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Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 2:12:36 AM

spence

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I've actually noticed this several times over the course of various games.

Playing as Allies if I order a tanker to "Load Oil" it will do so on the turn so ordered but then will just take up dock space and stop loading at around 35% full. On subsequent turns the "Load Oil" button is grayed out so re-ordering it is not an option. It would seem this is not an issue for Japanese Players. Is there some special secret to get one of your tankers to fill up?

Post #: 1

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 2:24:33 AM

dcpollay

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quote:

ORIGINAL: spence

I've actually noticed this several times over the course of various games.

Playing as Allies if I order a tanker to "Load Oil" it will do so on the turn so ordered but then will just take up dock space and stop loading at around 35% full. On subsequent turns the "Load Oil" button is grayed out so re-ordering it is not an option. It would seem this is not an issue for Japanese Players. Is there some special secret to get one of your tankers to fill up?

I never noticed this issue. Does your port have sufficient oil to continue to load? Or does it have to wait for the oil to flow to the port from elsewhere?

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Post #: 2

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 2:30:46 AM

spence

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Never actually looked but Soerbaya and Los Angeles are the two places I've bothered with trying so I'm fairly sure they didn't have to wait

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Post #: 3

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 3:40:32 AM

btd64

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Try turning off your Refineries. That will allow oil to build up....GP

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Post #: 4

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 6:23:30 AM

BBfanboy

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The issue could also be ops points for your tankers. They will run out before filling up so it takes several days to load.
I am not positive because I rarely haul oil, but I think it loads more slowly than fuel - lower viscosity I guess - so the load after one day is not as big as with fuel.

Port damage can also affect loading rates.

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Post #: 5

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 7:51:52 AM

Chris21wen

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Bases (refineries) use oil. For this reason the game prevents emptying a bases' oil tanks below a certain level dependant upon how much oil a base requires. If you do not have a excess of oil at the base then you'll never fill the tankers. You probably reached this limit.

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Post #: 6

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 10:07:48 AM

HansBolter

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chris H

Bases (refineries) use oil.� For this reason the game prevents emptying�a bases'�oil tanks below a certain level dependant upon how much oil�a base requires.�If you do not have a excess of oil at the base then you'll never fill the tankers.� You probably reached this limit.

This is what's happening. Especially at LA. I have experienced the same thing at this port.

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Post #: 7

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 11:58:45 AM

Yaab

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Allied surplus oil bases in stock: Palembang, Boela, Babo, Abadan.

Once the first three bases fall to Japs, forget about stealing oil from refineries anywhere on the map, other than shutting the refinereis.

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Post #: 8

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 12:25:23 PM

GetAssista

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter
This is what's happening. Especially at LA. I have experienced the same thing at this port.

Why ship oil from LA anyway? Getting fuel to Oz is more efficient
I cannot recall any occurence when Allies would ship oil. Except of course that initial running to the hills, where xAKs load up with supplies and fuel and tankers can get them some oil if no fuel is left.

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Post #: 9

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 1:33:35 PM

m10bob

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quote:

ORIGINAL: General Patton

Try turning off your Refineries. That will allow oil to build up....GP

Never thought of this!!!...Once again....Patton to the rescue!

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Post #: 10

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 1:45:14 PM

crsutton

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Hard for me to think of any situation where the Allies ever need to move oil. Perhaps in the early days but you are never going to run low on fuel anyways.

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Post #: 11

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 2:56:48 PM

spence

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Actually I've never moved oil before this particular game. I just wanted to do it. Supposedly the Australian heavy industries need oil to function and the Australian a/c factories need something from the heavy industries. Maybe not.

In any case there are presently 58000+ oil pts stored at Los Angeles. Two thousand pts are produced there per turn and the refineries use 2900+ per turn (must be some oil pts produced elsewhere or Los Angeles could never accumulate any oil pts).

In any case the tanker loaded oil pts on the initial turn but wouldn't load any more after that. If all I've read here about oil needing to accumulate is true it would seem it never would have loaded any oil at all. Just curious about this situation.

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Post #: 12

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 3:08:02 PM

Yaab

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Did yo try smaller TKs/AOs with 5000-6500 capacity?

