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RE: 8MP T47 - 11/13/2018 6:38:16 PM

Telemecus

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Turn 47 13-May-1942 Economic

In the posting on the air above can be seen the continued bombardment in the North. The T-70 factory at Gorky has its expansion choked on 17 with it damage in the mid 40s. But we have had to let the bombing of the already expanded T-60 factory we started work on previously go unattacked as the arrival if the red air force meant we had to concentrate on our main target the T-70 factory. The vehicle factories at Murom and Yaroslaval are now at or near the 50% shut down level. And similarly for the heavy industry at Rybinsk and Dzerzhinsk. Finally our manpower bombing continues apace.

In the meantime the Rumanian bombing of Novorossiysk sees its heavy industry reach damage levels in the 30s. And a second manpower target is added to the list as bombing starts on Tamanskaya.

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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 11/13/2018 6:41:31 PM >

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RE: 8MP T47 - 11/13/2018 6:42:21 PM

Telemecus

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Turn 47 Allocations
For information only - team allocations for turn 47.

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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 3/9/2019 11:55:59 AM >

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/19/2018 2:45:49 PM

timmyab

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Turn 48 Army group North

The Soviet units West of the Valdai are evacuated from their dangerously exposed position and an attempt by our 10th corps to take part of the Soviet Valdai stronghold fails.

Very little action elsewhere. AGN has limited offensive capability and the enemy remains relatively strong and well dug in North of the Oka. In the great scheme of things this is good news for our side, but does make for slow going in the North.

South of Kalinin 18th army regains ownership of a stretch of the West bank of the Volga. 18th army will retain a small offensive capacity until a continuous river line has been established and fortified after which it will be made static and reduced to a purely defensive force. Parts of 9th army in the Moscow area have already been made static.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/20/2018 5:00:50 PM

Telemecus

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Turn 48 20-May-1942 Crimea

Final clear up

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/20/2018 5:05:41 PM

Telemecus

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Turn 48 20-May-1942 Army Group B

Mud keeps Army Group A out of action this turn. The Don bridgehead is expanded in the good weather and Voronezh has been surrounded. In their turn the Soviets already started pulling back from their salient to the north of Voronezh - and discussions are had with centre about closing the noose around the remainder.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/22/2018 12:26:08 PM

Telemecus

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During a discussion on the "Ballet Russe" of aircraft being flown from loaded trains I was reminded there is a video of a plane landing on a moving train - so here it is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHeGLlQBeJg

< Message edited by Telemecus -- 11/22/2018 12:32:00 PM >

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/22/2018 12:55:34 PM

Zorch

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Interesting. Maybe the next James Bond film could use this.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/22/2018 2:15:51 PM

Telemecus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Interesting. Maybe the next James Bond film could use this.

I think they have done it - at least with a helicopter?

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/27/2018 4:46:40 PM

Telemecus

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Attached a pdf made this turn by one of the team members a guide to which sorts of artillery should be prioritised for which battles.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/27/2018 5:13:42 PM

Beria

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I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/27/2018 6:41:13 PM

Crackaces

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In general I use the rockets where the disruption will make a difference (no need to waste them when the odds are already in you favor) and I feel pretty good I am not going to face thousands of Soviet guns (they will shoot first and quite possibly ruin my whole day)

As far as caliber is concerned .. look at the blast effect . the higher blast the more damage each shell does .. but at a higher supply cost and risk of counterbattery shots ruining the device .
Having a 305mm contribute against infantry in the open is going to be a waste .. 105's are likely to do the job. But against a fortified position you will get a reduction in fort levels before the shooting starts .. that might be worth the counterbattery fire ..

I emphasize counterbattery because I weigh the value of the battle with the odds of losing the stuff I commit. You will see in some cases I committed 20mm quad and 105mm to be destroyed by Soviet counterbattery fire. BUt I also exchanged these devices for cav .. precious cav that as this AAR advances will no longer present a threat ..

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/27/2018 7:13:24 PM

Zorch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

Excuse me, but shouldn't Commissar Beria be on the Soviet side?
Imagine what happens when Hitler finds out!

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Post #: 732

RE: 8MP T48 - 11/28/2018 11:09:11 AM

Telemecus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

Excuse me, but shouldn't Commissar Beria be on the Soviet side?
Imagine what happens when Hitler finds out!

