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RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians

 
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RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 2:02:19 AM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		The Japanese OOB does not show a Coast Defence Battery so I take it the resistance you encountered before was the Mountain Gun Regiment and other defensive fire from the Japanese infantry as your troops landed and crossed the beach. Once you have established a firm beachhead, it is not uncommon to land further forces without much enemy fire on the landings.
Your combat report does not show a "supply (-)" so I would not expect the Japanese to be out of supply yet.

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RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 8:33:54 AM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		BBfanboy, yes, correct. I apologise for the misinformation. I really meant guns 'used in coastal defence' rather than coastal guns as such. Anyway, they must have had some sort of holiday because next day they did fire back again!

Day 30 - 14 May (D+7)

The fast supply TF (1x xAK 1xDD) arrives at Kiska and commences unloading alongside assault TF which has nearly completed its unloading. A few shells are fired by coastal guns without effect. Minesweepers arrive on station.

A sub is attacked and damaged near Attu. It will withdraw south-west. An enemy supply convoy arrives at Attu.

Airstrikes continue against Kiska defenders but with diminishing effect. Rest and refit ordered so ops suspended tomorrow.

On the ground both sides stay on the defensive. No significant action reported.







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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/2/2017 10:19:17 AM >

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Post #: 62
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 10:27:32 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 31 - 15 May (D+8)

Interesting day. Is the report of 4 enemy ships near Adak accurate !!






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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/2/2017 1:31:48 PM >

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Post #: 63
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 4:57:20 PM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Energisteron
The fast supply TF (1x xAK 1xDD) arrives at Kiska and commences unloading alongside assault TF which has nearly completed its unloading. A few shells are fired by coastal guns without effect.

Be careful with sending fuel-carrying AKs in harms way. One hit and they are a raging inferno.

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Post #: 64
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 6:29:13 PM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Hi, GetAssista

Yes, I guess so. No significant fuel requirement by landing force on Kiska as yet so xAK is carrying supplies only.

Day 32 - 16 May (D+9)

I thought it was about time to make an update of aerial and sub recon (see attached).

There are now Catalinas operating from Adak as well as Dutch Harbor, although I have noticed a 'search gap' on the north side of the map. Could this be a vulnerability? I'm expecting not as enemy units would have to cross patrolled zones to get there.

There's daily Recon of Kiska by 4xPBYs flying from Dutch Harbor. The specialised recon Wildcats onboard CVE Nassau have succumbed to operational fatigue and are no longer flying over Kiska.

There's an approx 180 deg arc of ASW air patrols west of Dutch Harbor, but there have been no significant reports of activity.

Canadian air units are moved forward to Adak to replace combat weary USAF units. This reduces the air support requirement which has been improved by the arrival of Destroyer air-tenders from Dutch Harbor (more are on their way).

The naval situation continues as planned. Unloading continues at Kiska with some CAP provided by the CVE Wildcats. However, our luck may be running out as xAP Branch is hit twice by shore batteries, and she was nearly empty! The Delaroff badly damaged when she scraped her hull sinks which is some relief as I could't have escorted her at 1 knot anywhere! Also, the second wave Amphib TF (1xCA 1xCL 4xDD 1xAPD 5xAPA 1x xAK) leaves Dutch Harbor bound for Kiska.

On the ground, we make a deliberate attack which proves quite costly for both sides.





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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/2/2017 6:37:20 PM >

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Post #: 65
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 6:38:42 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		Having ships ground themselves on rocks is an occupational hazard for amphib landings, and occasionally for ships just going into a hex that has reefs. I think having a good captain helps avoid the rocks, and perhaps a good D/L on the target hex too. No empirical proof on this, but after my first couple of games I started upgrading merchant ship captains (at 0 cost in PP in most cases) I have had far fewer groundings. My naval AP and APA types get captains in the high 40s to mid 50s for Naval skill even if I have to spend some PP.

