Improvements making SPWW2 obselent

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Improvements making SPWW2 obselent

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> Improvements making SPWW2 obselent

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Improvements making SPWW2 obselent - 5/28/2001 8:16:00 PM

Gordon_freeman

Posts: 28
Joined: 5/14/2001
From: Deutschland
Status: offline

Hi everyone! I'd like to share my thoughts with all of u and raise a few questions. Before i start i have to say "Thanks" to the developement of SPWAW, could'nt say it often enough! So, back to the Topic: I found a couple of strange things happen in SPWAW: First of all how is it possible to place ships on ground to make them, let's say, an imobile fortress. Then, why do indirect weapons not get inderect weapon characteristics, like the German IG 75 and 105? Just to make you people think: The dreaded 8,8 was even used as artillery, it all depends on the amunition it was using! I find it also a lil confusing that SPWAW is using the small "OoB", unlike it's compatitor SPWW2, which is using also the better maps and objective system. I also think u should work on the OoB in terms that Ski-troops should'nt be available in Africa, still tempting, but... Conclusion would be to take the maps and OoB of SPWW2 and make them Work in SPWAW. For people who don't like the huge maps, give them an option to choose what kind of weather or mapsize they want to play on. I also like to see a more devastating effect of flamethrowers, special vehicle ones, first their effectiveness on Moral should be better considered and the range should be bigger, imagine a Crocodile with that short range... I also would like to see the supply points after each campaign battle raised compared to the over all war situation, so for instance u don't get a lot of points in Africa early 1943. And last and least, on the long campaign consider the small countries involvement (like Holland, Norway or Greece). Of course i could change my own OoB but that makes me incompatible towards email games. And finally, is there intrest for games where a lot opf people can participate and change the battle outcome (like Kursk or soomething)? The games shall be played over email and referees should decide what battle comes next. Thanks for reading and cannot wait for reading all the replies.

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- 5/28/2001 9:31:00 PM

Del

Posts: 123
Joined: 4/22/2001
From: Central USA
Status: offline

I like the terrain in SPWW2 better also. They managed to get all terrain so it is compatible with all levels in a proper manner. Since both games used the same basic engine I don't see why there is such a big problem doing the same for SPWaW. The larger OBs are also better. One annoying thing in SPWW2 is how difficult the infantry is. They need to make them a little more susceptible to casualties. Flame throwers are fine just as they are unless they had a longer range historically. People tend to over use them in this game as it is. One of the problems with many people I've played are the unreal choice of units. I'm playing one guy in a NA game. He must have every flampanzer ever sent to NA in our battle. The only way around things like ski troops in NA would be to place restrictions on units before the game. Tedious but I'm beginning to believe it will be necessary. As for making weapons capable of indirect and direct fire, this would probably be a major code overhaul. I would rather see them work on the Fire Fight upgrade. In a Long Campaign the author had the ability to add small countries. The possibilities inherent in the latest campaign editor are limitless. It doesn't take much of an imagination to start coming up with loads of things you might do given the time to do it.

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- 5/28/2001 11:46:00 PM

Paul Vebber

Posts: 11430
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Portsmouth RI
Status: offline

First of all th etwo games are based on totally different engines. SPWW2 is based on DOS SP2 and SP:WaW is based on the online version of SP3. Two completely different games with completely different map file systems. Ski troops only get bonus movement in on WINTER maps, so while you can buy them in AFrica they don not get to "ski" there, just walk. Why some units historically capable of firing indirect don;t get ot fire indirect, well first becasue while many types of units (including MGs) could fire "indirectly" only artillery units where trained to respond for "calls for fire". Such artillery training was hard to come by and is what is portrayed in the game by "indirect fire" most tanks, 88s even infantry gins where not trained in this , and while they often did fire indirectly, it was en masse and generally part of a preperatory barrage to which they contributed little demonstrable effect. STHere are exceptions, but hte other problem is the players omniscience as to knowing exactly where enemy units are and what they are allowing fire direction far more intellignetly than modern armies are capable of, so making ever unit and its brother capable of indirect fire frankly ruins the game. As we have said before - SP:WW2 had no scenario base when they made the decision to revamp the map and OOB system. SP:WaW had dozens of scenarios that hundreds of hours of work had gone into and we did not want to make them obsolete or force teh designers to redo thir work from scratch. Most of the extra units in SPWW2 are minor variations on infantry units some of which differ from each other only in name and maybe what rifle or grenade type(which are all but indentical except for the name) so the 'detail" in many cases is for appearances sake and has no discernable effect on game play. While the map routines look good, they don't come close to hand edited maps so we have fiocsed on map editing tools, not whether marsh can appear correctly on slopes or not. We also didn;t want to add higher slopes that simply act like higher steps up an escalator with no reflection of proper slope or effect on engagebility. You can shoot straight down for a 150m hill into an adjacent ground level hex and its still range 1 - despite beinng 3 hexes "up" and the shooter is always assumed "parallel to the deck" - we want to reflect hills properly, not like so many books stacked under the "green felt". It impossile to make SPWW2 OOBs and mpas work in SP:WaW - like sayin lets make campaing series OObs and maps work in SP:WaW. Vehicel flamethrowers have a range of 100m - not sure what the problem there is - they will generall casue 1-4 casualties, to a squad spread out over 50m that is pretty devesatain and leaves them with 60 or 80 suppression. WHile they wew devestaing weapons they could not not flood an entire 50m hex with instant death. Watch the movies of them - they went to a pretty specific point and if you were there - you where toast (hence the fairly automatic one kill and rout status for the target squad) but SPWW2 seems to assume your whole squad is bunched up about 10 yards away form each other. Long camapigns are difficult to program so don;t excpect minor countries until we have teh major country ones fine tuned a bit more. As to "incompatibility with pbem" Thats a cop out! Version 5 will no longer lock you out for incompatible OObs and you can simply back up your "official" OObs in a"folder and exchange OOB files when you start an email game and keep them in a folder with the game files! There is no reason folks should be afraid to experiment withe different OOB files (or preference settings) in pbem as long as it is by mutual consent. If "winning" is so all fired up important that you ignore the customization ability of the game - you are losing sight of the forest for the trees!

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