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9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 5:34:57 PM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
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Signup for a game of War in the East with a team for each side.

How about playing a different kind of game of WitE? Instead of taking the whole monster of a a game on why not be a ground or air commander or even an overall coordinator for a team playing a side of the game. It is less commitment than a game all on your own, perhaps a turn a week. But you are more likely to see the game to a long end if you want to stay for that and have fun with others on the same side. This is the social version of the solo game. If you are a serious wargamer but want to have fun, read on ....

There are already three team games going on, and there have been others in the past. This team game is in response to more experienced players in the first of the current three team games wanting to have a go at being on the other side. So there will be some old well known names from team games expressing an interest, but otherwise there are lots of vacancies that need to be filled to start this one. Players with all levels of experience are welcome. If you are interested please do post here or feel free to PM me. Also feel free to ask any questions if you are unsure.

It is not meant to be a coaching game, although if players are happy to do that that is fine. However it is an opportunity to see how others play from the same side and play collaboratively a side of War in the East. Some things that are easy for a single player game to do are harder for a group, and that is part of the challenge.

As a wargame it should be approached by all in the spirit of fun. If you take losing personally, this game is not for you.

Unless joiners request alterations the game will be -

Set Up

PBEM

Campaign 1941-45

Latest public beta version and update at least when steam does

Game options
-fog of war
-random weather
-+1 Soviet bonus
-mild blizzard
-better cv maths
-difficulty normal and levels on 100

House rules
-no suicide mission para drops or naval invasions (e.g. sacrificed to displace airbases or rail repair), such missions should be realistic with a plan to keep them in supply and with relief forces to join them.
-additional house rules may be agreed by those joining the game at the start or during the game (see future changes below)

Team and Roles

Each team should include
- 3 or more Combat commanders: They must be different people and must not be the Chief of Staff although they can have other roles. They may have specific titles such as geographic areas (e.g. North/Centre/South) or functional (e.g. air).
- 1 Chief of Staff: The Chief of Staff can be only one person and cannot be one of the Combat commanders although they can have other roles. They have the final decision on the allocations to each of the Combat commanders (e.g. units, points, rail cap, manpower, leaders etc.) and their responsibilities (e.g. titles, boundary maps, objectives). This can include protocols on how different players can use the same units during the same turn (e.g. air groups, SUs) etc.
- 1 Team Manager: They can have another role in the team. They makes sure that the save file is with somebody to take their go, that there is no ambiguity whose go it is, and it is not left idle during their sides turn. When a player cannot take their go and there is no way to swap the sequence round for someone else to take their go, the team manager should arrange for someone to cover that players go for that turn. Their aim is for that team's turn to be finished as quickly as possible. They should also actively recruit replacements when a vacancy occurs.
- the team optionally can have other team members.

Restrictions
- Only Combat commanders or the Chief of Staff can take a go with the file and move units or conduct air missions.
- The Chief of Staff may not move on map units, except zero CV units or security, within 10 hexes of enemy controlled hexes towards them. [Edit: The CoS can build forts anywhere]
- The Chief of Staff may not conduct deliberate or hasty attacks with ground units, but may displace or rout units with no CV such as partisans.
- The Chief of Staff must also decide allocations to ensure all their Combat commanders have the substantial game they expect.
- Ideally anything relevant to only one Combat commander should be left to that commander.
- To start the game each team must have two Combat commanders and one Chief of Staff.
- Once the game has started any joiners must first be announced to existing players with a chance to voice any objections before they join
- Vacancies remain if a team does not have three Combat commanders and a Chief of Staff
- Teams that opt for more Combat commanders should take care to not unduly increase the length of the game as a result.
- Everybody in both teams should be told who is every member of both teams. Ideally each team should give an outline of which areas each Combat commander covers to all players.
- When teams have no vacancies and extra roles are not possible for those expressing an interest they will be added to the reserves list and invited to join when the next vacancy occurs.
- A player vacates their place in the game when they notify others, or if they have been incomunicado since their last turn and are not availiable to take their turn when it comes again.
- Any person who has played on one side cannot later play on the other side
- Any person with the game password or confidential game information should keep this confidential to only the players on the side they are or were in.

Other team games have also agreed to invite neutral observers to the game who have had the password of both sides. This can be done here too, but will need the agreement of each team.

