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Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario?

 
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Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/16/2018 4:41:10 PM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario?

There are no spoilers listed below. Actually, I wish that there were as that would mean that I defeated the scenario. <lol>

Background: A Soviet sub is tasked with sinking an American boomer coming out of Hawaii which is being escorted by some surface ships and subs. As the Soviet player, you are provided with some information that informs you the general location of where the boomer might be at various times. (To the developer: Nice job of really making the dissemination of this information seem so realistic.)

I have tried several different approaches to this scenario and all have ended in defeat. The sonar ranges for the enemy are equal to (or better than) the Soviet sub, and when the air and surface units are added to the mix for the Americans, it is essentially a lone Soviet sub against the world. I cannot seem to be able to get close to the boomer before being located and destroyed. That, of course, results in defeat.

So, has anyone actually played and defeated this scenario? If so, could you send me a Private message and give me some pointers? This is a tough one.

Thanks in advance.

Doug
Post #: 1
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/16/2018 8:57:11 PM   
giantsquid

 

Posts: 270
Joined: 9/8/2014
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline 		I tried but failed at least two times. I will give another try and report in.
My plan was to act as a sit and wait predator on likely approach.


(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 2
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/16/2018 10:11:11 PM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		I just tried that approach. I thought that I was all set up, but the target blew right by me, and I was close enough to fire at him. I suppose that I could have randomly launched BOL weapons in the vicinity of the target, but I really had no idea exactly where it really was, so that would have been useless, as well.

After the target gets by you, you essentially have no chance. Oh well, at least I didn't get destroyed this time around, so I guess that that is an improvement. <lol>

Doug

(in reply to giantsquid)
Post #: 3
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/17/2018 11:33:01 PM   
giantsquid

 

Posts: 270
Joined: 9/8/2014
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline 		OK, I did it. My plan was to use the HQ reports aggressively moving in front of enemy SSBN route at high speed and high depth as soon as possible. When I was at about 50 nm from his last position I stopped and started listening on likely approach (connected the dot of previous moves, hoping for the best). After a while it appeared at 13 knts under the layer! I waited until it was at 6 miles completely still and then launched 3 stallion missile, scoring 2 hits. Then I run again into the deep.
I have been detected but not ID and the enemy sub killed. Got some nearby sonobuoy but I have been lucky.

In the picture the situation a few minutes before firing. The yellow spike is the enemy SSBN



Attachment (1)

< Message edited by giantsquid -- 7/17/2018 11:35:35 PM >

(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 4
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/18/2018 2:46:38 AM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		Congrats on your victory.

Well, I'm 0 for 7, and still trying. In fact, I've been trying for 14 straight hours today.

I've tried it every way:

I run up to it and waited (like you did), only to be discovered and attacked by air.

I've held back and waited, only to let it slip past me.

I stayed back, in its path, and had even detected it, but I couldn't get a solid fix on it, and couldn't fire. I then lost it as it went through a CZ, and I never picked it up again until it was long gone.

Locating it is bad enough, but getting a solid fix on it is really difficult. I guess that I could have fired a BOL, but I really thought that I would get a solid fix on it. But, that never came.

This is a difficult scenario, and it is not easily tamed.

Doug


(in reply to giantsquid)
Post #: 5
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/18/2018 9:56:07 AM   
giantsquid

 

Posts: 270
Joined: 9/8/2014
From: Milan, Italy
Status: offline 		Thanks. I have been lucky for sure. I used save option to try different approaches. I have been killed and detected by air too more than one time.
I didn't wait to have a perfect fix and I always fired without waiting too much.
Playing as a russian we probably have around 10-20% success, mostly based on air and SSN patrol.
In my experiecne if the SSBN move quite fast and if you creed you can really detect it before being counter-detected

Francesco

(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 6
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/18/2018 12:01:56 PM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		Francesco,

The funny thing about this is I have even slowed down to as little as 3 kts, altered my course, altered my depth, and still can't reacquire the boomer. And, the boomer is traveling at 12 kts, so I don't know why I can't find him, since I'm less than 30 miles away when I lost him. I even used the 'God's Eye' and could see that he was within 12-14 miles away and I still couldn't find him. I tried speeding up just a little (7-9 kts), but the boomer detected me.

I created some 'saves' to try to artificially (cheat) move the Russian sub and see at what point I can actually detect him. The Russian detected the boomer from about 12 miles out. I fired two of the long-range Starfish, and turned and headed in the other direction. I knew that the Escort sub is out there somewhere, but I don't have a fix on him. Both of the Starfish hit the boomer, but they don't kill him. My Russian sub slinks off to the NW without accomplishing the mission. I then turned to face the boomer again to try to launch some more Starfish, but I suddenly have two torps that were fired at me. I responded by firing two BOL torps toward the incoming torps and then turned and ran at full speed in the opposite direction. My torps don't hit anything, and the Escort's torps found and killed the Russian sub. Afterward, I checked and two P-3 Orions were now overhead, so even if I would have killed the boomer, and if the Escort's torps would have missed me, the Orions still likely would have killed me anyway.

I'm not sure that I can count this as #8 since I didn't actually play it to get to this point, but if we do then I am zero for 8.

This is a REALLY DIFFICULT scenario to win, and if you do, then it will be as a combination of some luck and skill.

Doug


< Message edited by DWReese -- 7/18/2018 1:33:29 PM >

(in reply to giantsquid)
Post #: 7
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/19/2018 12:03:29 AM   
FelixCulpa


Posts: 110
Joined: 8/17/2015
Status: offline 		I am zero for one on this one. Like giantsquid says, use the reports, draw a line and speed to an intercept point.
Unfortunately I had a head-on with an LA class escort sub.

