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Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 3:37:05 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2527
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline 		It has been opined that an Eastern Front 1941-45 game would make way more money than Desert War. Is that true? What do you think? What should be the next game that uses the Desert War game engine? Convince your peers.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 5:53:53 AM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		As common as EF is, it would be most popular, imo. Normandy is too limited. And nothing against the brave Poles, but please skip Case White. Have played it so many times, in so many games, can do it from memory

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 6:46:59 AM   
Alan Sharif

 

Posts: 1108
Joined: 8/1/2001
From: UK.
Status: offline 		I think any subject would be worth covering with this innovative game system. But I must agree, WW2 Eastern Front would most likely sell the most. but for me, it needs to be one of the more mobile battles/campaigns. That said, the Campaign in North Africa was the ideal subject for your game system, loads of space, low(ish) unit count.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 7:51:40 AM   
Rasputitsa


Posts: 2903
Joined: 6/30/2001
From: Bedfordshire UK
Status: offline 		France 1940 would be the same era for equipment and tactics, with variants and hypothetical scenarios for Allied first strike in 1939/40, No Maginot Line, but more mobile Allied forces, or Operation Sealion. Maybe even the military option over Czechoslovakia 1938, no Munich agreement.

East Front WEGO would be good, but to be manageable I guess it would have to be smaller scenarios, or corps size full campaign to keep the unit count down.


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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 8:01:56 AM   
zakblood


Posts: 22687
Joined: 10/4/2012
Status: offline 		well i'll go in my normal direction and say it,

Arnhem,

the bridge to far.

the area and battle i'm the most interested in, and also an area that's not be covered to death by everyone else, time period and maps and size would suit, so what do you think?

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 9:10:44 AM   
laska2k8


Posts: 556
Joined: 11/18/2005
From: Italy
Status: offline 		i'll go

- bulge
- italian campaign
- west front

no France
no Poland


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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 12:36:03 PM   
kipanderson

 

Posts: 394
Joined: 8/27/2001
From: U.K.
Status: offline 		Hi,

for operations and more operations, the Eastern Front is the natural setting.

This is due to geographical scale. There is room to make all those cunning plans come to fruition . The difference between the armies also adds more colour.

All the best,
Kip.


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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 12:50:42 PM   
76mm


Posts: 4688
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline 		Eastern Front.

I've always found Market-Garden to be too specific a situation (Main allied force barrelling down single main road and some isolated para landings) to be very interesting.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 1:01:52 PM   
Royal Fusilier

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 7/28/2017
Status: offline 		Well you have to go East eventually and since the old classic V4V title Velikiye Luki was my first introduction to a WEGO pc game that would be my preference. It is small enough to be manageable while capturing all the intense Eastern Front goodness. Bulge is also a must and Arnhem as well.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 2:31:36 PM   
kipanderson

 

Posts: 394
Joined: 8/27/2001
From: U.K.
Status: offline 		Hi,
If you guys wanted to do something different, then Yom Kippur War or NATO v WP Central Front would be great!
We have them here at Matrix and they fly off the shelf in paper and cardboard.
All the best,
Kip.


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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 5:10:13 PM   
jack54


Posts: 1402
Joined: 7/18/2007
From: East Tennessee
Status: offline 		I'm really glad that you picked North Africa as the first game with the system; something different. I might have passed this up thinking incorrectly, same old-same old. It's certainly very different IMHO.


The design of this game reminds me of one of my favorite games here at matrix; Kharkov/Across the Dnepr by SSG. So East Front would be my preference but in all truth, where-ever you go, I will probably follow.



Message edited for atrocious spelling and punctuation

< Message edited by jack54 -- 5/3/2018 5:54:29 PM >

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 8:16:17 PM   
Meteor2


Posts: 429
Joined: 7/20/2009
From: Germany
Status: offline 		France 1940 has not been done often. So still very interessting.
This and probably Eastern Front Scenarios are my favorites.
V4V comes into my mind.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/3/2018 10:45:55 PM   
Okayrun3254


Posts: 173
Joined: 8/28/2014
Status: offline 		East Front is my favorite. The battles of Kharkov '43, or the Chir River in the winter of '42 come to mind. My next favorite would be the Battle of the Bulge.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/4/2018 6:36:48 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2527
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline 		The stats so far...number to the left is Yes/number to the right is No.