Experience from other team games is the starting line up of players is unlikely to be the line up at the end. Replacements does mean that the team game can continue, unlike solo games, if someone drops out. However it should also mean players who disappear will not hold up the progress of the game.

Sequence of Play

Play consists of each commander taking their go and uploading their save files at the end of their go for the next commander in this sequence
1. Chief of Staff receives end of turn file from opposing team and may take a go
2. Combat commanders take their go in an agreed sequence, if necessary altered by the team manager to make sure there are no idle periods
3. After Combat commanders on a team have finished the Chief of Staff may take a further go at the end
4. The end turn button is pressed for the end of turn save and the result is uploaded for the other side to take their turn

Game Saves

All players should be members of and upload their end of go saves to a single Dropbox for both teams. Players of the other team will be able to see the progress but not open the files without the password of the other side. They may be only be deleted when all players have been given sufficient notice to make copies if they wish.

File saves should use a common file name schema (e.g. "9PM 010-Axis.02 South Finished" where 9PM is the abbreviated name of the game, 10-Axis would be the turn number-side, .02 the go for that side during the turn, and the "South Finished" an optional description of their go).

When the game is over teams should exchange passwords.

Forking

The game may be forked into more than one game from any turn if at least one player with each teams password for each fork wishes to do so. Players should be aware that continuing with more than one game will be harder and may mean both end by not being able to recruit replacements say. This may be necessary when players in the game wish to continue with the game but feel unable to continue with others who wish to remain in the game. However players should also be aware they cannot hold a game hostage against the wishes of others. Either they must agree a resolution or the game will be forked. Unreasonable behaviour may result in being left as the sole player in a fork with the other being the de facto ongoing game.

Reloading

Players should not intentionally reload to get a better die roll or to change their actions in hindsight of new information revealed by the game. Players will know that players on the same side can test results, and players on the other side will be able to as well at the end of the game, and so this will become apparent then.

Communications
All players must have a form of regular communication with the team manager, and the team managers with each other
[Edit- this was changed from "All Combat commanders and Chiefs of Staffs should join a common Discord server and can communicate through it. " see post 14 below]

Each player may make AARs individually or with others. AARs on forums cannot exclude others from viewing them.

There is zero tolerance for personal abuse to anyone else in the game. Nothing in this game will justify abuse in any communications private or public.

Future changes

Once the game has started rules can be amended or added to when there is no objection by any of the current players of the game. Rule changes must be posted in a place where all Combat commanders and Chiefs of Staffs can see them. Joiners must be notified of where the updated rules are.

Time: Commitment and Pace

Experience from other team games is that when teams are doing OK each side takes a week to do a turn. The fastest has been less than a day, the longest many weeks. Turns get quicker when there are no team changes, and are likely to be quicker during less intense mud turns say. However even with quick players the multiple handovers do make the game slower. Players will have to accept this, but should endeavour to not unnecessarily lengthen the game and take responsibility not to leave it idle while others wait.

Realistically this means at the start you are only likely to have the save file to take your go for an evening or two every two weeks. You can spend as much or as little time as you like outside of this to think about and plan your go, write AARs, strategise with team members, trashtalk the other side or engage in any other type of role play. But if your only interest is "pushing the units" and you are frustrated by this pace you should not consider this as your main or only game. On the other hand if you are not able to commit to a full on solo game against someone else this could be ideal.

Also this pace, even if it accelerates, means the end of the game will be a long way off. This means it is more suited to someone interested in the tactical play turn by turn, the team colloboration, or even the results by the end of each campaigning season. It may not suit someone whose main interest is in seeing a win or lose screen at the end of 200+ turns. On the other hand it does mean you are not individually obliged to stay with the game until the end. You can just play to the end of a campaigning season or even just a couple of turns to cover between one player leaving and another joining. All that is asked is that you are upfront about your commitment to your team mates and give as much notice of leaving as possible to allow a replacement to be found.

How to join or express interest

Post your intention to join here - you can express a preference for a side or role. If you suggest a role other than North/Centre/South/Air as Combat commander you may want to describe how it would work and why it would be good - but may have to accept the team may not be able to accommodate it. Bear in mind the Combat commander roles are for all levels of experience. If you are unsure or still considering it do feel free to post so here or PM me. Feel free also to ask any questions.

