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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Finis

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RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 12:38:31 PM

Olorin

Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/22/2008
From: Greece
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Finis

The end.

Jocke let me know this morning that due to changes at home that he cannot continue playing the game that has seen so many great turns from both sides.

A big thanks to Olorin, who let me pick up the game and had one of the strongest openings I ever saw.

And another super big thankyou to the readers and participants of this AAR.

And a great big thanks to Jocke, a wonderful pbem player.

Thank you all.

Well played Lowpe!

I admire you for holding on after the defeat in the WC, I don't know if I 'd have done it to be honest. So who would you say was the winner (if any) of the war?

_____________________________

"Drang nach Osten"
--A TOAWIII AAR--

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3751

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 1:24:04 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

If you think you might want to continue, I can do a turn a day. I have not really followed you or Jockes AAR, so I an unsure what is happening now.

Bill, you can check out Jockes AAR if you are interested.

I have a few things going on irl, and quite frankly 2 full games is probably a half game too much for me...but I am not going to rule anything out.

Jocke has offered to send the password on.

PDU off, scenario 2 style babes game.

(in reply to BillBrown)

Post #: 3752

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 1:53:21 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Olorin

I admire you for holding on after the defeat in the WC, I don't know if I 'd have done it to be honest. So who would you say was the winner (if any) of the war?

Hiya Stranger!.

Nothing to admire, really, I simply knew that Japan can lose almost infinite troops once in the game. And in this case, the Allies didn't gain any real estate with the loss...so having a strong endgame wasn't in doubt to me once the rebuilt divisions started coming thru.

Who won? Who knows, probably you.

I think I pulled off a few neat operations: Midway, the plot to sink a carrier off the east coast of Oz, China snowball, Indian invasion, Alaska, and last but not least Burma. Perhaps I am most proud of how the air force did, and countering Fletcher/Brooklyn task forces.

Of course my failures were catastrophic. San Diego, losing control of the baby KB. A few other small stuff. Losses don't really bother me at all, especially if they gain time.

But it was all great fun so perhaps everybody won.

Allies, I fear fell into the bigger wrench strategy, instead of a more subtle offensive. I don't think Jocke ever realized how much stronger Japan is on the ground, in a scenario 2 style game and he never took advantage of the west coast losses fast enough and then went primarily where Japan was somewhat strong.

The Allies would have ground their way forward, probably up New Guinea to the Mindanao and Luzon and from there a long bombing campaign of Honshu. But supply, fuel, oil, industry wise Japan was very solid. Almost painfully strong for all the hijinx I put the Empire thru.

In the air, Sam and the Ki94II would certainly arrive in huge numbers and likely the SamJ. Night bombing is a pdu off weakness for the Empire, but I would have maxed all possible squadrons with the best frames...and nightbombing in that kind of environment is very slow and tedious till 2nd qtr 45. There was tons of lowN kamikaze pilots with 70 skill in the pools.

At sea I lost the mini kb, but never a fleet carrier, or battleship. I was able to fight the Fletchers and Brooklyns very well, and that all must have been frustrating to the Allies.

With a full fleet KB, and all carriers arriving, there would be no free lunch in the ocean, no easy path to Honshu. The late 44 infantry arrived, along with all the rebuilt divisions, and in an orgy of task forces was shipped out to locations all around the Empire...even if the final destination wasn't correct that sigint had to weigh on the Allies.

Jocke's enthusiasm for the game was very high till Midway...and Midway was such a crushing loss for him, although in truth the loss was fairly tiny in the scheme of things, except for time.

And I played for time.

Of course I am merely guessing about Allied intentions and state of mind...but I think I am fairly correct.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 9/12/2017 2:04:49 PM >

(in reply to Olorin)

Post #: 3753

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 2:34:57 PM

Olorin

Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/22/2008
From: Greece
Status: offline

Nice summary, thanks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Perhaps I am most proud of how the air force did, and countering Fletcher/Brooklyn task forces.

Any tips on how you did that?

Last time I faced them against Michael (NYGiants) I developed an unhealthy hatred for the Fletchers.