Imagine what he will do when he finds out EwaldvonKleist is on the other side!

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Post #: 733

RE: 8MP T48 - 11/28/2018 11:40:32 AM

Zorch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

Excuse me, but shouldn't Commissar Beria be on the Soviet side?
Imagine what happens when Hitler finds out!

Imagine what he will do when he finds out EwaldvonKleist is on the other side!

Queue Downfall parody of your choice...

(in reply to Telemecus)

Post #: 734

RE: 8MP T48 - 11/28/2018 11:47:49 AM

Telemecus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

Excuse me, but shouldn't Commissar Beria be on the Soviet side?
Imagine what happens when Hitler finds out!

Imagine what he will do when he finds out EwaldvonKleist is on the other side!

Queue Downfall parody of your choice...

Given an infinite number of rooms each with an infinite number of chimpanzees each with an infinite number of typewriters - all these downfall parodies would finally be exhausted

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RE: 8MP T48 - 11/28/2018 12:32:50 PM

Zorch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

I have been trying to understand that pdf but I am having difficulty. When exactly should I used werfers and not artillery. When should I used different calibers?

Excuse me, but shouldn't Commissar Beria be on the Soviet side?
Imagine what happens when Hitler finds out!

Imagine what he will do when he finds out EwaldvonKleist is on the other side!

Queue Downfall parody of your choice...

Given an infinite number of rooms each with an infinite number of chimpanzees each with an infinite number of typewriters - all these downfall parodies would finally be exhausted

Unlike the number of possible WitE games...

(in reply to Telemecus)

Post #: 736

RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 1:50:43 PM

Crackaces

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Turn 48 20-May-1942 Centre

During the Soviet turn, their 1st Shock army from the North and 4th shock army from the South manage to break in to their isolated units. They do not take the bait. Instead they leave low value units as speed bumps to keep 3 panzer divisions isolated rather than front up and isolate panzer divisions with strength. There is a general withdrawal of all units from the west of the river Voronezh. A most interesting finding in the combat reports was what can only be described as interdiction hell - we see a very large number of interdiction battle results all unintercepted by fighters, and all naming the affected unit. Soviet air losses continue to be heavy in their ground bombing and a large proportion of recon missions are being shot down.

The reforming of the Soviet lines demonstrates how the threat of isolation can force the enemy to give up territory without the loss of blood. Panzer Divisions fronted Lipetsk as well as north of Lipetsk that presented a real threat to encircle Soviet forces forward of Lipetsk toward the North. The Soviets responded by retreating to safe river lines. The Germans gain much space for their summer offensive with little loss of blood or treasure. More so, the Germans have gained a week of time on the offense in the clear.

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< Message edited by Crackaces -- 12/1/2018 1:52:29 PM >

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 1:54:59 PM

Crackaces

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The turns do not exist anymore and thus it takes a lot of time to construct meaning from the archives. However, the battle result below shows how the German's at this point have the Soviet's blind. Recon that flies .. dies

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 1:58:40 PM

Crackaces

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There is no bottom limit of how much of an attacking force is needed to create a battle. The rules have changed in that it costs more MP's to attack from the same hex. This attack does show that the engine does have an algorithm for breaking off "soaking" attacks. As it seems only a couple of firepower exchanges occurred before the firepower rounds stopped.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:03:58 PM

Crackaces

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Spam bombing:

One tactic worth mentioning is "spam" bombing. It can be actually worth ground bombing units. It is not at first apparent because the battle results are often minuscule. It is not the kills and damage in my opinion that makes this tactic worth doing -- it is the disruption turned into fatigue and use of ammo that makes this a worthy tactic.

One thing although .. I load up my units with directly attached flak (note the SP flak devices) and the HQ's with LW mixed flak/hvy flak.(37's nd 88's) That brings 88mm into play ..there is a price to be paid ..

