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quote:
ORIGINAL: MikeJ19 Larry,
Hey there Mike man. How's your game going? Thanks for posting....I like thread traffic.
quote:
ORIGINAL: MikeJ19 You attention to detail is so very good. I like your idea of moving the units mopping up into the void.
I'm pretty sure that attention to detail is an advantage for this game. I used to play WITP-AE and that's a game designed for the OCD among us. There's so much to keep track of that there's a third party program that will read the save file and generate reports and tables of data to show trends and current levels etc. Each individual pilot is represented for both sides with skill levels for each pilot for about a dozen skills ( straffing, ground attack, escort, etc. ). TOAW IV isn't nearly as complex but it does have almost everything you need to play this game. There's things missing from the game engine ( night missions for aircraft, etc. ) but for the most part war is accurately represented. It's a wonderful game and reminds me a lot of chess but it's a LOT more complicated.
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Elements of the 19th Panzer are fighting in Kilmovichi alongside the 225th Infantry Division. The Soviets have remnants in the building to the right and a Molitov cocktail was just thrown from an open window and has engulfed one of the Axis vehicles. This has just happened and the troops haven't yet started to put it out.
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I've got plans to drive through a Soviet weak spot to do a left hook and try to get on the inside of the Soviet lines and roll toward the north trapping as many Soviet units as possible and destroying them. I expect Elmer to respond in some way to thwart my plans but so far he hasn't.
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Here's a spot down south where there's a lot of action going on. I'm driving the Hungarians to the front lines where they can lend a hand. They are good for recon and garrison duties but they are almost worthless on the front lines so this is a rare occurance. I've got plans to drive them toward Kharkov in a few turns.
Also, the forces are more or less equally distributed along the front instead of concentrated on a Schwerpunkt (at least it seems that way from the distribution of the blue counters on the overview maps). Can someone who has played both games enlighten me on what differences in game mechanics are responsible for that?
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Joined: 1/16/2011 From: caen - France Status: offline
first of all, you can't use a corp to make a breakthrough and than advance full speed with others. Here spending time is the same for everybody. second Russia will not be impeded as in WitE, they pay ground as Germany; perhaps a bit more but not much. not advancing on a broad front will leave Elmer sending ants to cut behind that's from first coming to mind
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quote:
ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist In TOAW AARs, as compared to WitE-AARs, you usually see a broad front advance without deep penetrations. Here is an example from WitE of what I mean, look at the penetratration at Smolensk: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4067937&mpage=2&key=?
Also, the forces are more or less equally distributed along the front instead of concentrated on a Schwerpunkt (at least it seems that way from the distribution of the blue counters on the overview maps). Can someone who has played both games enlighten me on what differences in game mechanics are responsible for that?
I'm not sure I know for sure what the differences are, and I've played both games. I never thought of it before I guess.
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Thank you for your comments. If I read you correctly, the main factors are: -time during turn/attacks is progressing for all units at the same time, so deep breakthroughs are harder to achieve -shorter turn lengths, so the Soviets can react better -Soviets do not pay such a high cost for entering enemy hexagons/moving through ZOCs as in WitE, therefore they can infiltrate lines much easier, which dictates a broad front advance and flank security.
Do TOAW eastern front scenarios have an element that works against SOviet runaway defences evacuating everything in the west and build a wall of steel somewhere between the Daugava-Dniepr line and the Leningrad/Moscow/Voronesh/Rostov line? Because if the russian player doesn't let the huge pockets happen, the Red Army will be much stronger than historical come fall 1941.
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quote:
Do TOAW eastern front scenarios have an element that works against SOviet runaway defences evacuating everything in the west and build a wall of steel somewhere between the Daugava-Dniepr line and the Leningrad/Moscow/Voronesh/Rostov line?
Some scenarios have the Soviet units in garrison mode so that they can't move or shoot until they have been attacked.
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This is a close up of the section of the front lines where there's a bulge forming. Elmer hasn't been keeping up with his maintance of the front lines and he left a hole and I'm fighting to expand it and to see if I can't take advantage of it in some way. I need more units to take advantage of it propely but this is a shoestring operation and there's some things I cannot do but there's enough things I CAN do that progress is still being made.
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Here's what it looks like around Odessa right now. I'm going to say that the siege of Odessa starts soon. The RR engineers in this area didn't make any progress this turn. D'oh.