_____________________________

"Drang nach Osten"
--A TOAWIII AAR--

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3754

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:16:12 PM

Canoerebel

Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline

I didn't closely follow Jock's AAR, but one thing I do remember was the optimism he felt in Burma shortly after your failed West Coast gambit. Several players were cautioning him that Ramree Island and vicinity would quickly bog down into a protracted slugfest, but he had visions of major conquests taking place steadily and rather quickly.

I think Burma, more than anything else, lowered his enthusiasm for the game.

(in reply to Olorin)

Post #: 3755

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:16:13 PM

BillBrown

Posts: 2335
Joined: 6/15/2002
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

If you think you might want to continue, I can do a turn a day. I have not really followed you or Jockes AAR, so I an unsure what is happening now.

Bill, you can check out Jockes AAR if you are interested.

I have a few things going on irl, and quite frankly 2 full games is probably a half game too much for me...but I am not going to rule anything out.

Jocke has offered to send the password on.

PDU off, scenario 2 style babes game.

It looks like you are still in Dec 1943, there is a lot of game left to go. I was trying to imply that I do not have any detailed knowledge of your intentions and/or dispositions. The offer still stands, I would take over for Jocke if you want to continue.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3756

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:18:02 PM

Canoerebel

Posts: 21100
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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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Lowpe, take BillBrown up on the offer! Even if it requires a brief sabbatical while he looks at the map and gets up to speed, and while you decompress a bit and figure out a pace that will work for you.

AAR matches between longtime forumites taking games deep are pretty rare and a heckuva lot of fun to read.

Do it! Do it!

(in reply to BillBrown)

Post #: 3757

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:25:57 PM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Olorin

Nice summary, thanks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
Perhaps I am most proud of how the air force did, and countering Fletcher/Brooklyn task forces.

Any tips on how you did that?

Last time I faced them against Michael (NYGiants) I developed an unhealthy hatred for the Fletchers.

I countered Fletchers with multiple small task forces, low threat tolerance, and a high numbered task force preferably the Mutsu or Nagato with 6 destroyers (sometimes I only had 3).

The early task forces would trade torpedoes and flee, the battleship task force would slug it out last often taking more than 20 hits but almost always putting down a Brooklyn.

In addition, I had anti-ship planes that could hit Fletchers out to 11 hexes, namely the Lilly db, so the Fletchers were vulnerable on approach and after a fight if the bases allowed me.

But it was really the 2 and 3 ship destroyer, cl destroyer task forces that fought first that won the battles, even though they usually took greater losses than inflicted. Their low threat tolerance allowed them to fight once and retreat...and then the next task force would fight.

I managed several good to great fights like that in the Bay of Bengal early, and also around Lunga and most recently off New Britain.

In no cases was I looking for a single task force slugging match, and when I did put together big task forces I switched their status to fast transport low threat...with the result of a very fast inconclusive battle like what happened at Manus recently.

I had one bad cruiser fight, and several other cruiser mistakes but that was due to my sloppy play or missing clicks on the turn. That stuff always happens, just try to minimize it.

So, at night, the multiple small task forces really punch over their weight, because normally 100% of Japan's ships fight every encounter, and only 1/3rd of the Allies ships fight..and then the heavier ships come in against a minimal torpedo threat, whereas each successive Japanese fleet has a full threat of torpedoes...plus they are shooting at damaged ships, higher dl, targets.

IN 1942 my CAP was pretty much max HR, 20K. But starting in 43 I switched to low layered CAP that I have (and others recently Obvert) written so much about.

On day one of the takeover from you, I juiced the r&d program for Frank A (and subsequently R) very much. So much that I had the Frank R in Oct/Nov timeframe...and that they did so well versus the Jug flying low layered CAP must have been very disconcerting.

As we saw in other games where low layered cap is used, the Allied player simply can't wrap their heads around a game where the loss ratio is not 10-1 in favor of the Jugs.

Too often the Allied player is a bigger wrench player...hopefully that will change and make for more interesting games.

