Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Strategic Command Series >> Strategic Command WWII War in Europe >> Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/2/2018 3:22:50 PM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

So, my Allied opponent was looking to crush the Italians in Libya before DAK could arrive. I did a "Hail Mary" play and, in August 1940, slipped a German amphib unit into Alexandria unopposed.

Kudos to me, you're saying

. The move cut Allied supply capability in the Western Desert (though not as much as I expected--British and CW forces around Mutrah are still at supply level 5 despite being cut off from their major base and having no rail connection to Egypt, but I never did understand the supply rules)

BUT, what did surprise me is that the Iraqi Coup script did not fire as I expected.
Did it fail to fire because I had a unit IN Alex., and not just close to it?
If so, that seems a perverse result.
The anti-British faction in Iraq would have seen the loss of Alexandria as a major blow to British imperial rule, IMO, and would have definitely seized the moment.

The Manual says that DE 106 (the British decision to impose sanctions on Iraq) can't fire if the British don't hold Alexandria, but sin't the Iraqi Coup script independent of that DE?

If they are not independent, they should be, IMHO.

Anyone else seen this?

Post #: 1

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/2/2018 5:41:28 PM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

Follow-up note: My opponent re-took Alexandria in November 1940 (a Pyrrhic victory, I hope!) Meanwhile, I did manage to push an Italian unit east of Matruh (I didn't tell them it was a suicide mission!). And lo and behold! the Iraqi Coup event fired a turn later.

This seems odd, to say the least. Not to mention a poor reward for bold play. Losing the Iraqi oil income is a real crimp to the British at this point in the game and, IMO, my opponent got 4-5 turns of it that he really shouldn't have. Leaving aside the fact that I had to sacrifice an Italian corps to finally trigger the event (which was my choice, of course--but was done mainly to see if the script would fire after all).

Bill, Hubert, any thoughts? Is this WAD?

(in reply to Leadwieght)

Post #: 2

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/2/2018 5:58:37 PM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

Iraq is neutral until the coup, right ? Therefore, the UK doesn't get any MPP's from it. The Axis get MPP's after the coup [which I think is wrong because I suppose this would represent oil, and how would the Axis get it from Iraq to Germany, or Italy].

So, with Iraq neutral, if the Allies hold Alexandria and the Axis have
a unit within 2 hexes of El Alamein, or within 5 hexes of Alexandria or Amman, then the Allied player can impose sanctions, at which point Iraq joins the Axis. Personally, I wouldn't expect an Axis suicide raid to be able to trigger a political overthrow, but that is the way it is.

(in reply to Leadwieght)

Post #: 3

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/2/2018 7:22:34 PM

BillRunacre

Posts: 4945
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

I must admit that in my mind I was always expecting an Axis land advance into Egypt, rather than a bold landing in Alexandria to take the place. You caught me out!

_____________________________

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 4

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/2/2018 8:08:35 PM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

sPzAbt653, Sorry, but I don't quite understand your post. Britain DOES get the Iraq convoy income (70MPP/turn) as long as Iraq is either NEUTRAL or under Allied control. When Iraq goes for the Axis in the coup, Britain loses that convoy income until they can conquer Iraq or force the Iraqis to surrender by having two units next to Baghdad. After Iraq is conquered by the British, they get the convoy income back, plus the income from the Resource hexes in Iraq--mostly oil.

But my point was that I took Alexandria (and held it for four months) and yet the Iraqi coup script, was dependent on an ALLIED DE, which couldn't fire as long as the Axis held Alexandria. An actual Axis landing and occupation of Alexandria seems a more significant setback to the Allied cause than an Italian unit merely getting somewhat near Alexandria or El Alamein, but it was the latter event that was required to trigger the Iraqi nationalist coup. (Bill, I take it from your comment that this is a correct read of the situation, yes?)

And you are correct that the Allies can "choose" to impose sanctions or not, but failing to do so will bring Iraq in on the Axis side with no automatic Allied occupation of Basra, no XIII Indian Corps deploying there, so no Allied player will say NO to this event I think.

(in reply to BillRunacre)

Post #: 5

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/4/2018 2:17:30 PM

BillRunacre

Posts: 4945
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

Yes Leadwieght, you've understood me correctly.

