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RE: TOAW IV features - 4/25/2017 6:57:09 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Its Elmer, not Elmo.

Using Formation Cooperation features will have some effect on influencing Air Units to support specific formations. Assigning specific hexes for Interdiction would be a nice feature. At this point I think we can assume that no more features will be added to IV, so suggest that you save up your new wishes for V

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Post #: 211
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/25/2017 12:17:53 PM   
Curtis Lemay


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

At this point I think we can assume that no more features will be added to IV, so suggest that you save up your new wishes for V


Whoa there, Steve. I certainly expect IV to get some further mods. How many I can't guess, but every new release should expect a significant period of support and such - just like III got.

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Post #: 212
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/25/2017 6:16:47 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
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From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Alright then, more new features, excellent !

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Post #: 213
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/25/2017 9:16:33 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		Great! Could we plan chain of command, dynamic formation changes and OOB tree representation in a TOAW IV update?
Please, I am too old now to wait for TOAW V........

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Post #: 214
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/26/2017 2:30:36 AM   
Meyer1

 

Posts: 899
Joined: 2/9/2010
Status: offline 		Did the OOB screen get any improvement?

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Post #: 215
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/26/2017 2:56:03 AM   
Curtis Lemay


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Meyer1

Did the OOB screen get any improvement?


Did you see post #5 in the "Editor?" thread?

< Message edited by Curtis Lemay -- 4/26/2017 2:57:25 AM >

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Post #: 216
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/26/2017 3:50:50 AM   
Meyer1

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

quote:

ORIGINAL: Meyer1

Did the OOB screen get any improvement?


Did you see post #5 in the "Editor?" thread?



So this is how it looks in the editor, the in game oob screen is pretty much the same? I see that there's a new "unit info" row, are there any new buttons in the bottom, or the ability to sort units clicking at the top of the rows? (guess not).
Oh, and there is a scroll bar now.


< Message edited by Meyer1 -- 4/26/2017 3:51:34 AM >

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Post #: 217
RE: TOAW IV features - 4/26/2017 8:42:37 PM   
ncc1701e


Posts: 7380
Joined: 10/29/2013
From: Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
Status: offline 		When I speak about "OOB tree representation", I am looking for something like this:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=3896981

Cheers

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Post #: 218
RE: TOAW IV features - 5/3/2017 4:03:19 AM   
Meyer1

 

Posts: 899
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Status: offline 		Just thought that would be nice that if the "unit report" panel could be set to always be open, so in that way as you select one unit after another the info is there at first glance. What do you think?

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Post #: 219
RE: TOAW IV features - 5/21/2017 1:02:31 PM   
mcseamus

 

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I did see from the posted pics that opponent's unit strengths won't be known (presumably before contact), but it appears that unit sizes may be seen. But more generally, how will that work?

I assume that you will start to get information based on units within a certain range, but I am curious, for example, if different armies have different intelligence gathering capabilities. I would also be interested in whether intelligence can be wrong. Limited/poor intelligence was a defining feature of many armies, so it could add another layer of realism to the game.

"What do you mean that battalion is actually a brigade...?" has a nice feel to it. What can I say, I am a masochist?

I am sorry if I missed a post explaining this.

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Post #: 220
RE: TOAW IV features - 5/21/2017 2:23:02 PM   
Curtis Lemay


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mcseamus


I did see from the posted pics that opponent's unit strengths won't be known (presumably before contact), but it appears that unit sizes may be seen. But more generally, how will that work?

I assume that you will start to get information based on units within a certain range, but I am curious, for example, if different armies have different intelligence gathering capabilities. I would also be interested in whether intelligence can be wrong. Limited/poor intelligence was a defining feature of many armies, so it could add another layer of realism to the game.

"What do you mean that battalion is actually a brigade...?" has a nice feel to it. What can I say, I am a masochist?

I am sorry if I missed a post explaining this.


Intel is the same as under TOAW III (except for Naval Spotting). Enemy-owned hexes are either Spotted, Observed, or Unknown. If Spotted you know everything. If Observed, you know a few things, if Unknown, you know nothing - not even that there is anything in the hex.

Which case applies to each hex is determined via a random application of the friendly Theater Recon value (terrain and weather affect its application). This can be augmented by adjacent friendly units' recon values. In modern scenarios, recon helicopters may add to that (maybe Electronic Warfare, too - I'm not sure). Finally, there's Naval Spotting - more on that later.

