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Im Old....any one else? - 7/19/2003 9:52:20 AM

M4Jess

Posts: 5140
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: DC
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I remember......

1969 My family had a Rambler on Dangerfield road...Clinton Maryland...I was 8 years old...I had all American made the box sets. All those cool GIs with the implanted M16s and the wacky looking Jap MMG......

Then I moved on to Modles...1:35 scale.....man I made a million of them.

In 77 or so I was with my (older) sister-in-law..TOYS ARE US!:cool:

I came across AHs Panzer Leader...I have never been the same...:p

In short...Panzer Leader moved onto Squad Leader..Then ASL...Then (late) "THE LONGEST DAY"! "The Normandy game!"

anyways...I was just thinking about my youth....

[SIZE=4][B]AH Ruled![/B] [/SIZE]

M4 Jess~

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Post #: 1

- 7/19/2003 10:25:10 AM

dlazov

Posts: 185
Joined: 11/14/2002
From: Chicago IL
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It was the summer of 79 and I was 13 when I lost my virginity to Afrika Korps, Battle of the Bulge and The Russian Campaign. By the fall I was doing Squad Leader and Torbruk. Throughout the 80's I was know and cherished my title of "Wargaming Slut" I would game anyone, anywhere, anytime. ASL was my favorite crutch to always fall back on. Then my ASL partner introduced me to a game call Panzer General, we played for hours until I got a call from him. "Don, you gotta come over now, I just got the most awsome game yet, its almost like Squad Leader". When I hastly got to his place I saw the title Steel Panthers and fell in love at first byte.

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DGL

An army of rabbits led by a lion, will beat an army of lions, led by a Rabbit. Napoleon

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Post #: 2

- 7/19/2003 10:34:27 AM

Bernie

Posts: 1779
Joined: 3/15/2002
From: Depot HQ - Virginia
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Sigh...

It seems like just yesterday I finished the model kit of the Japanese battleship "Yamato" (the motorized version), but it was probably 1967 or '68

I took it to the water hazard on the first hole of the golf course in Forest Park (Queens, NY) turned it on and launched it. It sailed perfectly, building up a good speed as it circled out in the middle of the pond. Then, my buddy David and I got out our slingshots, and a supply of "ashcans" (large firecrakers with waterproof fuses), and started "shelling" it, while my other buddy, Robbie, filmed it with his Dad's 8mm camera. It took about a dozen shots to get the timing right. Most of them were not even close, and the ones that were took time to go off, while the target sailed out of range. They did make excellent explosions though, throwing water 15 to 20 feet in the air. Finally, David managed (and I still don't know how it could have been anything but a lucky shot, though he insists otherwise), to "skip" one ashcan across the pond and landed it directly between the stacks of the model, sticking there. Half an eyeblink later it went off, and the resulting destruction, captured on film, was awesome. I don't think Hollywood could have done it any better. :)

It wasn't very long after this that the group of us got involved in wargames. We set up a sheet of plywood on horses in Robbie's garage, and for the next few years this was our CP for many a great battle. We played them all, everything in the Avalon Hill catalog. And talk about realisim? In the winter of, I think it was '72, we played the Bulge in that garage... with 28" of snow on the ground outside, and temperatures in the single digits, and this was an unheated garage! We froze our butts off out there, playing until our lips turned blue, before rushing into the house to warm up for 10-15 minutes, then back out to the garage.

I miss that garage sometimes, and I miss my old buddies even more. Robbie is a CPA now, and no longer plays wargames, which is probably a good thing, since I don't think I ever beat him in any battle. David moved to Florida with his family in '75, and the rest of the gang just slowly grew apart over the years.

But... Now we have places like this, the Matrix Forums. The temperature is always just right, your opponents can move to any corner of the globe and still play against you, and no one ever knocks the plywood off the sawhorses reaching for another slice of pizza. :)

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Post #: 3

Let's See... - 7/19/2003 10:36:29 AM

Orzel Bialy

Posts: 2664
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From: Wisconsin USA
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Well...I'm definitely not as old you! LOL :D

In 1969 I was only three. :p

However in 1977 I was 11 and watching my brother play AH's "Midway" with his friends. ( they were 6 years older than I and I still have the game in my closet along with all the others that he gave to me or that I bought on my own )

In 1979 he let me actually play my first games with him and his friends just before he moved out on his own..."Bismarck" and "Afrika Korps"

In 1980-81 I bought my first board game with Christmas cash..."Third Reich"

From there it lead to "The Russian Campaign" and then "Squad Leader"...and all the add ons.

Yes...those were the days!

What made it really great was the fact that I had a large group of friends, so there was always enough people to play a game.