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Here's the front lines in the north right now. I'm fighting to mop up the area to the west of Narva by cutting off the supply of all those units. That will make the take-down easier and I can get the advance back on the road. I feel like I'm way behind schedule.
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Here's what it looks like down south. I'm clearing out the territories between the rivers and I'm moving to the SE and I keep running into isolated instances of Soviet units in small groups or just a single one at a time and I'm thinking it's going to be a few turns yet before I'll be done.
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Here's what's going on around Leningrad currently. The Finns are slowly pushing the Soviets south and the Germans are slowly clearing the area west of Narva and there's several units pushing out into Soviet territory to get a gauge of the response, staying there closer to Leningrad if possible and drive another unit closer, rinse and repeat.
There's a lot of Soviet airpower represented here at Leningrad and I've flown in four fighter squadrons of Me-109's to contest the air. The losses meter shows how hot the air war is just now. I've got all the fighters on three-dots. I'm doing that because of the difference in the proficiency of the two forces, Axis having the advantage, and the difference in air shock levels. Axis air shock is 120 and the Soviet air shock is 75.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cpt flam you must take care of Finnish fighters, their production has been review. some start later and it would be bad to lost them
Hey there Captain Flam dude. Thanks for posting your heads up info. Per your suggestion for a review, I did a cut and paste of the appropriate Finn squadrons and looked up their planes and discovered that you're right. Some of those bad boys don't arrive until T50 or so. Some of these guys need to be parked and used sparingly. The good news is that I don't plan on using the Finn airforce anywhere except Finland so once the city of Leningrad is taken I suspect the Finns will be largely finished with the war. In real life they didn't participate in the fighting except in around the Leningrad area generally and Finland in particular. Once the city has fallen the Finn airforce can retire.
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Here's the front lines in T16 and I have moved only the OKH unit to just south of the front lines in the north. I have been scanning this picture for the last several minutes and I see places where I need to shift the troops to fill a void or spread out the troops to make the lines more even instead of clumpy and I need to remember to check the supply levels before I initiate any attacks or move units around. I need to stay out of those hexes that are less than 5. That's the overextended threashold. I'm guessing I'm close to those hexes right now, at least in certain spots down south. There's a gap in the supply spread from Kiev to the other RR teams near Odessa where there's not a lot of supply and I wanted to circle the Soviets by hugging the rivers and then clearing the center but it's not working out that way. I've got a bad case of victory disease and I need to stop chasing Soviet units in the center in the bad supply hexes. I need to get them in a large pocket first.
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This is Kiev currently and I detect what could be an empty hex near Kiev and I'd like to explore the possibilities of having that hex. I'm going to see if I can't get a unit in there.
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This is what Leningrad looks like now. The Finns are making progress and the air war is heating up and we're still in the Fall of the year too. The Soviet BB's have left port and that means I need to get the Stuka's up here to take a shot at them because excursions are rare.
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This is what Kiev looks like now. The size of the Soviet defender groups is getting smaller and I'm hoping I can force the crossing because I need to get on the east side of the river soonest.
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Here's the northern front lines currently and the Soviets have parked the ships that remain from my attacks as they moved to that position. I sank the two BB's but there's still some heavy Cruisers etc. that I can shoot so I need to attack the group some more. I've gotten one of my divisions too far forward and cut off and now I need to rescue them. The mop up to the west is almost done and those troops can make their way to Narva and points east. The Finns are slowly approaching their stop lines and the story is different south of Leningrad. I had predicted about 10 turns ago that I would have been attacking the city by now and it didn't happen so I feel like I'm behind schedule. On the other hand the stopping of the advance has allowed the rails to be repaired a lot closer and the supply levels are fairly good and climbing.
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I finally captured Smolensk and it's supply point. I switched to my game with Brian to do those moves and I come back here afterward and I find I've lost my battlefield awareness. That's the trouble playing more than one game at a time. I need to start keeping a more detailed AAR so I can refresh myself about what's going on.
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Here's Kiev currently and you can see how much the perimeter around the Soviet defenders has gotten smaller and more attacks are scheduled. I'm hoping to be able to force a crossing somewhere to get on the east side of the river. I'd like to be able to surround Kiev before I take it down so I can kill as many of the Soviet defenders as possible but the units on the east side of the river are still further north yet.
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While I'm doing my moves I'm listening to You Tube videos and I found one about the band AC/DC and I've found it helps keep me awake after I've been at it for a while. Any AC/DC fans out there?
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RE: More adventures in Russia ( D21.v.4.6 ) - 
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