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Post #: 66
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 6:43:39 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		GetAssista is correct - your first picture of xAK Sakajewa show it carrying 116 fuel. Some of the larger xAKs have a built in fuel tank to carry a bit of fuel. It is loaded as "cargo" along with the remainder of the cargo. These ships were intended to resupply remote (but large enough to dock at) ports that are fairly safe from attack.

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No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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Post #: 67
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 7:33:28 PM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Thanks, sounds like good advice.

I'll set 'do not load fuel' next time. It's only a couple of barrels. Would that go boom?

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Post #: 68
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 8:17:14 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Energisteron

Thanks, sounds like good advice.

I'll set 'do not load fuel' next time. It's only a couple of barrels. Would that go boom?

It doesn't matter if you set "do not load fuel", the tank is treated as "cargo" for loading purposes so it will load fuel in it (unless you abort the loading before the tank gets loaded - it loads last.

And 116 represents 116 tons of fuel, not "just a few barrels", so it will go boom if hit. There is a lesser chance of a hit igniting it than a hit on a tanker, but still a chance. But you did the right thing and had a warship duke it out with shore guns while the cargo ship unloaded, so all is well.

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No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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Post #: 69
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 8:40:42 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
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From: Southern California
Status: offline 		The "effective" search range of the PBY is only 12 hexes even though the actual range is higher. You may spot ships at greater than 12 hexes if you recon a base and there are ships operating there.

Unless you are up against a severe time limit you would be better to set to "defend" and wear down the enemy with air and naval bombardment. You judge when they are getting worn out when the anti-aircraft and artillery counterbattery fire begins to decline. As it is now, you are beating your head against their trenches.

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Post #: 70
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 8:44:31 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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From: Southern California
Status: offline 		In the last attack, the "adjusted defense" was > 3x their par value. They are still mostly intact. They are also delivering some effecting fire at the landing, which means they are not well suppressed.

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Post #: 71
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 9:17:58 PM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Thanks, Cap Mandrake

Yes, I was certainly getting the impression there's still plenty of fight in them.

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Post #: 72
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/2/2017 11:04:07 PM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Day 33 - 17 May (D+10)

This turned out to be a bad day! I really fouled up.

I re-instigated air strikes against Kiska including fighter straffing (ground attacks at 2k ft). I thought they'd be in and out so fast they'd be ok, but the flak was fearsome and caused havoc. In fact the flak was severe enough to knock down some Liberators too.

At sea, another of our subs at Attu was damaged by the same Japanese ASW unit which has already sunk one of our subs.

On the beach, our assault TF struggles to complete unloading despite lack of any harassment from the enemy, and the re-supply TF is unloading safely but very slowly.

The second wave amphibious TF arrives at Kiska during the night and commences unloading, but the enemy still have have more than enough ammo to hit the troops heading for the beach. Our counter-bombardment gets little reward by comparison.

On land, our beachhead remains on the defensive and the enemy bombard.

I am losing this, and increasingly so, unless I can turn things around very quickly. If, after the second wave reinforcement has disembarked, we cannot make progress then I'll have to admit defeat and pull the guys back off the beach!




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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/3/2017 12:04:25 AM >

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Post #: 73
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 12:19:28 AM   
GetAssista

 

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Status: offline 		Well, all your ground losses look like the result of hitting the beaches with low prep. Japs can't hurt you with bombardments and do not attack. What is the condition of your LCUs on Kiska? Do they recover disablements? Do you have any prepped HQ in range of Kiska?

Bombing against supplied AA division in a fortified position might be an excersize in futility and loss of planes. Especially your fragile fighters (with pilots lacking ground bombing skills I guess). Your best bet to expend Kiska supplies might be shuttle bombardments from Adak. Or amphib bombardments - a nasty tactics that groups many warships with one transport to make defenders reveal themselves.

Make sure that you have goods air search behind Kiska, cause you really do not want Jap supply run ins at this point

< Message edited by GetAssista -- 7/3/2017 12:22:52 AM >

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Post #: 74
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 12:55:42 AM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Thanks again, GetAssista

1. Amphib Prep - Two second wave units were already designated (on arrival at Dutch Harbor) for an assault on Attu. The first was immediately changed to target Kiska; it dropped from about 60% prep down to 30%. The other was 'told' the day before boarding and so I guess left with a prep of around 40%. But all the other units earmarked for Kiska had been so designated from the start. Not sure what I should have done to improve preparation? Wait longer I suppose?

