Attacking ships in port.

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

Attacking ships in port.

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Strategic Command Series >> Strategic Command WWII: World at War >> Attacking ships in port.

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Attacking ships in port. - 2/27/2019 6:47:08 PM

Tidavis

Posts: 725
Joined: 7/27/2014
From: Peoria, Illinois
Status: offline

Just what is the process or chance of attacking ships in port? I can;t find the formula for doing so. Every time I try I end up causing zero damage to the enemy ships and every so often the port takes a hit. More often than not my ships take several points worth of damage.

Conversely, I just resigned a game where my opponent virtually eliminate my Italian fleet while every ship was sitting in port.

What am I doing wrong?

After reading the naval war section again, I get why I can't do any damage to ships in port. Still doesn't explain how my Italian fleet was wiped out though.

< Message edited by Tidavis -- 2/27/2019 6:58:36 PM >

_____________________________

Post #: 1

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/27/2019 6:51:41 PM

xwormwood

Posts: 1149
Joined: 8/28/2000
From: Bremen, Germany
Status: offline

First of all, attack with air power, not with ships. Tac air will target the enemy vessel. Same is true for subs.
If you shell the harbor, the harbor fortificatons will fire back. And you will only have a slight chance to damage the ship in port.
From what you describe your opponent was either lucky, or your harbor was down to supply / strength zero. And at this status, the fortificatsion won't fire back any more.

_____________________________

"You will be dead, so long as you refuse to die" (George MacDonald)

(in reply to Tidavis)

Post #: 2

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/27/2019 7:00:54 PM

Tidavis

Posts: 725
Joined: 7/27/2014
From: Peoria, Illinois
Status: offline

This was several ships in several different ports. Zapped like nothing was there. This was on Sicily and mainland Italy in spring of 1940. Ports were in full supply.

_____________________________

(in reply to xwormwood)

Post #: 3

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/27/2019 7:20:17 PM

Christolos

Posts: 953
Joined: 4/24/2014
From: Montreal, Canada
Status: offline

Where they mostly hit with air power from carriers? This can do a fair bit of damage. Subs can also damage ships in port.

Italian ships in 1940 are likely to not have Naval Warfare and/or Naval weaponry upgrades, which may also have contributed.

C

_____________________________

�Excellence is never an accident. It is always the result of high intention, sincere effort, and intelligent execution; it represents the wise choice of many alternatives - choice, not chance, determines your destiny.�

-Aristotle-

(in reply to Tidavis)

Post #: 4

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/27/2019 8:15:53 PM

Tidavis

Posts: 725
Joined: 7/27/2014
From: Peoria, Illinois
Status: offline

I have tried a few times to replicate this feat against the Italians. After a few hits on RN Ships, I give up.

In the game it was subs, air, and surface ships.

I just don't know.

_____________________________

(in reply to Christolos)

Post #: 5

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/28/2019 3:38:12 AM

ElvisJJonesRambo

Posts: 1345
Joined: 2/6/2019
Status: offline

Hey Brother Tidavis, you must be referring to our game. I got no problem suicide plan for the French ships, everyone does. But you are correct, surface to surface in ports ain't happening. Need Air power to pop naval inside them ports. You didn't take much damage. Supply level is big with ships too. Going into the opponent's home high supply +10 bases gonna be rough. You can trash subs in ports, don't think they dive there, you'll need a decent carrier. Don't plan on me sitting still :) Action is in the High Seas early in 1939. Unless you wanna hang around your own ports, which isn't such a bad thing. Allies are hard pressed in 1939 Campaign. Nothing you can do to defend Poland/LC/France & initial parts of China. Gotta get a plan, pick your spots. It's like a Chess game against a Poker player.

_____________________________

Without Him, I could do nothing
Without Him, I'd surely fail
Without Him, I would be drifting
Like a ship without a sail

(in reply to Tidavis)

Post #: 6

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 2/28/2019 7:19:40 AM

eriador08

Posts: 106
Joined: 5/25/2017
Status: offline

If i am losing as france and there seems no threat to take algier, i try to suicide attack with french navy. You can just run into an enemy port (enemy ships must not be spottet! ). If you run into enemy ships near a port and they spot each other they BOTH seem to take damage most of the time. You mostly get hurt more, but that does not matter, when you lose anyway. Combine with carriers and subs and you can get pretty good results.

(in reply to ElvisJJonesRambo)

Post #: 7

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/2/2019 7:36:46 AM

sapper32

Posts: 1197
Joined: 5/7/2007
From: Warminster England
Status: offline

My carrier airgroups inflicted zero losses on Italian ship in port but got realy hammered in return I didn't bother attacking with my third carrier there seemed no point plus cant repair past 8 in the med my surface ships and subs also attacked and no hits in return I lost a BB,CL and a Carrier

? Realy

_____________________________

The battle of Medjerda is almost forgotten,but was fought against highly disciplined German troops and blasted a route straight to Tunis it was a perfect infiltration battle and should be remembered as the best fought British battle of the war.

(in reply to eriador08)

Post #: 8

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/2/2019 7:45:12 AM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

Check the Settings for your Carriers because some of them will result in little or no losses to the enemy.