The game has been named 9PM in memory of one of its predecessors, and as a reminder that after the watershed this a game for adults only

< Message edited by Telemecus -- 11/1/2018 6:01:08 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 5:58:49 PM   
Crackaces


Posts: 3858
Joined: 7/9/2011
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ROLE: Soviet Ground Commander -- Center, South, North preference in that order
I can commit to 2 turns a week.
I have 2 games as the German Commander of the North with one game conducting a blizzard offense as the AGC commander (No +1 attack; severe winter)
I have some experince understanding how firepower works for the German side. It will be interesting to learn how to optimize Soviet battle resolution

My goal: The focus is right now on casualties .. I have never played the Soviets and want to test the theory "it's all about Movement points .. not bodies".



_____________________________

"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so"

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Post #: 2
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 6:07:41 PM   
timmyab

 

Posts: 2044
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From: Bristol, UK
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Sign me up please Tele. I would prefer a soviet ground commander job. I have no preference for which one.

(in reply to Telemecus)
Post #: 3
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 6:15:05 PM   
Telemecus


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Joined: 3/20/2016
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I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role. Even though I posted the original opponents wanted thread it should not be taken that any place is reserved for me. If a strong Soviet candidate applies for any role that the team would prefer I would be delighted if they take the role instead.

Possible Soviet team roles I could do
-Soviet CoS - although the team would have to bear in mind I am not an experienced Soviet player
-Soviet air commander - ditto
-Soviet team manager - this is what others see as the boring chore to do as well as the main role and usually it just falls to the Chief of Staff. But I would like to see it distinguished so that people for one job are not put off by having to do the other. So I would enthusiastically take it on as a sole role to take it off others.
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!

(in reply to timmyab)
Post #: 4
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 7:13:15 PM   
mssm45


Posts: 53
Joined: 11/4/2016
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AKA Belgavox in the C4 game, I would be happy to join the Soviet team as a ground commander.

So that would be БЕЛЬГАВОКС then :)

< Message edited by mssm45 -- 10/24/2018 7:17:34 PM >

(in reply to Telemecus)
Post #: 5
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 8:57:24 PM   
Darojax


Posts: 536
Joined: 4/29/2011
Status: offline
Hey! I'd love to be part of the game, if possible as German Chief of Staff, but if not possible I can do any other role.

Have many years of experience with WitE and WitW, and currently playing as Soviet Ground Commander Center in another MP game.

Cheers!


P.S.

I will endeavor to alter my forum avatar and signature asap. : p

P.P.S.

Done!

< Message edited by Darojax -- 10/24/2018 9:35:23 PM >


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Post #: 6
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 9:06:44 PM   
MarauderPL

 

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Hi, I could do Soviet High Command or a ground commander. If C-in-C then I would need a strong Chief of Staff as I'm not that good in this stuff ;)

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Post #: 7
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/24/2018 9:36:23 PM   
XTRG


Posts: 41
Joined: 7/30/2016
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I'd be happy to join the Soviets. i'd leave the role to be decided by others.

(in reply to MarauderPL)
Post #: 8
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/25/2018 1:43:25 AM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role. Even though I posted the original opponents wanted thread it should not be taken that any place is reserved for me. If a strong Soviet candidate applies for any role that the team would prefer I would be delighted if they take the role instead.

Possible Soviet team roles I could do
-Soviet CoS - although the team would have to bear in mind I am not an experienced Soviet player
-Soviet air commander - ditto
-Soviet team manager - this is what others see as the boring chore to do as well as the main role and usually it just falls to the Chief of Staff. But I would like to see it distinguished so that people for one job are not put off by having to do the other. So I would enthusiastically take it on as a sole role to take it off others.
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!



What!!!! This I have to see ;-)

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Post #: 9
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/25/2018 4:04:31 AM   
SparkleyTits

 

Posts: 898
Joined: 10/7/2016
From: England
Status: offline
I'd be happy to take any Axis ground commander role

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 10
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/25/2018 8:28:33 AM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role. Even though I posted the original opponents wanted thread it should not be taken that any place is reserved for me. If a strong Soviet candidate applies for any role that the team would prefer I would be delighted if they take the role instead.