Attachment (1)

< Message edited by bcgames -- 5/4/2018 6:40:11 AM >

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/4/2018 6:07:17 PM   
Kolbex

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames

It has been opined that an Eastern Front 1941-45 game would make way more money than Desert War.


Has the game not been performing well? I've been watching it and this forum with great interest, but I just don't have the money in my budget right now for it at $40. If it goes on sale for $20 eventually I will no longer be able to resist myself.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/5/2018 10:56:57 AM   
Meteor2


Posts: 429
Joined: 7/20/2009
From: Germany
Status: offline 		If dislikes are counted, too, I would like to express my dislike of the "Wacht am Rhein" operation.
Don't hit me , but every third operational wargame is covering this scenario. .

"Fall Gelb" has several advantages:
- British, Belgium, Dutch, French and German troops involved
- Scenario has not beaten to death
- Allied forces are on par (minimum) with the German forces
(quantity and technology wise)
- The knowledge about this campaign is (probably) not so wide spread (we can learn here)

My 2 cents.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/5/2018 2:36:12 PM   
vonRocko

 

Posts: 1447
Joined: 11/4/2008
Status: offline 		My picks:

France 40
Arnhem

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/5/2018 2:44:18 PM   
Omnius


Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline 		While the Eastern Front is an obvious great choice for this game system, so would be the Western Front battles. One shouldn't limit the Western Front to just Normandy or Market Garden. This game system lends itself to modeling many battles from a long campaign. I'd like to see both Normandy and Market Garden battles as part of a Western Front series, plus one shouldn't discount the Italian Front. Perhaps even early battles from 1939 and 1940 in a pack covering Poland and France plus perhaps even Norway or even Greece and Yugoslavia.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/6/2018 10:12:56 AM   
Rasputitsa


Posts: 2903
Joined: 6/30/2001
From: Bedfordshire UK
Status: offline 		I would be disappointed if we started counting No votes, I wouldn't vote 'no' to anything which adds to the library of available games, even if it wasn't a favourite subject.

I like the idea of a pack of early war campaigns, as I have already declared an interest in France 1938/40 - 'Sealion', the equipment and tactics are similar to the existing game, although Allied performance is generally so poor that there could be game balance issues.

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“A people which is able to say everything becomes able to do everything” - Napoleon

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/6/2018 6:33:39 PM   
Okayrun3254


Posts: 173
Joined: 8/28/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames

It has been opined that an Eastern Front 1941-45 game would make way more money than Desert War. Is that true? What do you think? What should be the next game that uses the Desert War game engine? Convince your peers.


As a gamer, As stated previously, Eastern Front is my favorite. I agree with the statement that a Eastern Front game would make more money than a Desert War game. I have no data to back this up, it is just a gut feeling from playing these games for many years. I also really like the Desert game, and I am very imersed in this one.

I would like to add on to that original question. Is there another WWII front that would do better than the Eastern Front. Not sure, but I would guess a Normandy, Market Garden, or Buldge game would be close since those may be most recognizable names to newcomers. I would guess a game developer would like to appeal to as broad a base of customers as possible.

I do like the thought of a Tunisia, or Sicily game, but I think the next one should be one of the big hitters, Eastern Front (Stalingrad - Not city battle, maybe 6th Army relief attempt, etc., Kharkov 42, 43, Smolensk, Battle for Moscow, Operation Typhoon would be great!!!), Normandy (Mortain, Epson, Dautless), Market Garden (I do like the Hells Highway actions) or Buldge.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 4:58:34 AM   
bcgames


Posts: 2527
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Bramble Rose Farm, KS
Status: offline 		You have convinced me--Eastern Front is the money-maker. But which year is the money-maker?

1941
1942
1943
1944
1945
Some years
All years

Which year does the job? Convince your peers.

< Message edited by bcgames -- 5/8/2018 5:27:55 AM >

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 8:34:18 AM   
Jorm


Posts: 545
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Melbourne
Status: offline 		france 1940 would be good

a BIG no to normandy or bulge, there are already many games that cover these

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 10:58:38 AM   
Rasputitsa


Posts: 2903
Joined: 6/30/2001
From: Bedfordshire UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bcgames

You have convinced me--Eastern Front is the money-maker. But which year is the money-maker?

1941
1942
1943
1944
1945
Some years
All years

Which year does the job? Convince your peers.

EF not my choice, but staying positive, suggest middle years late 42/43.

