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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

 
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 3:36:38 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
Joined: 11/15/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		With all these genius tricks around here it is amazing anybody ever wins

(in reply to palioboy2)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 4:25:31 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

A counter-strike like this requires plenty of planning and logistics prep before it goes ahead. John is aggressive enough to try such a counter-stroke but I don't believe he would invest the time required to set up the ships, aircraft and supplies needed to support such an amphib operation in your LOC.



A few old timers will remember that in my WitP game against John III some 10 years ago, he invaded India en masse in 1944. I am absolutely certain he will not make a mistake like that, but I am quite certain that he's considered counterinvading in the Thailand region. I'm not saying he'll do it, but I had better be prepared; because I'm equally certain that an ounce of prevention is preferable to the pound of cure it will take to unravel things.


I don't think you always appreciate my counter-arguments, but here goes.

My point re the PPs to line up air units under like HQs is based on the fact that your game has entered the terminal phases. You have strategically beaten him; you're established in the PI, and Formosa is ready to tumble, in mid-1944. You're inside the balloon. Everything else on the map is a backwater.

You can turtle in Burma. You can turtle everywhere except China and Formosa. You have naval power such that supplies will always get to those two theaters. And supplies are all you need to strat bomb him to game ending auto-vic. Let him CAP-trap, and xAK hunt, and all the rest of the sniping. It just doesn't matter. You're on the threshold of tens of thousands of VPs. If he gets 70 in this turn or that turn, so what?

You might enjoy extending the game just because. You might like pushing pieces all over southeast Asia. But you don't have to.

Especially if his life situation is going to make turns spotty, I'd give him less workload each turn, and drive the game to completion. You can always start another if he has time. But you've done the work to set up the final push. And it isn't near Bangkok.

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(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 4:59:20 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		I always read every post made in the AAR; I don't always agree with every post; I pay especial attention to posts from players who I know are clever or experienced or just plain sensible.

You, Moose, fall into the category of players to listen to.

But even the most knowledgeable players just don't have enough information to have a feel for all the little things that enter into my decisions. Lowpe, another player worth listening to carefully, recently demonstrated this. He tactfully replied to a post I made about steering Death Star clear of Manado to avoid the possibility of a CAP trap. He said: "That's what bombardment TFs are for" (or words to that effect.

What he didn't know is that all my combat TFs were out of ammo and that I couldn't afford a suppression mission. He probably thinks I didn't listen to him. I did, but his suggestion didn't apply under the peculiar circumstances.

Your suggestion is the same. I'm not ready yet to begin strategic bombing, so aligning bomber HQ isn't a priority yet. It will become the priority soon - as soon as I have airfields in proximity (I'm close, but not yet there). Burma is irrelevant now, but Indochina isn't. The Allied army moving north into China from Indochina will have a synergistic effect on what's going to play out in Formosa and in coastal China. If I can merge all of this into one front it's going to make my strategic bombing campaign far more effective. I won't give you all the reasons now, but trust me that spending PP on Indian divisions for Indochina now may directly help strategic bombing when it commences in earnest in about eight weeks.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 10983
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 8:18:14 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/23/44

Peep Show: A good day bombing Formosa's airfields; Allied army to attack at Swatow tomorrow, if any enemy units are still present by then.

Indochina: A good day on the ground, as the main Allied stack in the north pushes back the last feeble opposition before Hanoi/Haiphong; in the south, two Allied divisions destroy the remnants of an enemy mixed brigade outside Saigon.






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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 10984
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 8:27:05 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/23/44

DS & KB: Death Star is moving in good order to Manila, from where it will then engage in the Formosa campaign.

KB is apparently splitting up again, with a stout division heading into the Java Sea. I don't care what KB does down in the DEI over the coming weeks. Formosa is the locus of the war.




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(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 8:53:09 PM   
MakeeLearn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Makee: Words will not suffice....



Unfortunately that was not the case when I use to write papers for people during summers in College. Yes I was a THUG, hardcore one at that. The library was just not enough. Being able to guarantee at least a B and working at a College library, to get clients was as easy as selling sugarcoated heroin to 3rd graders.

As with those trying to see your planning, what is written, or seen, doesn't always say it all. I actually believe that there is more to the picture, or the text, than meets the eye.





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(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 9:09:22 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		In rural Georgia once, I saw a sign in a front yard: "Lawn more repair shop."

(in reply to MakeeLearn)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 9:15:10 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		In another part of rural Georgia about four years ago, a school sign announced: "October is Downs Syndrome Awareness Month."

While that illness is no joking matter, I couldn't help but laugh at the irony.

In Sunday school last week, a very smart lady told us about some "paternal twins." (Well, okay, I suppose that's literally true.)