Possible Soviet team roles I could do
-Soviet CoS - although the team would have to bear in mind I am not an experienced Soviet player
-Soviet air commander - ditto
-Soviet team manager - this is what others see as the boring chore to do as well as the main role and usually it just falls to the Chief of Staff. But I would like to see it distinguished so that people for one job are not put off by having to do the other. So I would enthusiastically take it on as a sole role to take it off others.
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!



What!!!! This I have to see ;-)


You know I have been always happy to show you my spreadsheets - I thought you were the one who was shy?

< Message edited by Telemecus -- 10/25/2018 9:41:58 AM >

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 11
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 1:07:10 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role. Even though I posted the original opponents wanted thread it should not be taken that any place is reserved for me. If a strong Soviet candidate applies for any role that the team would prefer I would be delighted if they take the role instead.

Possible Soviet team roles I could do
-Soviet CoS - although the team would have to bear in mind I am not an experienced Soviet player
-Soviet air commander - ditto
-Soviet team manager - this is what others see as the boring chore to do as well as the main role and usually it just falls to the Chief of Staff. But I would like to see it distinguished so that people for one job are not put off by having to do the other. So I would enthusiastically take it on as a sole role to take it off others.
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!



What!!!! This I have to see ;-)


You know I have been always happy to show you my spreadsheets - I thought you were the one who was shy?


You should know I am referencing you playing the Soviet side. I thought you were a die hard German without deviation.

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Post #: 12
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 1:28:55 PM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role.
...
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!



What!!!! This I have to see ;-)


You know I have been always happy to show you my spreadsheets - I thought you were the one who was shy?


You should know I am referencing you playing the Soviet side. I thought you were a die hard German without deviation.


Not particularly. I started playing the game a lot with friends in a wargaming club - and most of the people I played often played Soviets. So playing Axis was the best option to get games. And then of course when you play it a lot you get to know it well and have new ideas on how to do it to explore.

I have never played Soviets against someone I have not seen in real life before. And as I think of necessity it has to be a long game to be worthwhile for a Soviet player (in a 1941+ scenario) I am a bit apprehensive of the idea of starting a game as one with people I cannot see. So people in this forum who do that I think are brave. My theory though that I want to prove is that team games are more likely to be long games than solo games are. So if true there is less need to worry. And also some of my interest here is about how team dynamics work rather than the game per se - so can leave that to ground commanders! Proving that a team game can work is the same job for Axis or Soviet in that sense.

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 13
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 1:33:26 PM   
Telemecus


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Joined: 3/20/2016
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Just had a suggestion to replace the sentence in the rules in post 1 above

"All Combat commanders and Chiefs of Staffs should join a common Discord server and can communicate through it. "

with the words

"All players must have a form of regular communication with the team manager, and the team managers with each other"

if anyone expressing an interest has an objection let me know - otherwise the rules will be changed

(in reply to Telemecus)
Post #: 14
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 2:36:37 PM   
DETURK

 

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I would like to request any Axis ground commander role.

(in reply to Telemecus)
Post #: 15
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 6:20:16 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus


quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

I am happy to do any Soviet role that is not a ground role.
...
-Soviet team analyst - I do good spreadsheets!



What!!!! This I have to see ;-)


You know I have been always happy to show you my spreadsheets - I thought you were the one who was shy?


You should know I am referencing you playing the Soviet side. I thought you were a die hard German without deviation.


Not particularly. I started playing the game a lot with friends in a wargaming club - and most of the people I played often played Soviets. So playing Axis was the best option to get games. And then of course when you play it a lot you get to know it well and have new ideas on how to do it to explore.

I have never played Soviets against someone I have not seen in real life before. And as I think of necessity it has to be a long game to be worthwhile for a Soviet player (in a 1941+ scenario) I am a bit apprehensive of the idea of starting a game as one with people I cannot see. So people in this forum who do that I think are brave. My theory though that I want to prove is that team games are more likely to be long games than solo games are. So if true there is less need to worry. And also some of my interest here is about how team dynamics work rather than the game per se - so can leave that to ground commanders! Proving that a team game can work is the same job for Axis or Soviet in that sense.


I feel that a team game has a better chance of going the distance depending on the allocation of resources and player skill. So in the long run a team game has a much greater chance.

_____________________________


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Post #: 16
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/26/2018 6:41:16 PM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
I feel that a team game has a better chance of going the distance depending on the allocation of resources and player skill. So in the long run a team game has a much greater chance.