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Post #: 13

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 3:08:39 PM

MakeeLearn

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quote:

13.2.1 - RESOURCES/OIL/SUPPLY:

You shouldn't need to move oil around in US. Manufacturing industry uses fuel rather than oil now. The only places where you want oil is places with refineries. The game is also pretty efficient about shipping fuel, oil, resources, and supply across the built up rail network in the US.
Los Angeles has a lot of industry and may have a high "minimum required oil". I believe it is somewhere around 25,000. Bases will generally hold on to the minimum required values of oil and resource and not allow them to be loaded onto TFs.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2260137

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Post #: 14

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 3:34:05 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: spence

Actually I've never moved oil before this particular game. I just wanted to do it. Supposedly the Australian heavy industries need oil to function and the Australian a/c factories need something from the heavy industries. Maybe not.

In any case there are presently 58000+ oil pts stored at Los Angeles. Two thousand pts are produced there per turn and the refineries use 2900+ per turn (must be some oil pts produced elsewhere or Los Angeles could never accumulate any oil pts).

In any case the tanker loaded oil pts on the initial turn but wouldn't load any more after that. If all I've read here about oil needing to accumulate is true it would seem it never would have loaded any oil at all. Just curious about this situation.

It is true that Oz has refineries waiting for oil, but the HI that you want requires fuel, not oil.

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Post #: 15

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 4:21:01 PM

btd64

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quote:

ORIGINAL: spence

Actually I've never moved oil before this particular game. I just wanted to do it. Supposedly the Australian heavy industries need oil to function and the Australian a/c factories need something from the heavy industries. Maybe not.

In any case there are presently 58000+ oil pts stored at Los Angeles. Two thousand pts are produced there per turn and the refineries use 2900+ per turn (must be some oil pts produced elsewhere or Los Angeles could never accumulate any oil pts).

In any case the tanker loaded oil pts on the initial turn but wouldn't load any more after that. If all I've read here about oil needing to accumulate is true it would seem it never would have loaded any oil at all. Just curious about this situation.

The Aussie Heavy industry needs Fuel not oil. But I do move some to keep there limited Refinery production producing some fuel. Also, Do shut down LA's Refineries for about a week and you will see oil build up that you can load. Tanker size doesn't matter....GP

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Post #: 16

RE: Loading Oil - 11/4/2017 11:16:27 PM

HansBolter

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter
This is what's happening. Especially at LA. I have experienced the same thing at this port.

Why ship oil from LA anyway? Getting fuel to Oz is more efficient
I cannot recall any occurence when Allies would ship oil. Except of course that initial running to the hills, where xAKs load up with supplies and fuel and tankers can get them some oil if no fuel is left.

Just something I experimented with a long time ago as a rookie making the presumption that the huge stockpile was 'there for the picking".

I know many players downplay any effort to maximize the Allied economy as a waste as the economic juggernaut will produce more than enough fuel and supply if you leave it alone, but finding ways to maximize one's play is an essential quality for many wargamers.

As a result, I look to find ways to fill the gaps in Allied production. There are some easy ways with a couple of quick examples coming to mind:

Pearl needs resources, which can be had in Hilo. Set up a CS convoy with an xAKL or two running a coastal route.

Christchurch needs fuel. If you're using Auckland as a SoPac fuel/supply hub use a YO or two to siphon a little fuel off to Christchuch.

You can find simple ways to supply needs in various locales, if as an Allied player, you actually look at the industry interface and identify the locales where shortages are preventing production.

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Post #: 17

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 4:53:35 AM

geofflambert

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Just ask the Fonz how to do it.

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RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 6:58:02 AM

Chris21wen

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From: Cottesmore, Rutland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

Just something I experimented with a long time ago as a rookie making the presumption that the huge stockpile was 'there for the picking".

I know many players downplay any effort to maximize the Allied economy as a waste as the economic juggernaut will produce more than enough fuel and supply if you leave it alone, but finding ways to maximize one's play is an essential quality for many wargamers.

