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2x3+ 005 Soviet North

 
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2x3+ 005 Soviet North - 8/1/2019 9:22:27 PM   
Beria


Posts: 403
Joined: 4/6/2017
Status: offline 		T005 Soviet North

quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
5 Panzer Divisions and 2 Motorized Divisions are directly threatening the city of Leningrad.
I think you will be VERY please with your replacement for 23rd Army.





quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
The plan was to create a frontline from Leningrad to Pskov to Velikie Lukie to support effort to protect Moscow's flank... The reinforcement was to help create that defensive frontline... I dont know why ... retreated all the troops from there, to the exception of a few divisions...gave them a whole lot of ground that could have been defended and would have slowed them down several weeks...The enemy is free to encircle both Northern and Central Commanders.




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Post #: 241
RE: 2x3+ 005 Soviet North - 8/2/2019 2:04:06 PM   
Crackaces


Posts: 3858
Joined: 7/9/2011
Status: offline 		The north at least was in real danger of “PacMan” bites while Osinovets was being bombed. In the end, the Northern strategy made the best of it given the eventual outcome. There are not enough Soviet units to defend the current line and they are not deep enough. So terrain that takes up MP’s that is substituting For a unit that could delay was likely the best of many poor choices. If you want to see what is possible ... I think turn 11 ? The whole 4th Panzer Army takes a big bite of the Soviets.

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Post #: 242
2x3+ 005 Soviet Centre - 8/2/2019 6:10:10 PM   
Beria


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Status: offline 		T005 Soviet Centre

quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
It looks like 2 SS div. (Das Reich + Grossdeutchland) are getting ready to do a pincer movement on Smolensk with the 19th Pz Div... prepare for the defense of Velikie Lukie. ... Do not let the road to Moscow be captured... Take the peasant and build a few fortification along the Rzhev-Kaluga line... If Smolensk and Vyazma were to fall. Retreat to defend the Rzhev - Kaluga Line. Then proceed to defend the Tula - Orel line.




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Post #: 243
2x3+ 005 Soviet South - 8/2/2019 11:01:37 PM   
Beria


Posts: 403
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quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
Hold Odessa. ...I expect the Germans will be trying to break trough to Dnepropetrovsk and Odessa. They will most likely push for Kiev after capturing the Pocket in the marshes. Prepare defense in Sevastopol with your reinforcement would be my suggestion.




quote:

Soviet South Commander
I did 2 counter attacks to get some wins for guards status eventually. Also isolated 2 panzer divs and bumped 2 panzer HQs so their southern spearhead won't have much fuel at all next turn. Odessa will require a major effort so that's German infantry that will show up much later along the Dnepr. Also their rail heads seem to be 1 whole turn behind schedule, good news. Replaced 1 commander (18th army).


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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/2/2019 11:02:25 PM >

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Post #: 244
2x3+ 005 Soviet Air - 8/3/2019 11:43:12 AM   
Beria


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quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
Airforce Commander You are to cease all air mission immediately, the only airplanes flying will be those assigned to your next mission. I want all Recon airplane to be assigned a fighter escort. I want to know what is going on in the Southern Region, more specifically, in the triangle from Kirovograd, Nikolaev and Krivoi Rog. Try to use as little as possible, I want to know where the South is going to be hitting for its next breakthrough. So try to find mass formations of enemy division.



quote:

Supreme Air Commander
Comrades the mighty soviet air force will be spending the next few months screening industry in the back and reinforcing itself. It appears the axis have been probing are rear industry and that I will put an end to. My other focus over the next few months is fleshing out Moscow Air Command. ...Come late fall 1941 I will move the air most likely south for winter counter offensives. This leaves the north with not much help in the near future...



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Post #: 245
RE: 2x3+ 005 Soviet Air - 8/3/2019 2:32:49 PM   
Crackaces


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Beria

quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
Airforce Commander You are to cease all air mission immediately, the only airplanes flying will be those assigned to your next mission. I want all Recon airplane to be assigned a fighter escort. I want to know what is going on in the Southern Region, more specifically, in the triangle from Kirovograd, Nikolaev and Krivoi Rog. Try to use as little as possible, I want to know where the South is going to be hitting for its next breakthrough. So try to find mass formations of enemy division.



quote:

Supreme Air Commander
Comrades the mighty soviet air force will be spending the next few months screening industry in the back and reinforcing itself. It appears the axis have been probing are rear industry and that I will put an end to. My other focus over the next few months is fleshing out Moscow Air Command. ...Come late fall 1941 I will move the air most likely south for winter counter offensives. This leaves the north with not much help in the near future...




This is very interesting. It is the north that needed fighters starting this turn to defend Osinovets. (Flak had not been made deadly yet). Seven turns from now Leningrad will be isolated.

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Post #: 246
RE: 2x3+ 005 Soviet Air - 8/3/2019 7:43:20 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		The AI flies the Finnish air force during Soviet turn 5 to places they would never allow us to fly them to!




