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CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 10:18:04 AM

GetAssista

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So, I have an occurence of my numerous CAP staying on the ground in both day phases on the perfectly fine level 9 airfield (picture is from after the turn), and no hint in operational report or turn replay why.

Moved a dozen fighter airgroups there the turn before to play cap trap, there is excessive support (not that it would matter the same turn though), no overstacking or other noticeable issues, clear skies in the combat report. Got happily bombed to dust by the AI, so inquiring minds want to know. I can hardly recall any reasons in the mechanics for CAP being grounded except airfields blown to smithereens. Even extreme weather as far as I know does not prevent CAP from flying.

Do I miss something?

Edit: does not fly with reloading saves and tinkering with settings to reset RNG either

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< Message edited by GetAssista -- 10/29/2017 10:42:37 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 12:25:54 PM

Yaab

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I saw sweeps not flying at all when leader air skill was in 20-29 range. Yours is 45. No clue.

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Post #: 2

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 1:50:04 PM

Ian R

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Is Hakodate in the arctic weather zone?

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 2:12:27 PM

PaxMondo

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You've got tstorms in your forecast, if weather is extreme, missions will not fly ...

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 2:17:34 PM

GetAssista

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R
Is Hakodate in the arctic weather zone?

It's there on base screenshot ;) Temperate zone. It is November in game but it does not matter with temperate.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
You've got tstorms in your forecast, if weather is extreme, missions will not fly ...

I've said that the screenshot is from the next day. AI bombed me with clear skies in combat report. Not to mention that several reloads with varying RNG also would result in varying weather.
And I highly doubt that CAP does not fly at all in thunderstorms anyways. Offensive missions yes, but not CAP (or training for that matter).

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Post #: 5

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 2:52:16 PM

Alfred

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Have you eliminated the possibility that there was no CAP flown over Hakodate because the CAP had wandered over to cover another hex?

Alfred

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Post #: 6

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 3:54:42 PM

MakeeLearn

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Are other missions flying out of the base? Only 19 Air Service Damage... A CAP essential 19?

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 4:20:26 PM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Have you eliminated the possibility that there was no CAP flown over Hakodate because the CAP had wandered over to cover another hex?

Alfred

It looks like range was 0.

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Post #: 8

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 5:00:23 PM

Alfred

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True for that squadron but were all squadrons set to 0 range?

The airfield damage is not high enough to prevent CAP operating.

If the air units had been flown into the airfield from a great distance it is possible that no air operations are flown by those units on the same day.

Alfred

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Post #: 9

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 5:27:32 PM

witpqs

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Also, sometimes CAP 'bleed-over' exceeds the range setting.

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Post #: 10

RE: CAP not flying - 10/29/2017 7:25:15 PM

GetAssista

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred
True for that squadron but were all squadrons set to 0 range?

The airfield damage is not high enough to prevent CAP operating.

If the air units had been flown into the airfield from a great distance it is possible that no air operations are flown by those units on the same day.
Alfred

Yeah, all squadrons at 70/80 CAP and 0 range. No other air battles for those fighters. In fact no at all, they did not fly anywhere and sit on Hakodate airstrip to be bombed.

Alfred, this thing about no air operations after transfer, do you have any hints on what it considers as a trigger?
Distance or fatigue were not issues because all fighters were flown from nearby Sapporo after several days R&R. But I get the feeling that this mass hopping might be responsible, if there is some kind of a bug. Hopping for CAP trap is a usual thing and I never had this useless CAP before

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Post #: 11

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 12:23:27 AM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

If the air units had been flown into the airfield from a great distance it is possible that no air operations are flown by those units on the same day.

Alfred

I have seen this happen on escort/strike, but not on CAP.

I see it happen on night CAP, I think.

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Post #: 12

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 1:23:04 AM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

I have seen this happen on escort/strike, but not on CAP.

I see it happen on night CAP, I think.

I have seen it in all night operations, and during day operations but not with CAP, but with LRCAP yes.

Well, it was commanders discretion not fly that day!

What was the morale prior...99?

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Post #: 13

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 1:46:18 AM

BBfanboy

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You set your shown squadron at 15,000 feet.
Were all your CAP set to the same altitude?
What altitude did the incoming strike have at the point of dropping bombs?
What kind of time did you have to intercept after they were detected?

Edit: Did all the other fighters have the same CAP %? If so, might they all have been down for refuelling when the strike came in?

< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 10/30/2017 1:48:00 AM >

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Post #: 14

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 7:23:39 AM

GetAssista

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe
What was the morale prior...99?

Somewhere around that. All involved fighters were on CAP duty with occasinal R&R for months so no sudden wipeouts.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
You set your shown squadron at 15,000 feet.
Were all your CAP set to the same altitude?
What altitude did the incoming strike have at the point of dropping bombs?
What kind of time did you have to intercept after they were detected?
Edit: Did all the other fighters have the same CAP %? If so, might they all have been down for refuelling when the strike came in?