In Sunday school about six weeks ago, that same lady told us that you could "tell a lot about a person by their continence." (That's probably true, but wouldn't their "countenance" reveal more?)

I gave my secretary dictation once, and the type-written document came to me reading: "Gorilla warfare."

After my wife spent a few days with her father back in her hometown, I asked her what she'd done. She replied that she'd been "swinging in the valley." I wasn't sure what to make of this. So I repeated it that way, which made her mad, for some reason. She said, "I went to see Swain and Lynn Lewallen!"

(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 10:44:40 PM   
Lowpe


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Status: offline 		Wasn't there Japanese troops NW of Pakhoi? Hiding in the woods (or is it jungle there?).

I am looking forward to the strategic bombing campaign...and I am curious if Japan has conducted any night bombing raids?

AA effectiveness...likely the AA is heavily disrupted/disabled. It does take a beating...and morale starts to flag. Might as well stay in the shelters. Merely a guess on my part...from continual bombing in a past life. You need lots of AA and ENG present (i.e. many units) to spread the disruption around...and that is not John's modus operandi is it? If there is a lot of AA units in the hex then you perhaps maybe correct that supply is starting to run low.

Gorilla warfare is just plain nasty...I have seen Planet of the Apes.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 6/17/2017 10:46:46 PM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/17/2017 11:23:38 PM   
Lovejoy


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Status: offline 		I live in Columbus, Ohio. In our local Jersey Mike's Sub Shop, there was a sign that read "Sorry but we do not except 100 dollar bills".

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 1:46:27 PM   
MakeeLearn


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For the upcoming Strategic bombing campaign...

"- Strafing Will Suppress Flak, Strafe Skill >70 will increase suppression"

Anyone have any success with this?







Attachment (1)

< Message edited by MakeeLearn -- 6/18/2017 1:50:01 PM >

(in reply to Lovejoy)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 1:55:29 PM   
BillBrown


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Status: offline 		Hmmm, Sh-cool

(in reply to MakeeLearn)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 3:06:23 PM   
JohnDillworth


Posts: 3100
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline 		Dan, I understand you are trying to buy out an Indian Division. Where are you planning to send that division? I ask because and upgraded Chinese division is going to have more AV than an Indian Division and if you are bringing that Indian Division to China, well, the Chinese divisions are already there and you could save a ton of PP. Chinese are the hammer now

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(in reply to BillBrown)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 4:13:26 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MakeeLearn


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Makee: Words will not suffice....



Unfortunately that was not the case when I use to write papers for people during summers in College. Yes I was a THUG, hardcore one at that. The library was just not enough. Being able to guarantee at least a B and working at a College library, to get clients was as easy as selling sugarcoated heroin to 3rd graders.

As with those trying to see your planning, what is written, or seen, doesn't always say it all. I actually believe that there is more to the picture, or the text, than meets the eye.






Peches is French for fish, but they missed the little ^ accent over the first "E" (ê).


_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to MakeeLearn)
Post #: 10994
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 4:14:59 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

Hmmm, Sh-cool

I was thinking the same thing - Sir Sean Connery talking about a place for education!

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to BillBrown)
Post #: 10995
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 7:26:51 PM   
GetAssista

 

Posts: 2732
Joined: 9/19/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
Peches is French for fish, but they missed the little ^ accent over the first "E" (ê).

The roof, the roof is your ^
albeit rather big one

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 10996
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 9:58:02 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Wasn't there Japanese troops NW of Pakhoi? Hiding in the woods (or is it jungle there?). Those were divisions leaving Indochina for China.

I am looking forward to the strategic bombing campaign...and I am curious if Japan has conducted any night bombing raids? John is biding his time - no night raids yet.

AA effectiveness...likely the AA is heavily disrupted/disabled. It does take a beating...and morale starts to flag. Might as well stay in the shelters. Merely a guess on my part...from continual bombing in a past life. You need lots of AA and ENG present (i.e. many units) to spread the disruption around...and that is not John's modus operandi is it? If there is a lot of AA units in the hex then you perhaps maybe correct that supply is starting to run low.

Gorilla warfare is just plain nasty...I have seen Planet of the Apes.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 10997
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 9:59:23 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

Dan, I understand you are trying to buy out an Indian Division. Where are you planning to send that division? I ask because and upgraded Chinese division is going to have more AV than an Indian Division and if you are bringing that Indian Division to China, well, the Chinese divisions are already there and you could save a ton of PP. Chinese are the hammer now

The division will be posted somewhere in the Bangkok area to serve as local security. It's prepping for Singers, it's eventual target.

(in reply to JohnDillworth)
Post #: 10998
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 10:09:01 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/24/44

DS: About three days out of Manila.