(in reply to Olorin)

Post #: 3758

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:27:52 PM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown

If you think you might want to continue, I can do a turn a day. I have not really followed you or Jockes AAR, so I an unsure what is happening now.

Bill, you can check out Jockes AAR if you are interested.

I have a few things going on irl, and quite frankly 2 full games is probably a half game too much for me...but I am not going to rule anything out.

Jocke has offered to send the password on.

PDU off, scenario 2 style babes game.

It looks like you are still in Dec 1943, there is a lot of game left to go. I was trying to imply that I do not have any detailed knowledge of your intentions and/or dispositions. The offer still stands, I would take over for Jocke if you want to continue.

PM me your email, and I will forward it to Jocke with a request for the password. He is willing to do this.

(in reply to BillBrown)

Post #: 3759

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 3:51:44 PM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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If you can wait a few weeks, and Bill isn't picking it up, I'm interested.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3760

RE: Finis - 9/12/2017 9:38:05 PM

Bif1961

Posts: 2014
Joined: 6/26/2008
From: Phenix City, Alabama
Status: offline

I always look forward to reading this AAR and learning many different tips hints and rules.

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 3761

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 3:09:48 AM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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Bill has the turn, the password, the bell, clock and candle.

He will take a few days to get his feet wet and figure out what is going on...

(in reply to Olorin)

Post #: 3762

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 7:08:09 AM

paradigmblue

Posts: 784
Joined: 9/16/2014
From: Fairbanks, Alaska
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Bill has the turn, the password, the bell, clock and candle.

He will take a few days to get his feet wet and figure out what is going on...

I didn't get a turn from him today, so I imagine that he's probably taking his time sorting out his position in this game.

He's an interesting player - I've found that defensively that he works hard to preserve his units, even when he can trade them for time and inflict disproportionate losses instead. He seems to be incredibly risk-averse in ships, LCUs and airframes. His sub-game is on-point though, and he seems to know right where to position wolfpacks of subs positioned in a grid to catch my shipping, then moving them to a new location when I shift ASW to cover.

I'm looking forward to seeing how this game shakes out!

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3763

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 8:48:50 AM

GetAssista

Posts: 2732
Joined: 9/19/2009
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Lowpe, great to have this game continue!
I'm always enjoying reading you, and this one is the best contemporary AAR in terms of info and tactics for the dark side. Especially for the later parts of the learning curve

(in reply to paradigmblue)

Post #: 3764

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 3:23:41 PM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: paradigmblue

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Bill has the turn, the password, the bell, clock and candle.

He will take a few days to get his feet wet and figure out what is going on...

I didn't get a turn from him today, so I imagine that he's probably taking his time sorting out his position in this game.

He's an interesting player - I've found that defensively that he works hard to preserve his units, even when he can trade them for time and inflict disproportionate losses instead. He seems to be incredibly risk-averse in ships, LCUs and airframes. His sub-game is on-point though, and he seems to know right where to position wolfpacks of subs positioned in a grid to catch my shipping, then moving them to a new location when I shift ASW to cover.

I'm looking forward to seeing how this game shakes out!

quote:

store products community support corporate press

Thanks for the info, no clue on his playstyle, which might vary from game to game...but is great background.

Hope it doesn't slow your game down too much.

(in reply to paradigmblue)

Post #: 3765

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 3:24:20 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

Lowpe, great to have this game continue!
I'm always enjoying reading you, and this one is the best contemporary AAR in terms of info and tactics for the dark side. Especially for the later parts of the learning curve

Thanks, Get. Looks like the Imperial trials aren't over quite yet.

(in reply to GetAssista)

Post #: 3766

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 3:33:40 PM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I didn't closely follow Jock's AAR, but one thing I do remember was the optimism he felt in Burma shortly after your failed West Coast gambit. Several players were cautioning him that Ramree Island and vicinity would quickly bog down into a protracted slugfest, but he had visions of major conquests taking place steadily and rather quickly.

I think Burma, more than anything else, lowered his enthusiasm for the game.

You maybe correct CR, as Jocke sent an email implying that Burma was giving him fits.