15-20k among groups. There were "Allied: no flights" in the combat report for each of about couple dozen AI bombing raids, so this is not about detection/refuelling.

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Post #: 15

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 8:55:01 AM

RichardAckermann

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If you can, try repeating the turn with LRCAP on the airfield hex. I remember to have solved an issue like this a few years ago. (Could be wrong though)

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Post #: 16

RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 2:10:50 PM

Ian R

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R
Is Hakodate in the arctic weather zone?

It's there on base screenshot ;) Temperate zone. It is November in game but it does not matter with temperate.

I went and had a look - indeed the whole island is temperate. Still, it's in the "NE" weather quadrant, just on the border. Lots of rain and clouds up there to cause air groups to be grounded. But as you say, it was clear.

Edit: Did the fly the next day?

< Message edited by Ian R -- 10/30/2017 2:20:12 PM >

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 3:28:11 PM

Zecke

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R

quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R
Is Hakodate in the arctic weather zone?

It's there on base screenshot ;) Temperate zone. It is November in game but it does not matter with temperate.

I went and had a look - indeed the whole island is temperate. Still, it's in the "NE" weather quadrant, just on the border. Lots of rain and clouds up there to cause air groups to be grounded. But as you say, it was clear.

Edit: Did the fly the next day?

LA IA doesnt want to KNow nothing about ITSELF when playing as HUMAN

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/30/2017 3:28:53 PM

Zecke

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zecke

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R

quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R
Is Hakodate in the arctic weather zone?

It's there on base screenshot ;) Temperate zone. It is November in game but it does not matter with temperate.

I went and had a look - indeed the whole island is temperate. Still, it's in the "NE" weather quadrant, just on the border. Lots of rain and clouds up there to cause air groups to be grounded. But as you say, it was clear.

Edit: Did the fly the next day?

LA IA doesnt want to KNow nothing about ITSELF when playing as HUMAN

Because YOU RIGHT they should FLY

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Post #: 19

RE: CAP not flying - 10/31/2017 5:23:02 PM

Ian R

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Sorry, could you rephrase that?

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RE: CAP not flying - 10/31/2017 6:31:23 PM

Zecke

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R

Sorry, could you rephrase that?

if doesnt matter if weather is on or off; the AI; i mean THE WEATHER; will choose different scenarios of battle; some are good for the AI some are good for you..

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Post #: 21

RE: CAP not flying - 11/8/2017 6:11:03 PM

inqistor

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I don't see anything wrong with that setting. Maybe all pilots are in non-flying reserve, because of missclick?

The only thing, I can think of - that unit was doing other mission previously, and some values were not reset after changing it to CAP. Try to clear all orders, and set them again manually.

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Post #: 22

RE: CAP not flying - 11/13/2017 11:27:02 PM

Ian R

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zecke

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R

Sorry, could you rephrase that?

if doesnt matter if weather is on or off; the AI; i mean THE WEATHER; will choose different scenarios of battle; some are good for the AI some are good for you..

I know the AI gets certain 'cheats' in its favour, but I didn't know it got different weather.

Did the CAP fly the next day?

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RE: CAP not flying - 11/14/2017 1:57:21 AM

BBfanboy

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I don't know about different weather - I think what happens is that there is no "Leader Check" to see if the squadron would launch in the given weather - the AI just follows the order to launch no matter what. The AI always has very high Ops losses because of these mandatory orders, which would include strikes at max range.

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Post #: 24

RE: CAP not flying - 11/16/2017 1:36:05 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

I have seen this happen on escort/strike, but not on CAP.

I see it happen on night CAP, I think.

I have seen it in all night operations, and during day operations but not with CAP, but with LRCAP yes.

Well, it was commanders discretion not fly that day!

What was the morale prior...99?

I will update my answer with a question...how far did the planes have to fly to move to the new base?

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Post #: 25

RE: CAP not flying - 11/16/2017 5:52:05 PM

GetAssista

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To sum up, I tried to repeat the preconditions several times, shifting all squadrons out then back in. But the no-fly behaviour was never repeated. CAP was in place all the time just like it should be. Some random rare quirk happend that one time...

< Message edited by GetAssista -- 11/16/2017 5:53:04 PM >

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Post #: 26

RE: CAP not flying - 11/16/2017 6:21:05 PM

Lokasenna

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In one of my recent turns, I had a squadron of NFs not fly CAP at their new base. They were flying night CAP at their first base, then I transferred them (quite far, over 20 hexes), and they did not fly on the upcoming night. Two squadrons' worth.

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RE: CAP not flying - 11/16/2017 6:35:07 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

In one of my recent turns, I had a squadron of NFs not fly CAP at their new base. They were flying night CAP at their first base, then I transferred them (quite far, over 20 hexes), and they did not fly on the upcoming night. Two squadrons' worth.

That happens frequently with night fighters...and also when you switch from day to night operations there is also usually one day of adjustment when nothing flies. Not always, but most times.

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 28