Of course most of the game playing began to take a steady decline after the first girlfriend! LOL :D

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Post #: 4

- 7/19/2003 10:59:58 AM

Alby

Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
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In 1969 I was 12
in 1977 I was in the Air Force stationed at Homestead AFB in Florida.
Man I AM REALLY OLD!!!
But I can still Rock and Roll as you will see if you click on the 2 links below!
Now..... Back to my recliner!!!
:)

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Post #: 5

1969 - 7/19/2003 12:15:24 PM

stevemk1a

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From: Penticton B.C.
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'69 is my fave year ... I was born then! :)

Seriously tho ... I used to play with the plastic toy soldiers with my friends ... anyone remember the old Disney "Pirates of the Caribbean" ships that used to fire ball bearings? ... we used to stage giant battles involving WWII figures, Star Wars stuff, Battlestar Galactica stuff, and anything went ... :D . It wasn't pretty, and alot of plastic died ... :(

Later I got into AH's 'Advanced Third Reich", and wargames in general ... as a complete geek in highschool, I used to stay after class in the computer lab and play "Panzer Leader" and "Panzer Blitz (?)" with my friends using all the boards and counters ... we would geek out for hours... !

I then got into ASL and played "Red Barricades" with a human opponent until real life caught up with him ... :(

I also used to build 1/35 plastic models of WWII vehicles and troops ... I would stick cotton wool in my models of WWII fighters to simulate battle damage ... smoke etc... :D

Oh well ... it was a loooong time ago....

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Post #: 6

- 7/21/2003 11:46:00 PM

Capt Chris

Posts: 200
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From: Rochester, NY
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1969 is pre-CaptChris! :D

I do remember my first exposure to Risk back in 1980. I'm not sure if it actually classifies as a wargame but what the heck.

By 1982 a few close friends and I had found Axis and Allies. That was a pretty fun game for a 12 year old. All I remember is that if you ended up being the Russians, just buy lots of Infantry and stack them on the German borders before the German armor started their charge.

I discovered fireworks somewhere around age 14 which is when I used to hold "army men olympics" in my sandbox. Boy can those guys fly. Guess they must have been Airborne Infantry!!! :D

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Capt Chris

"Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!"

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Post #: 7

I can relate - 7/22/2003 12:10:18 AM

tmac

Posts: 160
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I was raised in a house full of Lionel trains and grew up making stuff for layout, which got me into modeling. Lots or armor, airplanes and ships later, I ended up in high school in Brooklyn 1974-1978. There I was introduced to wargaming through some friends of mine who, believe it or not, were the slave labor at SPI!(boxing up games in trays or bags) We got all sorts of free/discount games, and I played those and AH Panzer Leader/Panzerblitz with the guys from high school (Plus more than a little D&D, Iwas a weird combo of geek and jock). I never appreciated what a great thing that was until in the late 80's I decided to get back into it, and realized SPI was no more. I could have probably wangled a job back in the heyday of that company. I always dabbled in computer games, from a primitive Star Trek on a main frame back in the 70's, through stuff like Artic Fox and Asteroids, and finally got back into board gaming with the Assault series from GDW. At the same time I hooked up with a bunch of guys here in Syracuse who played minatures, and spent alot of time between the Civil and Cold wars. Then when I bought a home PC, I got Panzer General II for Christmas, which over a few years led me through SP1-3, to SPWAW and here. This is arguably the most fun you can have with clothes on.

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Post #: 8

- 7/22/2003 12:37:48 AM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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When I think of my age, I remember watching the moon landing live on tv. I don't have much time for stupid conspiracy theories either :).

I think of the fall of Saigon, not some place called Baghdad.

I remember playing Tactics II and not long after finding this dumb game called Dungeons and Dragons. Then wargaming became Squad Leader and Third Reich. And models, well I think all boys make models.
I joined the army cadets in my teens. I remember outings where were wore old Korean war uniforms and we were eating rations from before we were born hehe (which is an odd thing).

I joined the army in the 70's and I can tell you, Bush knows nothing about power politics. He doesn't even have anyone sufficient to scare him. I remember a lot of stress about a place called Fulda Gap.

I remember the Berlin wall coming down, communism dying and selling all my stupid glad it will never happen WW3 in Europe wargames.

Suffice it to say, I don't miss the Cold War, and I have little interest in wargaming possible nightmares much either.
The Gulf was just something to make the news worth watching.

I might not have any war stories, but anyone born after the fall of communism in Russia, really doesn't know what it is like to live in fear quite the way people my age and older do.

All today has to offer for worry, is a fear of not having the same job in 5 years.
Some how it's not quite the same.

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I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

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Post #: 9

In 1965 ... - 7/22/2003 12:49:55 AM

challenge

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I was 15 and introduced to a game called Blitzgreig. Generic wargamming at its finest. Before that my friends and I bought HO-scale Miniatures -- pre-assembled -- and staged battles around a village I had for my HO train set. My favorite tank -- the Panther. The Lionel 0-guage (which I still have) was too big to spread out so my father got me into HOs. Made a nice village to set up a battle in.

From there I move on to more complex wargames: Panzer Blitz, ASL -- even a strategic level simulation of the air war over Europe.