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< Message edited by Crackaces -- 12/1/2018 2:05:25 PM >

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"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so"

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:09:53 PM

Crackaces

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Interdiction:

One tidbit you can see below. Not only did Goering's finest penetrate into the operational battlespace and interdict a tank corps but the information gained was critical. The Soviet's do not have a plethora of Tank Corps and our flyboys were able to identify the 6th Tank Corps.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:17:39 PM

Crackaces

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Eventually during their turn they moved the 18th panzer division backwards .. a couple of details to observe .. when the Soviets want to concentrate they can bring a thousand plus "tubes" to the fray. On first glance the tank losses might seem lopsided but in this battle the 88's I believe made a real difference although they were sacrificed to the Soviet artillery. The manpower losses were about equal.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:21:17 PM

Crackaces

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In our go Centre continues its drive East reaching the Para river and the source of the Voronezh river. The advance has now widened to 70 miles. Initial resistance comes from brigades or weak divisions but after piercing several lines, we come up against their tank corps, cavalry corps and guards. It appears centre is now facing the entire top units of the red army. However, fortification levels are distinctly lower.

One product of the gambit on Turn 46, the Soviets did pivot southwards of the rail line with some strong units. For the cost of 3 nerfed panzer divisions now low on fuel and supplies, the panzers in reserve accomplished their goals. The 4th Panzer army took advantage of and moved forward to the Para river from the rail line and north. The key was a request by Reichsmarshal Telemecus who suggested they needed a staging base within fighter range of Gorky. It was clear this was doable with a focused effort of 4th Panzer Army and elements of the 2nd Panzer Army. The picture below shows the final position. The Luftwaffe attack many targets escorted by fighters, and deal the Soviets death from the sky.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:28:33 PM

Crackaces

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One piece of intelligence gained from the "big push" was the notable weakness of the 5th line of the bulge. Fort levels hardly over 0.5 and multiple units from different commands stacked together in an attempt to show strength. It has now become apparent that the first real clear turns if we push hard the German's can make huge breakouts vs a very weak backline. It is also clear that we can focus the forces to penetrate 5 lines deep.

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 2:32:51 PM

Crackaces

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The powers have asked AGC to clear out the Oka Basin. The map below shows the axis of attack. This will shorten the line and clear a rail of pesky Soviet ZOC's. The weather will not cooperate for a few turns ..

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 5:59:50 PM

Colbert

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Would leave you with a secure northern flank with rivers if your plan is to go static up there?

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 7:05:10 PM

Crackaces

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Colbert

Would leave you with a secure northern flank with rivers if your plan is to go static up there?

Certainly that opens that possibility, but at this point AGC is only thinking of concentrating forces to penatrate 5 layers of Soviets. Putting weak units defending the major river enables my morale 80+ to attack! As it is .. things develop a little differently ...

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 8:27:43 PM

Zorch

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

Eventually during their turn they moved the 18th panzer division backwards .. a couple of details to observe .. when the Soviets want to concentrate they can bring a thousand plus "tubes" to the fray. On first glance the tank losses might seem lopsided but in this battle the 88's I believe made a real difference although they were sacrificed to the Soviet artillery. The manpower losses were about equal.

Where did the German heavy artillery/Stukas go after Sevastopol fell? Did you disperse them?

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/1/2018 11:21:41 PM

Crackaces

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

Eventually during their turn they moved the 18th panzer division backwards .. a couple of details to observe .. when the Soviets want to concentrate they can bring a thousand plus "tubes" to the fray. On first glance the tank losses might seem lopsided but in this battle the 88's I believe made a real difference although they were sacrificed to the Soviet artillery. The manpower losses were about equal.

Where did the German heavy artillery/Stukas go after Sevastopol fell? Did you disperse them?

Actually the heavy art moved its way back into OKH. The Stukas are in National Reserve waiting for clear weather.
I will bring out the heavy stuff for a couple of special missions starting turn 53 ;) ..

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RE: 8MP T48 - 12/2/2018 10:52:14 AM

M60A3TTS

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

The turns do not exist anymore and thus it takes a lot of time to construct meaning from the archives. However, the battle result below shows how the German's at this point have the Soviet's blind. Recon that flies .. dies

To provide some context, the VVS in Week 47 had grown to levels not seen since the first weeks of the war. Nearly 6,300 aircraft were available within the Soviet force structure, among these were over 300 recon aircraft.

Week 47 saw 15 soviet recon missions that included 46 recon aircraft of which 22 were shot down.

The assertion that the Soviets were made blind is simply not true. Soviet recon assets are more limited in quantity relative to other aircraft types, so they are used only when and where needed. In this particular case, recon missions were needed to identify location, type, and strength of underlying Luftwaffe assets in the center of the front. That mission was accomplished.