightly east towards Okinawa. What remains at/near Woochow will be severely tested tomorrow as 3 Kamikaze units, 2 big Daitai of TB and 200+ Fighters move into strike range of the Port. There may some SERIOUS fighting on tomorrows turn!

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 5:54:55 PM

Lowpe

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You are the master at sub operations.

Do you know if the runway at Foochow is damaged, otherwise I think your strike there will be shattered for nothing.

Land based air is devilishly tricky to coordinate. Maybe if you were hitting it with 1000+ fighters plus strike planes...even then, I doubt much would get thru since it is all land based air. But here is hoping that the Allies screwed up their CAP setting or better yet move away.

Foochow is an interesting pick, as it would be impossible to hit the beaches without hitting the deathstar with a KB plus land based air strike. However, a land based strike at the beach could be done from the right runways...which is I guess why he moved the deathstar towards Okinawa.

Another good job in the air, congratulations!

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 6:05:10 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

This is a busy screenshot.

Dan takes Woochow with two ID and a HQ. Paras take Pucheng to the north.

The Kitchen sink begins to move towards the fighting area. I was waiting for a break with the Allied Fleet moving away but since that isn't happening, Haiphong has 3 ID and a TK Division depart moving east. Indochina will be held by small forces but everything--of importance--will be moving up to Haiphong and departing. From Canton an ID moves out. From the SW corner of the Chinese Line another TK Division moves east. Shanghai sees 3 ID, 5 TK Reg, and a HOSTE of other units move out as shown. Coming down from the north are two more ID.

This will take time but the hope is to engage Dan on this ground and OCCUPY his ground forces as long as possible.

The Allied Fleet splits with the heavy CVs moving slightly east towards Okinawa. What remains at/near Woochow will be severely tested tomorrow as 3 Kamikaze units, 2 big Daitai of TB and 200+ Fighters move into strike range of the Port. There may some SERIOUS fighting on tomorrows turn!

Dude. What is that Chinese unit doing astride your road 3 hexes E. of Hanoi? Why is it drawing breath and above ground? A Chinese unit cutting off your theater LOS in the midst of a massive strategic redeployment needs to be / should have been exterminated.

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RE: July 1944 - 5/17/2017 6:12:34 PM

Lowpe

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It has been there for a long time.

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Post #: 4260