(in reply to sapper32)

Post #: 9

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/2/2019 1:24:06 PM

Toby42

Posts: 1626
Joined: 8/10/2003
From: Central Florida
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

Check the Settings for your Carriers because some of them will result in little or no losses to the enemy.

Yes having to mess around with the carrier settings is a pain for a game at this scale! Mostly I forget all about them and end up getting hammered for a zero result!

_____________________________

Tony

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 10

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/2/2019 7:08:47 PM

Xsillione

Posts: 212
Joined: 1/18/2019
Status: offline

yep, that one is completely unnecessary, the carriers should be less effective a bit against ground based units, but playing with the setting, and losing badly since you forget to set them into naval, or to return them into fighters is just bad. In midway, the Japanese lost an hour or two for swapping, not a month or two.

(in reply to Toby42)

Post #: 11

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/2/2019 7:35:28 PM

ElvisJJonesRambo

Posts: 1345
Joined: 2/6/2019
Status: offline

There's a dozen factors involved in the subject of Carriers/Ships vs Ports/Ships. Supply, Readiness, Tech, Air-Mode come to immediate thinking. True, the Japs didn't take month to switch munitions. This is a strategic game, some method needs to allow for Cat/Mouse at Sea.

_____________________________

Without Him, I could do nothing
Without Him, I'd surely fail
Without Him, I would be drifting
Like a ship without a sail

(in reply to Xsillione)

Post #: 12

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/3/2019 1:35:26 PM

sapper32

Posts: 1197
Joined: 5/7/2007
From: Warminster England
Status: offline

Carriers were on naval/tactical in good supply and morale i attacked four times with two carrier air groups and lost about 7 hits for zero results my surface ships and subs also inflicted virtualy no losses and took damage my task force was left depleted and a sitting duck for the undamaged Italian navy and airforce, My third carrier group turned tail and ran as i saw no point in that getting zapped aswell.

_____________________________

(in reply to ElvisJJonesRambo)

Post #: 13

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/3/2019 3:31:00 PM

Toby42

Posts: 1626
Joined: 8/10/2003
From: Central Florida
Status: offline

I agree. The end results are not worth the cost! And this carrier mode settings at this scale drives me nuts! I'm always forgetting to change something!

_____________________________

Tony

(in reply to sapper32)

Post #: 14

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/4/2019 12:59:27 PM

Hubert Cater

Posts: 5199
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sapper32

Carriers were on naval/tactical in good supply and morale i attacked four times with two carrier air groups and lost about 7 hits for zero results my surface ships and subs also inflicted virtualy no losses and took damage my task force was left depleted and a sitting duck for the undamaged Italian navy and airforce, My third carrier group turned tail and ran as i saw no point in that getting zapped aswell.

Without seeing the stats including tech level differences, exact supply, readiness and morale, attack mode of the carrier, weather and so on it is hard to say exactly what the potential concern would be here.

Off hand I can suggest that there is essentially nothing special when it comes to Carrier attacks versus any other unit when it comes to combat calculations, i.e. it is always resolved the same way where the attack and defence values are taken into account on top of readiness, morale, supply, strength and tech levels. After that the values go into the same formula that handles all combat regardless of unit type.

The biggest issue it seems is that often players are attempting to perform a naval strike while in Figther Combat Air Patrol mode, which of course will be ineffectual.

But that being said, if you encounter this again, please give us some screen shots, or even better a saved turn, where we can take a look at the relative values and we can then provide much more helpful feedback.

_____________________________

Follow us on Twitter: https://twitter.com/FurySoftware

We're also on Facebook! https://www.facebook.com/pages/Fury-Software/233842800005900

Join our Steam Community:
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/strategiccommand3

(in reply to sapper32)

Post #: 15

RE: Attacking ships in port. - 3/4/2019 1:14:47 PM

Hubert Cater

Posts: 5199
Joined: 7/22/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Xsillione

yep, that one is completely unnecessary, the carriers should be less effective a bit against ground based units, but playing with the setting, and losing badly since you forget to set them into naval, or to return them into fighters is just bad. In midway, the Japanese lost an hour or two for swapping, not a month or two.

The issue here is that Carriers did have a variety of aircraft available to them, i.e. dive bombers, torpedo bombers, fighters etc., and did historically get caught with the wrong type of aircraft on deck with disasterous results for the Japanese as was the case at Midway.

The multiple modes for Carriers were requested quite a while ago, from memory about 10 years ago, and has been a part of the game ever since which allows players to play with the right mix of Carriers for fleet actions in the Pacific where one either needs to balance their task forces with the right balance of CAP and Tactical mode, or risk everything in Tactical mode and so on. Without these modes it plays out much differently, and at one time when we didn't have modes, there is less of that cat and mouse, risk and reward feel in game.

On land, it is not much different as players appropriately manage this with the different air unit types available to them, i.e. balancing a front with Fighters as well as Tactical Bombers and so on.

From a game play point of view, I would argue it is not so much a matter of how long it took Carrier decks to swap out Torpedo Bombers for Fighters, but rather without these modes, you'd lose an entire layer of Carrier combat tension in the Pacific and especially so as the ebb and flow of battles range from attacks to defensive actions as the war progresses.

_____________________________

(in reply to Xsillione)

Post #: 16