2. Excuse me having to ask; what are LCUs?

3. As far as I can see I have only 2 HQs; the Nth Pacific HQ at Dutch Harbor and its USAF counterpart. The former is being prepared for strategic movement to Adak - when I get a ship back at Dutch capable of loading it!

4. I ordered a fighter ground attack on Kiska Island. They just seemed to take a fancy to the AAA unit! Still a bit surprised at the severity of the result.

5. Yes, you suggested BB/CA could replenish ammo at Adak. If I used a DD ammo tender that might be a quick reload? I was concerned earlier that its port capacity was so bad it would take a long time. Certainly a BB could not dock at Adak!

6. I was intent on preventing supply runs to Kiska. One was intercepted and even if it docked I doubt much useful would have got off the burning xAKs. However, the enemy have been harassing my subs which were intended to produce a state of siege. They're obviously not up to the task!The current PBY recon westwards from Adak is at about the maximum effort I can do without overloading the airstrip entirely.

I have 3xCLs in reserve - I was considering sending them out beyond Kiska as a surface combat / convoy raider TF.

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Post #: 75
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 8:15:50 AM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Day 33 - 18 May (D+11)

Submarine Ops are revised as below.




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Post #: 76
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 8:36:53 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
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Status: offline 		Day 33 - 18 May (D+11)

NAVAL OPs
- Subs revised as above.
- The 2xDD ASW patrol at Kiska is low on ammo, particularly depth charges, and so needs replenishment.
- The CA San Francisco escorting CVE Nassau seems surplus to requirements at present so it will leave the air combat TF, link up with the 2xDD (above) as escort, and expend its ammo on bombardment of Kiska, before all 3 ships replenish at Dutch Harbor.
- The 2xAMD (minesweeper specialist DD) have found no evidence of mines around Kiska and so will takeover ASW patrol. It seems they're equipped as normal DD also!
- The first assault TF (1xCA 6xDD 2x xAK 2x xAP) has been on station for 11 days! It has lost 1x xAK when it hit rocks and sank, and another has been hit by shellfire when almost unloaded. The CA Wichita is low on ammo, but most of the DDs have hardly fired a shot! They'll be given 24hrs to unload what they can and then will return to port. Once clear of Kiska the damaged xAK will be given 1xDD and detached.
- DDs from above TF with >80% ammo will be detached to undertake a surface patrol near Attu hitting any targets of opportunity.
- The amphibious supply TF (DD Balch, xAK Sacajewa) has had incredible good fortune in avoiding damage from coastal artillery, and quite frankly, although only 50% unloaded, it really helped bolster supplies at the beachhead at a vital time. With the supply situation much improved these ships will withdraw to Adak after 24 hrs for safety until needed.
- The second wave troops in APAs have nearly unloaded in just 24 hrs! (Oh, to have had APAs from the start!) This TF will turnabout when unloading complete during today.
- CVE Nassau and its escort (now just 4xDD) will remain on station for 24 hrs after all troop / supply ships have left Kiska before returning to base.

AIR OPs
- Wildcats from CVE Nassau will continue to provide a nominal CAP over disembarkation. They will avoid overflying flak on Kiska itself when possible.
- Search patterns from Adak and Dutch Harbor will remain unchanged. PBYs covering large tracts of ocean for naval search, and Kiska Island for recon. Venturas will operate ASW patrols out of Dutch Harbor.
- Mitchells from Adak and Liberators from Dutch Harbor will bomb Kiska depending on availability.
- Boh our bases will maintain a small CAP.

ARMY OPs
- The Kiska beachhead now significantly reinforced will remain on the defensive today but will probe tomorrow.
- The Nth Pacific HQ will be got to Adak as soon as suitable sea lift is available and there are spare escorts at Dutch Harbor.



< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/3/2017 9:19:24 AM >

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Post #: 77
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 10:17:46 AM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		Day 33 - 18 May (D+11) RESULTS

Still taking casualties on the run into the beach. Two more hits on Transports at Kiska. The detached CA does a good night's work including destroying yet another SSX! A big raid by 26x Liberators against ground units is hardly effective - if only we could get one or two clear days!





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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/3/2017 10:19:37 AM >

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RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 10:36:09 AM   
GetAssista

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Energisteron
1. ... Not sure what I should have done to improve preparation? Wait longer I suppose?
Yep. While softening up Kiska with bombardments and blocade

2. Excuse me having to ask; what are LCUs?
LCU stand for land combat unit. A widely used abbreviation here on the forums

3. As far as I can see I have only 2 HQs; the Nth Pacific HQ at Dutch Harbor and its USAF counterpart. The former is being prepared for strategic movement to Adak - when I get a ship back at Dutch capable of loading it!
NorthPac should be prepping for kiska, and you better not attempt attacks on Kiska before the HQ is on Adak. On average you lose about 2-3 times adjusted AV w/o prepping HQ in range

4. I ordered a fighter ground attack on Kiska Island. They just seemed to take a fancy to the AAA unit! Still a bit surprised at the severity of the result.
AA fires on everyone, no matter who is bombed. Extensive damage is always the case with fighters, especially low flying ones. They are fragile planes.

5. Yes, you suggested BB/CA could replenish ammo at Adak. If I used a DD ammo tender that might be a quick reload? I was concerned earlier that its port capacity was so bad it would take a long time. Certainly a BB could not dock at Adak!
AKE/AE types disbanded in port do the reloading, no docking of warships needed. It was discussed somewhere earlier i recall.


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Post #: 79
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 11:33:35 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Thanks for clarification, GetAssista. You've been a great help.

Day 34 - 19 May (d+12)

A much better day despite the bad weather which prevents all air operations (or maybe that's why I had a good day!).

I think the graphic explains well enough.




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Post #: 80
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 11:47:34 AM   
Energisteron

 

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Status: offline 		My badly damaged S-32 is slowly losing its battle to stay afloat and is at risk of sinking about 250 NM SW of Dutch Harbor.

Can I send out a Tugboat or similar to help her out?

Can I send a PBY to pick up the crew?

RL will disrupt for a couple of days unfortunately. . .

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Post #: 81
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 12:39:09 PM   
Deathifier

 

Posts: 362
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From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline 		Looks like good progress.

Regarding unloading the APA's and AKA's are very useful and important ships.
Section 6.3.3.3.2 of the manual explains why, however the basics are:
APA unloads 3000 points per day.
xAP unloads 250 points per day.

So the APA will typically unload itself in a day or two and will generally unload 10 times faster than the merchant ship.

Regarding your 2000 feet bombing run - not a great idea as you saw.
That low down any AA gun, even machineguns, will fire at the planes.
Generally speaking machineguns can reach up to around 3k feet, medium AA to around 9k feet, and heavy AA can (for some guns) reach up to over 30k feet.

Choosing a good bombing height can be tricky, presenting the following problem:
- You want to go lower for better accuracy, thus more damage in a shorter timeframe.
- Yet if you go lower you get in range of more and more AA guns, taking more damage in return and losing planes and pilots.

The problem is magnified in this scenario since you simply don't have much to work with - you just don't have enough aircraft to seriously damage a unit.
However air support can do wonders if coordinated with your ground units as air attacks cause disruption (reducing their adjusted AV) and help use up supplies, even if the air attack itself doesn't appear to do much direct damage.

Going forward the indications of their lack of supply, your interdiction of their supply route, and the possibility that your last attack seriously reduced their combat capability means you are doing well on Kiska.

Do keep an eye on your troops fatigue and disruption levels - disruption in particular has a very negative effect on the adjusted assault value.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Energisteron

My badly damaged S-32 is slowly losing its battle to stay afloat and is at risk of sinking about 250 NM SW of Dutch Harbor.