As a result, I look to find ways to fill the gaps in Allied production. There are some easy ways with a couple of quick examples coming to mind:

Pearl needs resources, which can be had in Hilo. Set up a CS convoy with an xAKL or two running a coastal route.

Christchurch needs fuel. If you're using Auckland as a SoPac fuel/supply hub use a YO or two to siphon a little fuel off to Christchuch.

You can find simple ways to supply needs in various locales, if as an Allied player, you actually look at the industry interface and identify the locales where shortages are preventing production.

I do all that and ship oil at the start from the USA to Aus. Once supply/fuel distribution gets going properly in case Aus get isolated I stop oil from US. Res I rarely bother with except for the above mentioned and possible a few other minor locales.

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Post #: 19

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 11:54:45 AM

Itdepends

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Why would you bother shipping fuel to Australia for Heavy Industry? You dont need the HI points as the allies and instead of sending a tanker, send an AK loaded with supplies. Same (supplies) result and instant gratification,,,,,(instead of waiting for it to be produced).

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Post #: 20

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 12:57:57 PM

HansBolter

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Why would you bother shipping fuel to Australia for Heavy Industry? You dont need the HI points as the allies and instead of sending a tanker, send an AK loaded with supplies. Same (supplies) result and instant gratification,,,,,(instead of waiting for it to be produced).

I already stated why. For the satisfaction of having maximized all opportunities.

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Post #: 21

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 3:01:01 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: spence

Actually I've never moved oil before this particular game. I just wanted to do it. Supposedly the Australian heavy industries need oil to function and the Australian a/c factories need something from the heavy industries. Maybe not.

In any case there are presently 58000+ oil pts stored at Los Angeles. Two thousand pts are produced there per turn and the refineries use 2900+ per turn (must be some oil pts produced elsewhere or Los Angeles could never accumulate any oil pts).

In any case the tanker loaded oil pts on the initial turn but wouldn't load any more after that. If all I've read here about oil needing to accumulate is true it would seem it never would have loaded any oil at all. Just curious about this situation.

It is true that Oz has refineries waiting for oil, but the HI that you want requires fuel, not oil.

Actually, what is needed in Australia early in the war is fuel for ships and tons of supplies. The Allies are really not shipping supply to too many places due to the Japanese fleet running around. I just ignore Aussie industry or turn it off and start moving supply and fuel from the East Coast and Cape Town. But it is best to store fuel in places that area not connected by rail or or off shore as if you leave Australian Industry on it will drain your fuel stocks. Once the war is into it's second year, I turn everything back on in Australia and it seems to take care of itself. I moved a fair amount of oil around in my first campaign until I finally figured out that it just was not necessary to fret about Allied industry.

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Post #: 22

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 3:37:47 PM

Banzan

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Wrong info, but i learned something.

< Message edited by Banzan -- 11/6/2017 5:37:40 PM >

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Post #: 23

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 4:52:22 PM

alimentary

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Banzan
Oil and resources are produced as points x20/day. Refineries need points x20 as oil to work. HI will need resouces x20 and (i think) fuel x1. I am not sure if its 1 or more, as i never took care about HI as an allied player. Light industry will need just need resources x15.

Per the manual...

Oil centers are +10 oil per day per repaired strength point.
Refineries are +9 fuel, +1 supply for -10 oil per day per repaired strength point.

These numbers are mod-able. Though I am not able to find the fields in the provided scenario editor.

If one's goal is to provide fuel for Australia it is more efficient to ship in 9000 fuel points than to ship in 10,000 oil points and refine it down to 9000 fuel plus 1000 supplies.

If one's goal is to provide supply for Australia...

Heavy industry is +2 HI, +2 supply for -20 resource, -2 fuel.

Assuming resource availability, facility availability and time, 10,000 points of oil or 10,000 points of fuel would both end up producing 10,000 points of supply (and 9000 HI points). It does not matter which you ship in. But since xAK's are usually more plentiful than TK's one could instead choose to simply ship in 10,000 points of supply.

< Message edited by alimentary -- 11/5/2017 4:57:34 PM >

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Post #: 24

RE: Loading Oil - 11/5/2017 5:05:59 PM

BillBrown