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Post #: 221
RE: TOAW IV features - 6/10/2017 8:39:31 PM   
thecowboysmiles

 

Posts: 22
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Status: offline 		As I've posted in the TOAW 3 forum;

Sdkfz 251 has an maximum speed of 52 km/h on road but it's 21 km/h off-road. On open terrain its speed may be more than 21 km/h but most likely it'll still be less than 52 km/h. So I think it should cost more than 1 MP for moving through clear hexes. Most photos of German armoured columns from WW2 shows the vehicles moving through roads even there is clear terrain around them. The same MP for road/clear terrain doesn't stress the importance of roads.

I think this should be modeled in the new TOAW like 0.5 MP for moving through improved roads.

(in reply to Curtis Lemay)
Post #: 222
RE: TOAW IV features - 6/11/2017 4:50:01 PM   
stasv

 

Posts: 17
Joined: 2/21/2017
Status: offline 		What I would wish to ask...Did you do any works on changing of units parameters? Well, when I bought this game a few years ago, I started with playing the tutorial scenario, that one about the korean war. First thing I was embarassed that I won on the korean side, and I won americans and south koreans before the chinese forces went into combat, the UN forces were smashed out...And the second thing in spite of it, an effectivenes of mig 15 was nominal, it was a common situation when I got report "you lost 4 mig 15 and the enemy two corsairs, absolutely unlikely, especially in light of the fact that both side had revealed the information about lost and damaged planes so we now know what had happend in almost every days of the war. (Yes I know that actually the red info is only about USSR fighter regiments, but the NK aviation was trifling, and chinese were brought into the battle a bit past my victory.)
So I dont mean to offend anyone, but I began to have some doubts about the realism and didnt play it anymore...

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Post #: 223
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/18/2017 6:41:34 AM   
wongalfred


Posts: 8
Joined: 9/12/2013
From: Hong Kong
Status: offline 		Thanks it's useful for me.

< Message edited by wongalfred -- 11/18/2017 6:45:08 AM >

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Post #: 224
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/18/2017 8:05:38 AM   
Oberst_Klink

 

Posts: 4778
Joined: 2/10/2008
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: stasv

What I would wish to ask...Did you do any works on changing of units parameters? Well, when I bought this game a few years ago, I started with playing the tutorial scenario, that one about the korean war. First thing I was embarassed that I won on the korean side, and I won americans and south koreans before the chinese forces went into combat, the UN forces were smashed out...And the second thing in spite of it, an effectivenes of mig 15 was nominal, it was a common situation when I got report "you lost 4 mig 15 and the enemy two corsairs, absolutely unlikely, especially in light of the fact that both side had revealed the information about lost and damaged planes so we now know what had happend in almost every days of the war. (Yes I know that actually the red info is only about USSR fighter regiments, but the NK aviation was trifling, and chinese were brought into the battle a bit past my victory.)
So I dont mean to offend anyone, but I began to have some doubts about the realism and didnt play it anymore...

Talking about losses and adjusting things for older scenarios; it's worth to adjust the AD and MRPB as well. As guide line, here's an old TOAW III thread.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=3045873

Klink, Oberst

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Post #: 225
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/18/2017 10:27:21 AM   
elmo3

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: fastfrank

...And wouldn't it be useful if we command "combat support" to then click the HQ of a friendly formation and Elmo interpret this as concentrate on this formations' battles? And if we command "interdiction" and then click a hex for Elmo to interpret as "search starting with this hex and whack any enemy unit we find"?....





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Post #: 226
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/22/2017 3:32:57 PM   
BigDuke66


Posts: 2013
Joined: 2/1/2001
From: Terra
Status: offline 		As the list in the first post is very useful and as many seem to ask what changes went into TOAWIV I would liek to know if it is up to date or if features are missing.

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Post #: 227
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/22/2017 6:06:50 PM   
Curtis Lemay


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From: Houston, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

There will be optional combat graphics to show participating units and their equipment as they are employed.


The above was dropped.

There were several features added beyond the list, including:

1. In-Game Equipment Editor.

2. Expansion of turn intervals and hex scales.

3. New Mud and Snow Rules.

4. The Jump Map.

< Message edited by Curtis Lemay -- 11/23/2017 2:37:47 PM >

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Post #: 228
RE: TOAW IV features - 11/15/2019 2:45:08 PM   
TDefender


Posts: 87
Joined: 4/30/2015
Status: offline 		Too bad, it looked an interesting feature, but maybe it could be implemented in the future or we have to consider TOAW IV a finished game (apart from bug fixing)?