Can I send out a Tugboat or similar to help her out?

Can I send a PBY to pick up the crew?


No, and no - nothing you can do at sea beyond avoiding moving at full speed.
About all you could do is disband it at a nearer location (any friendly dot base will do) and hope the crew can fix non-major flotation damage.
If you have an AS and/or AR you can disband those in the same base to help.

Maybe try getting it to Adak instead - a port helps, a larger port helps more.

- Deathifier

< Message edited by Deathifier -- 7/3/2017 12:44:38 PM >

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Post #: 82
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/3/2017 12:59:30 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
Joined: 11/15/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		Don't tell anyone but the sub crew is not really a sub crew. The worst that could happen is it sinks and you lose a couple of points. The S boats are due for the scrapyard anyway. Just reduce to cruise speed and get to the closest port, even if it is frozen rock with a gaggle of Inuit and a missionary or two, then disband the boat.
The crew can live on walrus blubber seal jerky until help arrives.

On the "Nutrition Screen" ("Ctrl N") select "Indigenous/Reptiles/Insects/Tree Bark"

< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 7/3/2017 1:06:28 PM >

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Post #: 83
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/6/2017 11:32:15 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Good point, Cap'n Mandrake.

The intricate details of this game never cease to amaze me!

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Post #: 84
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/6/2017 11:34:08 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Thanks again, Deathifier, for your insight and tips. Back home later and I will dive back into this scenario as soon as I've a full stomach!

(in reply to Energisteron)
Post #: 85
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/7/2017 8:25:36 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 35 - May 20 (D+13)

Naval Situation (see attached)






Attachment (1)

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Post #: 86
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/7/2017 9:10:41 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 35 - May 20 (D+13)

Outcome : Quite a good day really.

At sea the 3xDD TF intercepts the enemy supply convoy as it leaves Attu Island causing significant damage to the freighters. SS S-32 remains afloat.

All air operations are cancelled due to severe weather.

On land, another deliberate attack hurts them far more than us, but our troops are getting weary.








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Post #: 87
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/7/2017 10:26:43 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 36 - May 21 (D+14)

The 3xDD near Attu leave their patrol zone behind and go west and then loop back in search of the damaged enemy convoy. However, there's no sign of it.

All TF returning to Dutch Harbor for replenishment and repair arrive safely, including both damaged subs.

Bad weather prevents any significant air activity.

Our beachhead bombards the enemy defensive perimeter which remains on the defensive.

(in reply to Energisteron)
Post #: 88
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/7/2017 10:57:16 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 37 - May 22 (D+15)

A fairly routine day. No surprises.

The weather improves, permitting 2 Gps of Liberators to bomb Kiska. Yet another SSX midget sub is destroyed (that must be the last one!) in the attack on the port. Ground forces are hit too although effectiveness is unknown. We have no losses flying at 12k ft.

The 1xCA 2xCL surface combat patrol completes its sweep without incident and returns to Dutch Harbor. Meanwhile another Bombardment TF, 2xBB 1xCL 2xDD, leaves Dutch Harbor bound for Kiska. CVE Nassau returns for replenishment.

The final remnants of the units already on Kiska are loaded up and set out for the Kiska beachhead. Again we bombard only. The enemy defenders do nothing of note.

(in reply to Energisteron)
Post #: 89
RE: 1000 mile war - liberating the Aleutians - 7/7/2017 11:12:02 AM   
Energisteron

 

Posts: 617
Joined: 6/17/2017
Status: offline 		Day 38 - May 23 (D+16)

Not so routine! It seems a Japanese CV is on the loose, probably just outside our PBY search range.

The 3xDD TF near Attu experiences several air attacks seemingly emanating from westward and DD Hull is torpedoed and sunk. We will need to withdraw our surface ships from the vicinity but all subs will be moved to Attu.

Liberators continue to plaster Kiska. Two are damaged by flak.

The ground forces will make another attack tomorrow but limit themselves to a mere bombardment today.




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< Message edited by Energisteron -- 7/7/2017 9:05:20 PM >

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