_____________________________

(in reply to Leadwieght)

Post #: 6

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/6/2018 1:08:17 AM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

Ah well, the problem with humans is we are so darn unpredictable.

(in reply to BillRunacre)

Post #: 7

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/13/2018 2:13:04 PM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

So, my recommendation is that the Iraqi Coup be re-cast as an automatic script, rather than a Decision Event, somewhat like it was in SC2 Assault on Democracy (if memory serves).

Once the Axis player has triggered the geographic conditions by getting units in or near Alexandria or El Alamein, then the Iraqi coup happens automatically, the British occupy Basra and deploy the XIII Indian Corps there.

If it's desirable to leave something up to the Allied player, than maybe a DE could be crafted focusing solely on the decision to impose sanctions on Axis Iraq.

If the Allied player says yes, then cities and settlements in Iraq drop to supply level 1, if no, they stay at normal supply levels. Depending on the situation, the Allied player might wish to leave the Iraqi towns at normal supply levels to facilitate a faster move on Baghdad, but I could imagine situations in which it would be more advantageous to reduce the supply levels (for instance, if the Axis has taken Syria and might be trying able to Operate units into Iraq)

BTW, I also think the script and the sanctions, if they are part of a separate DE, should be free for the Brits, for game-balance purposes.

As it is now DE 106 is really one of those "non-decision Decision Events" that no Allied player will ever say "no" to.

Alternatively, if you want to make DE 106 a bit more of an actual choice, then saying "no" could, apart from the Allies saving the MPPs at least have the additional benefit that the XIII Indian Corps deploys in Egypt, instead of Basra.

Any thoughts?

(in reply to Leadwieght)

Post #: 8

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/15/2018 2:19:21 PM

BillRunacre

Posts: 4945
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

Interesting discussion, and I'll just add that the UK's decision on Iraq is largely to be ready to act when the coup happens, i.e. the coup will happen anyway if the trigger is met, but the UK can control whether or not to invest resources in weakening an Axis Iraq so as to reduce the chance of Germany benefiting greatly from it.

While this and other decisions might be no brainers, having them happen automatically isn't always ideal, as at least by presenting them as a decision the player remains the one in control, rather than the engine. It might be a relative illusion of choice with some of them, but just having (say) MPPs automatically deducted when an event will cost isn't something I like either.

Having the Indian Corps deploy in Egypt might make it more of a choice. I don't promise a change, but I like the suggestion. Perhaps someone could mod it and see how it feels?

_____________________________

(in reply to Leadwieght)

Post #: 9

RE: Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq - 1/15/2018 4:18:03 PM

Leadwieght

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/23/2017
Status: offline

Hi Bill, thanks for taking the time to read my posts. I take your point that it's better to minimize the number of auto-scripts and it would be particularly undesirable to have an auto-script that automatically deducted MPPs from your account (I play this game in part to get away from thinking about the Internal Revenue Service, thank you very much!)--that's another reason why I suggested the Allied response to the Iraqi coup should be cost-free.

So here's another suggestion: Once they Axis meets the geographic conditions (including having a unit IN Alexandria, please!), the Iraqi coup is triggered: Iraq goes Axis and Britain occupies Basra, free of charge. Then the Allied player is presented with two separate DE's; one is whether or not to impose sanctions on Iraq (lowering supply levels of Iraqi towns and cities)--this could be free or low cost (maybe 30-50 MPPS); immediately after that DE, the other DE would be the decision as to where to deploy XIII Indian Corps--Basra or Port Said. The cost for XIII should be 75-100 MPPs.

This would give the Allies some interesting alternatives: if they felt that the need to defend Egypt was more pressing than the need to re-take Iraq, then they could send XIII Indian to Port Said, impose sanctions on Iraq and let Rashid stew in his own juices for a while. Alternatively, they could send XII Indian to Basra, not impose sanctions and aim for a quicker march up the Tigris/Euphrates. Or they could send XIII to Egypt, not impose sanctions, and send a couple of Garrisons to Basra and then march up towards Baghdad.

(in reply to BillRunacre)

Post #: 10

Page: [1]

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Strategic Command Series >> Strategic Command WWII War in Europe >> Aleaxandria and pro-Axis coup in Iraq

Page: [1]