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Post #: 229
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 8:59:56 PM   
William the Silent

 

Posts: 74
Joined: 3/1/2020
Status: offline 		I've seen Bob Cross's Civil War games on his website, with the 1 hour turns, 0.25 km/hex (or less) implementation in Shiloh.
Is TOAW ever going to implement the smaller hex sized and shorter turn times?
It might attract more wargamers, like me, that like to create 2D games from the Napoleonic Era on the tactical scale.

There is nothing out there for us on the 2D kind of game.

< Message edited by William the Silent -- 3/1/2020 9:02:35 PM >

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Post #: 230
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 9:19:17 PM   
BigDuke66


Posts: 2013
Joined: 2/1/2001
From: Terra
Status: offline 		Not speaking for anyone official but this game has since its first release always been called "The Operational Art of War".
Expecting it to cover the tactical level, especially in that detail, seems futile.
There are other game series that do that, mainly John Tiller's Napoleonic Battles series.

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Post #: 231
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 9:57:54 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 12969
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From: Houston, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: William the Silent

I've seen Bob Cross's Civil War games on his website, with the 1 hour turns, 0.25 km/hex (or less) implementation in Shiloh.
Is TOAW ever going to implement the smaller hex sized and shorter turn times?


I don't understand the question? TOAW has 1 hour turns and 0.25 km/hex. Are you saying that you want something smaller and shorter than that?

< Message edited by Curtis Lemay -- 3/1/2020 9:58:24 PM >

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Post #: 232
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 10:29:51 PM   
jupiter999

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TDefender

Too bad, it looked an interesting feature, but maybe it could be implemented in the future or we have to consider TOAW IV a finished game (apart from bug fixing)?

I also wonder if it's considered a finished game or not...

(in reply to TDefender)
Post #: 233
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 10:53:00 PM   
BigDuke66


Posts: 2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay
I don't understand the question? TOAW has 1 hour turns and 0.25 km/hex. Are you saying that you want something smaller and shorter than that?

1 hour???
0.25 km/hex???

Manual only notes as smallest 6 hour turns and 2,5km hexes, was there a new level of detail implemented?



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Post #: 234
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/1/2020 11:08:48 PM   
sPzAbt653


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Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Duke - Check your What's New:
Turn Intervals increased to include 1 hour, 3 hour, 2 week, monthly, seasonal, and annual. (Not in the manual).

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Post #: 235
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/2/2020 6:26:40 AM   
William the Silent

 

Posts: 74
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Status: offline 		Like Duke says it's not in the manual.
I never considered TOAW for creating Napoleonic games, because of the minimum 2.5 km/hex scale that is mentioned in reviews and the manual. I read that whole manual to be able to understand the mechanics and features.

John Tiller games are great, but too much micro management. I like creating games more then playing them and TOAW seems to have a great game engine for that. Lot's of depth and from operational till tactical level representation in 2D boardgame style with 700x700 maps. Just what I'm looking for.

If I can do 1 hour turns 0.25km/hex (or less) I'm in.

I guess the manual needs an edit.





< Message edited by William the Silent -- 3/2/2020 6:34:54 AM >

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Post #: 236
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/2/2020 1:40:54 PM   
Curtis Lemay


Posts: 12969
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quote:

ORIGINAL: William the Silent

I guess the manual needs an edit.


The manual is too much of a project to edit. Updates that post-date the manual are contained in the "What's New" document. Everyone needs to keep the two together for reference.

< Message edited by Curtis Lemay -- 3/2/2020 8:59:28 PM >

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Post #: 237
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/2/2020 4:50:02 PM   
William the Silent

 

Posts: 74
Joined: 3/1/2020
Status: offline 		"What's new". Can I find that somewhere on this forum. I've been looking everywhere but I don't find it. Feel like a noob for asking.

Btw. Your AAR's really help to understand/learn about the game.

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Post #: 238
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/2/2020 5:04:31 PM   
cathar1244

 

Posts: 1003
Joined: 9/5/2009
Status: offline 		Should be in your ... Program Files (x86)\Matrix Games\The Operational Art of War IV directory

Also look in ... Program Files (x86)\Matrix Games\The Operational Art of War IV\Manuals

Cheers

< Message edited by cathar1244 -- 3/2/2020 5:10:03 PM >

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Post #: 239
RE: TOAW IV features - 3/2/2020 6:12:16 PM   
William the Silent

 

Posts: 74
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Status: offline 		I get it now. Thanks

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Post #: 240
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