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 3767

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 3:35:06 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

If you can wait a few weeks, and Bill isn't picking it up, I'm interested.

Ouch, that would have been a clash.

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 3768

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 5:42:47 PM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
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From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

If you can wait a few weeks, and Bill isn't picking it up, I'm interested.

Ouch, that would have been a clash.

I think you were probably just afraid.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3769

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 9:34:04 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

If you can wait a few weeks, and Bill isn't picking it up, I'm interested.

Ouch, that would have been a clash.

I think you were probably just afraid.

You aren't wrong.

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 3770

RE: Finis - 9/13/2017 9:39:20 PM

Lowpe

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I guess I will get a turn from Bill in a day or three.

He is wrapping his head around PDU off.

Been a bit, I don't think I did too much interesting last turn...but I suspect the Allies might be a little more aggressive against my industry right off the bat. Perhaps some LRCAP traps.

A whole new game...expect the unexpected. I guess.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3771

RE: Finis - 9/14/2017 2:30:43 AM

Canoerebel

Posts: 21100
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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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Jeff, I'm really glad you're continuing. Good matched AARs are much fun for the Forumites.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3772

RE: Finis - 9/14/2017 3:05:40 PM

Lowpe

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Should have a turn tonight from Bill...really, no hurry right now, it is more important to get Bill off and feeling comfortable.

Taking over a game is a really daunting task as you have no clue what is under the hood. Most AARs focus on the positive, and I am sure Bill is seeing a few surprises. Some I am sure he likes, and others probably having him scratching his head.

So, I am in a lot of ways Mirroring Obvert/CR game right now with the Allies getting new leadership. Will they continue on the path laid out by Jocke, or will it be a re-examination, and and different direction. Who knows, and as Japan there are only subtle things I can do to nudge the Allies where I want them.

This is perhaps one of the least appreciated aspect of running Japan, and that is dropping subtle hints via recon, sigint, ship detection, sub detection, base building, in encouraging the Allies to chose an axis of advance.

I don't like that Bill will use his subs well...that is one area in this game I tried to do a lot differently, by using only Navy air in ASW and Jocke certainly did a good job in hitting tankers. But in truth, I didn't really need the tankers, and by using so many to raid convoys...it left the Allies a little blind on their invasions.

Ah well, it is like a new game is starting....

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 3773

RE: Finis - 9/14/2017 3:11:53 PM

Canoerebel

Posts: 21100
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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
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You are Sherman, and Hood just replaced Johnston.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3774

RE: Finis - 9/14/2017 3:23:29 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

You are Sherman, and Hood just replaced Johnston.

I would prefer being Lee facing the Napolean of the North. But I fear it will be more like Lee versus Grant, a long war of merciless attrition.

Sherman implies an unstoppable offensive juggernaut aimed at Hollywood. Tried that already.

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 3775

RE: Finis - 9/15/2017 12:19:57 AM

Lowpe

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No sooner than had I flipped the turn in my other game, when this game got reborn. Basically a new game...lets see what happened.

(in reply to Olorin)

Post #: 3776

RE: Finis - 9/15/2017 12:21:20 AM

Lowpe

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Dec 9th, 1943

Almost 1944. Allied sub swings and misses, but comes back during the morning to sink the xakl on the surface after firing 2-3 more torpedoes at her.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3777

RE: Finis - 9/15/2017 12:23:43 AM

Lowpe

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Hmm., where to begin. How about Burma. Japan bombs and strafes, Allies quiet.

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(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3778

RE: Finis - 9/15/2017 12:25:43 AM

Lowpe

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New Britain

The main Yankee/Australian/New Zealander thrust. What a mess of troops out there, that I am barely keeping in supply, and really need to pull back from the monster runways the Allies have, while delaying and inflicting some losses.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 3779

RE: Finis - 9/15/2017 12:26:54 AM

Lowpe

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Plane losses for the day was tiny, but ship losses substantial for Japan. The collision is wishful thinking I am sure. But that Island is always a good hunting ground for Iboats.