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Post #: 247
2x3+ 006 Axis Team Allocations - 8/4/2019 6:52:21 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		For information only - attached turn 6 Axis team allocations

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2x3+ 006 Axis Karelia - 8/4/2019 6:53:40 PM   
Telemecus


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Janisjarvi line stormed



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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/4/2019 7:03:44 PM >

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RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Luga - 8/4/2019 7:11:56 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		An excerpt on from the team chat on the Axis Team Discord channel discussing ways to cross the Luga - ideally the infantry would clear a bridgehead free of ZOCs so that motorised forces can cross with the minimum of movement cost. Here is one suggestion



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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/4/2019 7:12:35 PM >

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RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Luga - 8/4/2019 7:13:56 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		And another suggestion earlier on



During the start up of the game all ground commanders were rated as inexperienced with the exception of the Axis South commander who was considered experienced as a Soviet player only. Already all the team chat and studying the game together is showing how much they have developed since the start of the game. Looking back on where they were on turn 1 (see post 150 http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=4662127 ) they are already laughing at how they used to play the game.

To see this turn in the AAR by the Axis North commander click here

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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/4/2019 7:34:37 PM >

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2x3+ 006 Axis - 8/5/2019 9:54:19 AM   
Telemecus


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2x3+ 006 Axis Air - 8/5/2019 5:20:50 PM   
Telemecus


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Soviet air set up is a few biplane fighters behind the Volkhov in range of Leningrad, And every other fighter at Moscow or the airfields to the rear. They only have recon in the south.

From battle results it is becoming apparent that their air doctrine stipulates 50% or 55% of their air group needs to be ready for any of the airgroup to fly.

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Post #: 253
RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Air - 8/5/2019 5:21:33 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		And the damage at Osinovets takes a jump up




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Post #: 254
RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Air - 8/5/2019 5:27:32 PM   
xhoel


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From: Germany
Status: offline 		Good air offensive on the Axis side. Week Soviet defense from what I can see. There should be around 300+ Soviet Fighters as well as heavy AA concentrated on protecting Osinovets. If you do this, you will hinder the Axis from reaching the damage levels that they need to shut the port down.

50-55% ready needed for an air group to fly is unnecessary. The Soviets should contest the air as much as possible. They can afford to lose many more planes than the Axis. Being passive in the air as the Soviets is the one thing that every German commander wants to see, it allows the Axis to bomb and GS with impunity and launch such attacks as shown here.

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Post #: 255
RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Air - 8/6/2019 11:14:30 AM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		The fighter bases at Moscow are only in range if you can push the staging base forward first - I think someone on the Soviet team has been counting hexes! In these turns Axis ground commanders are also the air commanders of their area, so it is easy to co-orindate. The picture below was made during the turn to other team members to illustrate. It shows with a circled red 1 where a German staging base is and targets that are in escort range of it have a circles blue 1. If during the turn the hexes with a circled red 2 are captured, then the hexes with a circled blue 2 can then be in escorted bombing range. And so on with 3. So even though some things are out of escorted bombing range at the start of the turn, that will certainly not remain the case.



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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/6/2019 1:10:12 PM >

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Post #: 256
2x3+ 006 Axis Rail Repair - 8/6/2019 1:50:41 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		Rail repair in north and centre - past Pskow but two turns from Vitebsk.



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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/6/2019 1:51:24 PM >

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RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Rail Repair - 8/6/2019 1:52:44 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		Rail repair in south - manual repair is well behind where it would get to in other games. A critical rail hex in Hungary was damaged by marauding Soviet units (circled in red) and this is blocking a crucial automatic rail repair route coming out of there across the mountains. If this is not repaired quickly then the important Rumania by-pass will not be ready in winter.



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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/6/2019 1:55:26 PM >

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Post #: 258
2x3+ 006 Sov Karelia - 8/6/2019 4:48:54 PM   
Beria


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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/6/2019 4:49:08 PM >

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Post #: 259
2x3+ 006 Sov North - 8/6/2019 5:51:48 PM   
Beria


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Status: offline 		T006 Soviet North



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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/6/2019 5:52:15 PM >

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Post #: 260
2x3+ 006 Sov Centre - 8/6/2019 7:55:49 PM   
Beria


Posts: 403
Joined: 4/6/2017
Status: offline 		T006 Soviet Centre

quote:

Supreme Soviet Commander
...encirclement at Smolensk is unacceptable. It threatens Moscow considerably. The German encircled all defensive position in and around Smolensk. If we loose those encircled armies, we loose the whole defense of Moscow...reinforcement wont arrive until a few turn... and it will weaken our two other fronts... All rear area troops are being re-deploy to Moscow.

We also need to discuss the eventuality of Moscow falling. I dont want anyone freaking out. If it happens, we will retreat and hold new defensive position. And we will wait, for winter is coming !


