How large was the Chinese army in Burma

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> How large was the Chinese army in Burma

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How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/29/2017 10:08:35 PM

walkerd

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When I play the most important house rule I suggest is you need to pay PP to cross borders if your command is restricted. It feels like the rule the game engine could not provide.

I of course have some exceptions, the Thai units, and would like to suggest the Chinese Expeditionary force. So how large was it? Is there any details available? I suppose I should also ask, should it be payed for with PP or should a a certain size force be able to cross the border for free?

Thanks

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/29/2017 11:42:18 PM

spence

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The Fifth Army and Sixth Army in 1942. Each reportedly had a combat power of roughly a Western Division. However the 200th Division (included in 5th Army in game) was reportedly a mechanized/motorized division in its own right that had previously been blooded in a successful Chinese offensive but had suffered heavy losses and been rebuilt. It held out for 2 weeks against the Japanese during the 1942 Burma Campaign, apparently by itself so it certainly doesn't deserve the negligible combat power accorded the typical Chinese division in the early stages of the game. Seems to me that there was also a division equivalent 11th Army as well. Anyways I'd say you may have to learn Chinese to accurately research your question.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/29/2017 11:59:53 PM

rustysi

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IIRC (I play as Japan, but have looked at the Allies) at least some of the Chinese units that crossed into Burma are unrestricted in the game, therefore no PP's. Take a look to be sure.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 12:05:47 AM

BBfanboy

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Most are assigned to 11th Army HQ, but they are not permanently restricted and can be bought out fairly cheaply early on. Some units are already Division sized and some are more like regiments that can combine into a division.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 7:04:08 AM

Kursk1943

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My answer to the question is not founded on what is programed into the game but based on the excellent "History of the Second World War", United Kingdom Military Series, The War against Japan, Volume II India's most dangerous hour by MajGen S. Woodburn Kirby. In appendix 12 the order of battle of the Chinese expeditionary force in Burma 1942 is listed in great detail (regimental level, names of commanders, etc. It consisted of:
- V Army: 22nd Div, 96th Div, 200 Div, Army troops
- VI Army: 49th Div, 55 Div, 93rd Div, Army troops
- LXVI Army: 28th Div, 29th Div, 38th Div, Army troops

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 8:03:57 AM

Barb

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However, IIRC that only the 5th Army got into combat before allied retreat from Burma. Other Armies may have advanced into Burma from the borders, but then held the line preventing the Japanese a free entry to China - maybe even retreating back to China border (or being pushed).

There was also some mixing up of formations as some divisions ended in India (22nd, 38th?), while others were pushed back to China. Then there was some flyout-flyin of personnel between India and China to fill up the units in India. These were trained and equipped by the allies and used mainly in opening of the Ledo road under Stillwell command (Chinese New 30th, New 22nd, New 38th, 14th and 50th Divisions) called X Force, while the divisions on the Yunnan border were under Y Force.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 1:07:35 PM

geofflambert

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Thai troops historically blew what Chinese forces were in Burma back into China and without much difficulty.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 1:10:52 PM

MakeeLearn

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CHINESE ARMY INDIA-BURMA CAMPAIGN

A unique pictorial history from a Chinese perspective

http://www.cbi-theater.com/cai/cai.html

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 1:21:34 PM

MakeeLearn

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"Time Runs Out in CBI"

https://history.army.mil/html/books/009/9-3/CMH_Pub_9-3.pdf

This volume continues and completes the story of the north Burma campaign, recounts the operations of Chinese-American forces along the Salween River, and describes the logistical efforts of General Sultan's command.

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 1:25:16 PM

MakeeLearn

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All 3 volumes

https://history.army.mil/html/bookshelves/collect/ww2-chiburin.html

The China-Burma-India Theater

1/Stilwell's Mission to China
2/Stilwell's Command Problems
3/Time Runs Out in CBI

< Message edited by MakeeLearn -- 11/30/2017 1:26:23 PM >

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RE: How large was the Chinese army in Burma - 11/30/2017 2:57:36 PM

Yaab

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Where is the movie about the 96th Division' march to China?

"All that the small group of Americans who had been flown from Burma to India could do was act as liaison between the Chinese and British, and Brereton's air force. Lacking resources of their own the Americans sometimes felt that they were contributing nothing. The AAF could consider it had kept the Chinese from perishing miserably in the northern Burma jungles. It alone had made possible the amazing march of the 96th Division, which made its way to Taro, then turned north to Shingbwiyang and Fort Hertz, from whence it made its way through the largely unknown country of northern Burma back to China. By its endurance the 96th Division showed some of the very best qualities of the Chinese Army, as it had earlier shown some of the worst."

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