I posited in the 8MP AAR that with players leaving and being recruited over time, the average of many players skill was more likely to be equal in a team game than two players in a solo game...


< Message edited by Telemecus -- 10/26/2018 6:52:38 PM >

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 17
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 2:32:33 PM   
Telemecus


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Joined: 3/20/2016
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Looks like a deficit of Axis ground commanders. Interesting every other time they were the first to fill up!

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Post #: 18
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 3:12:33 PM   
Crackaces


Posts: 3858
Joined: 7/9/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
I feel that a team game has a better chance of going the distance depending on the allocation of resources and player skill. So in the long run a team game has a much greater chance.


I posited in the 8MP AAR that with players leaving and being recruited over time, the average of many players skill was more likely to be equal in a team game than two players in a solo game...



I have found that if you have at least 1 expert (I was very blessed in 8MP to have 2) then the rest of the players produce a synergy better than the whole. My last attacks in 8MP turn 54 are an example. The discussion between team members produced in my opinion an optimal result. The definition of “expert” is critical. A mastery of WITE is one factor but goes way beyond conscious competence of game mechanics. A mastery of leadership is needed to make the parts more than the whole. The players on both sides need social skills more than gaming skills to make a team game work.

In fact, the skill of human interaction is by far valued by me than any game tibits offered by those do not value social skills. My list of posters I ignore has grown greatly as of late. Mastery of the game and no social skills has ended 1 team game and severely disrupted another.. Myself, I limit my interactions and focus on learning this very complex game.

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Post #: 19
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 5:58:02 PM   
Searry

 

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Sign me up for axis ground.

(in reply to Crackaces)
Post #: 20
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 6:52:44 PM   
MarauderPL

 

Posts: 134
Joined: 4/8/2016
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We are looking for the air marshall for the Soviet side - anybody interested? :) Want to try some new ideas with the Soviet airforce but have no time to play the whole campaign? Thats the opportunity for you! No skill level requirements!

(in reply to Searry)
Post #: 21
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 8:04:34 PM   
leverkuhn


Posts: 40
Joined: 12/11/2017
Status: offline
Hi, I'd be very interested in an analyst/observer/spreadsheet maker role for BOTH sides (or any of them). You already know me from other MP games such as 8MP or 2by3+. I don't cause trouble and can provide info bits for the AAR as well as weird german names for summer operations

(in reply to MarauderPL)
Post #: 22
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/27/2018 10:25:06 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: leverkuhn
I don't cause trouble


OMG, I had to laugh at this.

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Post #: 23
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 3:27:51 PM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
quote:

ORIGINAL: leverkuhn
I don't cause trouble

OMG, I had to laugh at this.

It is now a stipulated requirement of all in the game!

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 24
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 4:41:36 PM   
Telemecus


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A suggested alterations to the rules is to add in the clarification that the "CoS can build forts anywhere" - if there are no objections this will be edited into the rules in post 1.

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Post #: 25
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 5:19:41 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
quote:

ORIGINAL: leverkuhn
I don't cause trouble

OMG, I had to laugh at this.

It is now a stipulated requirement of all in the game!



Ah, so you have to have MEME's to conform or they are not allowed to participate. Interesting.

_____________________________


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Post #: 26
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 5:22:59 PM   
SparkleyTits

 

Posts: 898
Joined: 10/7/2016
From: England
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lol

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 27
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 5:28:18 PM   
Telemecus


Posts: 4689
Joined: 3/20/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
quote:

ORIGINAL: leverkuhn
I don't cause trouble

OMG, I had to laugh at this.

It is now a stipulated requirement of all in the game!



Ah, so you have to have MEME's to conform or they are not allowed to participate. Interesting.

You have completely lost me now? What are you on about?

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 28
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 6:49:56 PM   
Darojax


Posts: 536
Joined: 4/29/2011
Status: offline
o7 Commanders

Axis Chief of Staff here.

We're still looking primarily for another Axis Ground Commander, and secondarily for an Axis Air Marshal!

Looking forward to hearing from interested parties. : )


// Dax

_____________________________


(in reply to Telemecus)
Post #: 29
RE: 9PM Team Game - 10/28/2018 7:08:31 PM   
Otis1903

 

Posts: 5
Joined: 10/28/2018
Status: offline
I would like to apply for Axis Ground Commander.

(in reply to Darojax)
Post #: 30
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