I have reported a bug in this scenario - contacts not reporting on the screen but appearing in the log.
Keep an eye out for it. I'm a little wary of spending too much time on The Silent Service until this is fixed.


(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 8
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/19/2018 2:24:18 AM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		I have noticed one thing about approaching the boomer: If you approach at about 10 miles out and less than 200 feet you will detect it about 1/4 of a mile sooner than if you approach it at the same depth (344 feet). But,, if you try approaching it from the same distance and at 600 feet you won't detect it, nor will it detect you, at all. You will pass in the night. Interesting.

I'm zero for 13 now. I have managed to "cheat" (move my sub into an area where it will intercept the boomer), and I have managed to kill it, but I never get out alive. If the Escort doesn't get me, the skies are so full of killers that I'm surprised that they aren't crashing into each other. <lol>

This is a tough scenario.

Doug

(in reply to FelixCulpa)
Post #: 9
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/19/2018 12:29:30 PM   
Airborne Rifles

 

Posts: 229
Joined: 2/17/2015
Status: offline 		I won this one on the first try, though it was probably a lot of luck. I picked up the boomer in the first convergence zone to my southwest after it had already passed me. Got an ID pretty quick and bracketed it with a pair of Stalions, one of which hit. Finished it off with a second rocket torpedo and then sprinted north, going to creep after about half an hour. The rest of the evasion was uneventful and I was never detected.

_____________________________

Check out our novel, Northern Fury: H-Hour!
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1733838503?ref_=pe_3052080_397514860
And our web site:
http://northernfury.us/

(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 10
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/19/2018 1:54:13 PM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		Wow!

Congrats on your victory.

I never got a fire solution in my first CZ detection. I assume that you fired without having a solid one. I waited.

By waiting, my next opportunity came after the subs have closed to within 10 miles or less, and by then, if you fire at him, there will be all kinds of fury (from above and below) coming your way. You will get a kill, but you will be killed as well.

I find it to be a difficult scenario to play and win. I do believe that your method, albeit perhaps unconventional, is probably the only way to kill the boomer and survive.

Doug


(in reply to Airborne Rifles)
Post #: 11
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/19/2018 7:41:14 PM   
Airborne Rifles

 

Posts: 229
Joined: 2/17/2015
Status: offline 		You're right, I did BOL for the missile/torpedoes. Can't remember if I went active with my sonar to get a better fix before firing (played this a couple of months ago).

_____________________________

Check out our novel, Northern Fury: H-Hour!
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1733838503?ref_=pe_3052080_397514860
And our web site:
http://northernfury.us/

(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 12
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/20/2018 11:10:35 AM   
ultradave


Posts: 1355
Joined: 8/20/2013
Status: offline 		Took another try at this one and came closest to winning. Sank the Bremerton and the Underwood, and THEN found the SSBN after a long search, launched 3 torpedoes at it and was immediately hit by a P3 dropped torpedo. My now unguided torpedoes sped off harmlessly.

I know you would normally leave the escorts to avoid detection but they were in the way of finding the boomer and surely would have detected me trying to get around them. I had the jump on both of them and took the shots, then cleared the area and began searching for the boomer. Almost worked.

_____________________________

----------------
Dave A.
"When the Boogeyman goes to sleep he checks his closet for paratroopers"

(in reply to Airborne Rifles)
Post #: 13
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/20/2018 11:16:05 AM   
DWReese

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 3/21/2014
From: Miami, Florida
Status: offline 		"I almost won, all the way up until the time that I didn't." <lol> Me, too.

Doug

(in reply to ultradave)
Post #: 14
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 7/20/2018 2:56:50 PM   
ultradave


Posts: 1355
Joined: 8/20/2013
Status: offline 		I must admit I have had a LOT of those. The school of hard knocks


_____________________________

----------------
Dave A.
"When the Boogeyman goes to sleep he checks his closet for paratroopers"

(in reply to DWReese)
Post #: 15
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 3/19/2019 7:15:47 AM   
Zathred

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 7/5/2018
Status: offline 		I was fortunate to be successful in this scenario first time through and have posted a full AAR describing the tactics and events together with some game saves for your pleasure

Zathred

< Message edited by Zathred -- 3/19/2019 7:16:14 AM >

(in reply to ultradave)
Post #: 16
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 3/24/2019 4:58:51 PM   
coh7res

 

Posts: 13
Joined: 5/19/2006
Status: offline 		Hello Zathred-

Read and enjoyed your AAR. One question... you state that you went to full stop and held position in the layer while waiting to reacquire the SSBN. Would that be a valid tactic real-world?

Thanks!

CHiP

(in reply to Zathred)
Post #: 17
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 3/24/2019 8:07:42 PM   
Zathred

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 7/5/2018
Status: offline 		An interesting question! I was aware that SSBNs can "hover" in order to launch their missiles but wasn't sure that SSNs could manage the same trick. Given that some SSNs have VLS tubes it seems likely though.

I found this comprehensive article from a former USN submariner which confirms they can and gives some very detailed descriptions of the equipment and procedures involved.

As to the effect on a towed sonar array I can't say as my current research indicates that the vessel needs to maintain a minimum headway to keep the array operational and in the correct orientation. The article says however that the towed array can be used while motionless.

https://www.quora.com/Can-submarines-stay-still-underwater-without-moving-at-a-given-depth#

< Message edited by Zathred -- 3/24/2019 9:01:49 PM >

(in reply to coh7res)
Post #: 18
RE: Anyone play, and win, the Creeping Death Scenario? - 4/2/2019 4:06:39 PM   
StellarRat

 

Posts: 188
Joined: 9/14/2009
Status: offline 		I won it three times once I figured the right "technique". One time I even managed to destroy a Los Angeles and the target sub and get away cleanly. I actually think "The Enemy Below" is a much harder scenario.

(in reply to Zathred)
Post #: 19
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