KB: Hiding "in the shades" in Java and Singers. What's John up to with the rest of his carriers? Raid in Bay of Bengal?



Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 6/18/2017 10:32:48 PM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 10:28:13 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/24/44

Peep Show: The Allies take Swatow. The original Peep Show objectives have been met - Foochow to Swatow. Supply is an issue, until more arrives, so mostly the Allies will attend to defense now. Mostly, not entirely.

SEAC: Main Allied army in northern Indochina will begin crossing the river into Haiphong tomorrow. SigInt report enemy ground unit aboard ship bound for Saigon. Belated reinforcement effort. John probably sees an opportunity to hold against modest Allied opposition.




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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/18/2017 11:14:40 PM   
Bif1961


Posts: 2014
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From: Phenix City, Alabama
Status: offline 		S H C O O L = Senior High Cool?

(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 5:33:12 AM   
Barb


Posts: 2503
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From: Bratislava, Slovakia
Status: offline 		Any ideas about opening direct supply route from Pearl to Philippines (via Marianas) ? It is the shortest one, KB is out of picture totally, but it would probably take a lot of your Amphib and Troop capacity little back. Maybe after the Formosa campaign is finished?

Would shorten the turn-around time for your supply/fuel (which are going to increase only), ease the situation, save tons of fuel in transportation, etc...

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 7:15:09 AM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
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Status: offline 		I would be surprised that there isnt a significant number of amphib and combat ships accumulating on the West coast and the Hawaiian island that could perform this task.

At least Marcus I should be a target to clear the LOC

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 12:17:17 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		The CenPac route has always been on the table, and one day it'll be put into use. But it really isn't more efficient than the Oz route:

1. CenPac will never be a really safe "LOC," even if I take Marcus and Iwo. Even with those enemy airfields out of play and Allied nav search set up, the risks of enemy raids (combat ships or small carrier TFs) will require me to use combat ships and carrier, in which case John could then up the ante, requiring me to do so, ad infinitum (almost). The only way to avoid this would be to take a large enough corridor to eliminate entirely the chance of surprise - as in taking the rest of the Marshalls, Marcus, the Bonins and the Marianas. That's too big an operation that would take too much time. The more efficient way to handle it is to detail Death Star to accompany ships from the Philippines halfway back towards Hawaii, picking up inbound ships while escorting outbound ships. Doing that every two or three months should work nicely.

2. The Oz LOC isn't really inefficient, once all the ships are in place. I have an efficient system set up to deliver supply to Oz now, coming in at places like Brisbane to unload. The supply then moves overland to Normanton, on the Gulf of Carenpentaria, where smaller TFs can load it and move it into the DEI. This route is efficient and with low danger except when a strong KB force is present or close by. When that happens, I stand down my ships while taking some pleasure in having KB way off down here.

(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 11004
RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 12:41:34 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/25/44

Peep Show: Death Star & The Herd will begin arriving at Manila the day after tomorrow. Formosa operation may get underway in about a week.

SEAC: Enemy garrison at Haiphong includes a good mixed brigade and several tank regiments. The Allied shock attack didn't touch four forts. Recon bombing of adjacent Hanoi shows it is weakly held, though that info may not be complete. Two lagging Allied units will move there to see.

KB: Remains divided in the DEI.




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< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 6/19/2017 12:42:32 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 1:34:21 PM   
Lowpe


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Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		You are now at the point where you need to press "W" so we can see hexside control in China on your maps. Pretty please.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 3:39:34 PM   
crsutton


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From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

In rural Georgia once, I saw a sign in a front yard: "Lawn more repair shop."


Nothing rural about where I live. Couple of days ago, my wife spotted a service vehicle with expensive signage on there rear and "comitted to quality and excellence" underneath.

The sad thing is that I would have never noticed. I blame her English teacher mother.

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(in reply to Canoerebel)
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 5:59:42 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		8/26/44

Naval Battle of Swatow: A meeting engagement in the eastern extremity of the East China Sea. Fletcher TF came to Swatow to interdict anticipated enemy bombardment run, but John had his combat TF bound for the East China Sea. The resulting action was very indecisive, though a USN sub crippled CL Nagara later in the day. That's the first major Allied sub score in months.

P.S. A month ago, IJN sub puts one TT into CL Mobile, and she goes down. Redfish puts two into Nagara and she remains afloat (after she also took two several months ago in the Java Sea). My guys never finish the drill and score the kill, or so it seems sometimes.




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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 6:06:30 PM   
jwolf

 

Posts: 2493
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Status: offline 		Maybe the Japanese were simply trying to sprint past your area of control back to home waters near Japan? Or possibly, from there to deploy in the defense of Formosa?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 6/19/2017 6:07:22 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
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Status: offline 		Day time surface combat out of USN torpedo range. Those CA guns...

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