Early on the Soviets have a major command and control breakdown and the Axis has a very large air superiority. Conversely, 1944/45 the Axis becomes a punch-bag.

1943, things have equalised, with both sides having useful air components, nice equipment on line, the Axis have Tiger, Panther, etc., with the Soviets packing some useful kit, T34/85, IL2 etc..

Both sides have powerful anti-tank guns available, so the AFVs cannot just run amok, neither side is a pushover and some thought will have to be given to strategy and tactics.

I think the main issue is unit count, for a WEGO game, where you need to anticipate the results of the combat. You don't get to intervene, or change you mind, as the turn plays through, which you can in a turn-based game, so there is a lot to remember.

Scenarios of reasonable size, or sand-box options where the scenario size is adjustable.

< Message edited by Rasputitsa -- 5/8/2018 11:16:05 AM >

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"In politics stupidity is not a handicap" - Napoleon

“A people which is able to say everything becomes able to do everything” - Napoleon

“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress" - Napoleon

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 2:15:12 PM   
Royal Fusilier

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 7/28/2017
Status: offline 		Eastern Front late '42 would be best since the Soviets have found their feet and the Germans are no longer running over them. That is why Velikiye Luki is such a good battle to cover since the size is manageable and the Soviets are on the offense. It was know as the Stalingrad in the north but with a much better German chance to avoid defeat. Second Kharkov would also be great but that would be quite a large battle.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 3:40:03 PM   
Meteor2


Posts: 429
Joined: 7/20/2009
From: Germany
Status: offline 		I would opt for
- Velikiye Luki
- Charkow (2nd and 3rd)
- Smolensk 1941
- Operation "Wintergewitter" (?)

So, mostly for the period 1942 - 1943.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 6:16:26 PM   
FredSanford3

 

Posts: 567
Joined: 6/23/2007
Status: offline 		Wouldn't it be easier and quicker to bring new games out if they are an evolutionary step from the current Desert War, rather than a jump to an entirely new theater? Assuming so, I think the best bet for the developers would be to expand to slightly earlier, and slightly later, and geographically similar theaters.

So in that case, I'd vote for a Torch expansion, and then some eastern Med action that doesn't get a lot of coverage- Lebanon/Syria campaign, Greece, Crete.

Then expand to Eastern Front 42-43 (you'd already have German templates from the current & Torch eras), and Sicilian/Italian Campaign.

Then a "Blitz" game for 39-42 (including Barbarossa)

Then a Western Front 44-45 title

Then a late war Eastern Front title.

Then a Pacific title, and maybe include Korean War (I included Korea since much of the Pac theater land battles were fairly one-sided and had limited scope for maneuver).

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/8/2018 9:41:00 PM   
jack54


Posts: 1402
Joined: 7/18/2007
From: East Tennessee
Status: offline 		I think....Torch is a great idea!

< Message edited by jack54 -- 5/8/2018 9:44:59 PM >

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/9/2018 10:47:05 AM   
Saint Ruth


Posts: 1070
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Status: offline 		Yes, Torch would be good, but I've also an itch to do something different, away form the sun!
It'd be nice to add weather (more than Tunisian mud I mean!), air-supply drops, rail supply etc, different terrain etc...
Cheers,
Brian

< Message edited by Saint Ruth -- 5/9/2018 10:48:02 AM >

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/9/2018 1:55:39 PM   
Royal Fusilier

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 7/28/2017
Status: offline 		To me Torch would be rather boring. Best to leave the desert and go to greener fields.

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RE: Desert War: What's Next? - 5/9/2018 9:55:13 PM   
Deathtreader


Posts: 1039
Joined: 4/22/2003
From: Vancouver, Canada.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Saint Ruth

Yes, Torch would be good, but I've also an itch to do something different, away form the sun!
It'd be nice to add weather (more than Tunisian mud I mean!), air-supply drops, rail supply etc, different terrain etc...
Cheers,
Brian


Hi all,

While I'm a fan of the EF 42 to 43 scenarios, for something COMPLETELY different from the sand and sun you might consider Finland 39 with snow and ice, completely different topography and weather/climate, bumbling giant vs fewer more nimble opponents. Allows for several new unit types, many possible small/medium scenarios, ground conditions(snow, ice, mud etc.), and because of a shorter timeframe would be suitable for the implementation of a full campaign game.

Just sayin...........

Rob.

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