Repeated furious attacks are made against the encircling Panzers to try to break in to the pocket.



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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/6/2019 7:57:55 PM >

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Post #: 261
RE: 2x3+ 006 Sov Centre - 8/6/2019 8:21:52 PM   
A21

 

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Status: offline 		Looking back I am thinking this was the key moment in 1941 - and the Soviet position in the center is not good.

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Post #: 262
2x3+ 006 Sov South - 8/7/2019 10:49:10 AM   
Beria


Posts: 403
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Status: offline 		T006 Soviet South

quote:

Soviet South Commander
AGS is not progressing too fast. Allowed me to send some units to 10 hexes behind the front on refit to build morale. Expecting them back on the line next turn if AGS starts to hug the Dnepr in preparation to get across.




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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/7/2019 10:50:32 AM >

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Post #: 263
RE: 2x3+ 006 Sov South - 8/7/2019 10:53:50 AM   
Beria


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quote:

Soviet South Commander
Bit disappointed with all paratroopers disappearing... What are they doing there around Pavlova?! They need to screen the Dnepr to delay AGS further or you need to rail them to centre sector to help out there. Now I was forced to evac Dnepropetrovsk industry.


Giving control of the airborne troops to the air commander is making for lots of co-ordination problems.

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< Message edited by Beria -- 8/7/2019 10:54:22 AM >

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Post #: 264
RE: 2x3+ 006 Axis Air - 8/7/2019 5:21:34 PM   
Crackaces


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

And the damage at Osinovets takes a jump up





A few things to notice here ...

It is quite possible to put air power over Osinovets on turn #2.

The Germans are using JU86E-2's. These platforms are quite expendable and are stuffed in airgroups set to withdraw. So, their loss is no big deal. (The JU87 Stuka's are quite a different story). The German's are halfway to the goal of 70% (which after the Logistics phase would be the required 67% to shut down the port.) using these air platforms.

The flak is only (68) 37mm in this case It would be expected that the Soviet's in the future would be stuffing this area with hundreds of 85mm and 37mm flak guns. The losses would be considerably higher. It would behoove the German player to recon and find the rout with the least amount of flak and move staging bases so this route is taken.

There are a maximum of 3 airbases that could be stacked on Osinovets. I would assume they wold need a range of 40 to defend the hex? Would that mean that at least the adjacent hexes could be swept? The Soviet's had 50% required to fly in this picture so it was quite easy to ensure no Soviet fighters would respond to our calling up Osinovets ..

_____________________________

"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so"

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Post #: 265
2x3+ 006 Sov Air - 8/8/2019 9:45:20 AM   
Beria


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Status: offline 		T006 Soviet Air



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Post #: 266
2x3+ 007 - 8/8/2019 4:30:21 PM   
Telemecus


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Status: offline 		Why is the Dnepr Bend closer then Kiev?

This game, like many others, sees the Axis getting closer to the Don Bend than Kiev even though it is so far away. One team question is why does this happen? Some of it is just Soviet forces retreating to a major river line for defence. The Axis prioritising the industry of the Donbass is another reason. But I think the real reason is shown by the red lines on this map.


The red lines depict paths from Poland to Dneproretrovks or Odessa only on clear hexes without crossing any rivers. In movement point terms they are much closer to Poland than Kiev is. If the map was distorted to make distances on the map equivalent to movement points needed to get there, then Kiev would be far to the east of Dnepropetrovsk. For this reason I think motorised forces naturally end up closer to the Don Bend than Kiev quite quickly.

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< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/8/2019 4:36:57 PM >

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Post #: 267
RE: 2x3+ 007 - 8/8/2019 8:50:26 PM   
EwaldvonKleist


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Status: offline 		Kiev definitely is closer to your starting point north of Lvov then Dnepropetrovsk, hex or MP wise. Not sure what you mean there.

< Message edited by EwaldvonKleist -- 8/8/2019 8:51:05 PM >

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Post #: 268
RE: 2x3+ 007 - 8/8/2019 10:05:26 PM   
Telemecus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist
Kiev definitely is closer to your starting point north of Lvov then Dnepropetrovsk, hex or MP wise. Not sure what you mean there.


I was using creative licence - trust you to be precise!

OK correction - Dnepropetrovsk is much closer MP wise than you might think given how many hexes away it is.

Happy?

< Message edited by Telemecus -- 8/8/2019 10:06:08 PM >

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Post #: 269
RE: 2x3+ 007 - 8/8/2019 10:43:50 PM   
Zorch

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

quote:

ORIGINAL: EwaldvonKleist
Kiev definitely is closer to your starting point north of Lvov then Dnepropetrovsk, hex or MP wise. Not sure what you mean there.


I was using creative licence - trust you to be precise!

OK correction - Dnepropetrovsk is much closer MP wise than you might think given how many hexes away it is.

Happy?

A good point about map distortion. Will WitE 2.0 make any non-cosmetic map changes?

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Post #: 270
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