In addition to the armor collection, I had models of all the major Fighters of WW- II (both sides) and a fleet that included the Pennsylvania (WW-I vintage), the New Jersy (it was the Missouri, but being from NJ ...), the U-505, the Prinze Eugen, and the Bismark (which I re-marked for the Tirpitz) and, of course, PT-109. My little sister sank the whole fleet one day when she grabbed the cloth covering the dresser. A truly sad day in naval history.

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Challenge

War is unhealthy for die-stamped cardboard and other paper products.

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Post #: 10

- 7/22/2003 1:48:17 AM

Bing

Posts: 1366
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From: Gaylord, MI, USA
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You guys are youngsters. We were having Sunday dinner at 1 PM EST on December 7, 1941. I was 7-1/2 years of age. The phone rang, it was a neighbor asking if we had our radio on. No, we didn't. Turn it on, the caller said, the Japanese have attacked Pearl Harbor.

I got with wargaming after release from US Army active duty, under the Eisenhower Six Year military obligation act - two years active Mich NG, folowed by two years standby status.

Release from active Army duty was July 1958: Avalon Hill was it. We had Gettysburg, Tactics II, a few other games. Not much. I believe AH made this pastime of ours into something it otherwise would not have been. "Boardgame" prior to AH was Monopoly, backgammon, parlor games. Later, when Squad Leader was released, wargaming really did change forever, it could never be the same.

Just as our lives could never be the same after December 7, 1941. Or September 11, 2001.

Bing

P.S. Not long ago I talked to the CEO of a US publlisher of simulations, and some other assorted computer games. He had never heard of Avalon HIll. The term "gamer" is not going to mean much in the near future.

_____________________________

"For Those That Fought For It, Freedom Has a Taste And A Meaning The Protected Will Never Know. " -
From the 101st Airborne Division Association Website

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Post #: 11

- 7/22/2003 2:14:53 AM

john g

Posts: 984
Joined: 10/6/2000
From: college station, tx usa
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Am I the only one here who played games by SPI, GDW, CGC, etc?

Avalon hill may have had great production values, but for gameplay give me Winter War by SPI or Ironclads and the expansion by Yaquinto. Not forgetting to mention DNO and the rest of the Europa series by GDW.

Board wargaming was great in its day (my personal favorite year for designs was 1972, many great games published that year) but I sold off almost all my games years ago and haven't played for years any of the ones I kept.

All my gaming now is on the computer and will likely stay that way for some time.
thanks, John.

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Post #: 12

Hey john G - 7/22/2003 2:46:48 AM

Klinkenhoffen

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I too played some of the GDW Europa series.
Western Desert, Torch, Near East, First to Fight, Balkans.

I have but never played Fire in the East, Scortched eart, Urals

Still have all of the above plus the original Squad Leader series
Squad Leader, Cross of Iron, Cresendo of Doom, GI.

But now its Steel Panthers as its hard to find someone who is willing to put in the time for a boardgame.

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Post #: 13

- 7/22/2003 3:32:30 AM

Procrustes

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I started with the AH games like Panzerblitz & Panzerleader early 70's. I think the first game I ever played was Blitzgrieg by AH? - or maby it was Tactics II. One of the first games I played was an SPI game called Sniper - god, we loved that game!! I still keep my eyes open for a used copy. I bought all the Squadleader games & gamettes, but by the time ASL was coming out I was in college and didn't have the time or money. I don't have anyone to play board games with anymore, but find I keep picking up the ASL rules in my local game shop and debate about buying them.....

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Post #: 14

- 7/22/2003 3:58:51 AM

Krec

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From: SF Bay Area
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my cousin taught me risk at age 10, that was in 72. i liked the game so much i started makng my own , first with 72 countries then with 90. we would play at my house because the darn board was like 3x4. sports interupted my gaming until the knees went and i got tired of pulling muscles. i went over to my brother in laws to watch movies and in the corner he had a mac classic with like 2mb ram. on the machine was a game called empire.........hmmmm i thought, with a twinkle in my eye . i played that darn game all night and into the next morning. i thought the game was fantastic. a few years later i went out and bought a mac and pickup a game called empier deluxe. WOW , i thought this is even better!! i played that game for hundreds of hours. i started snooping around the maccomputer store and found a little gem called panzer general . now that game had a little flavor. that game was the first one i played with music and atomosphere. i thought i was actually going across the rhine.
then ran into a guy who asked if i ever played CC. i said no and he replied with " its the best game ever.!!" hummmm i thought ,
but its only on a pc. well you know what happened next. i switched from my beloved mac to a pc for only one reason (the mac is still a better machine) more wargaming selection dammit!!
i preceded to play CC, didnt like it much because of the realtime.
i then went to pg2. played the heck out of it. then i found a game at the store called steel panthers..........this looks good ,
i mean really good.......let me give it a try.......omg.... this is the one ....the game i ve been looking for , you know the game ....the one thats that like playing with your little green army
men when you were 4 and 5 . well then came sp2, sp3.....eastfront...ef2....wf...rs....cw2.....battleground ...toaw.......
then finally the undisputed king of turnbased wargaming and still undeated champion of the world........ SPWAW!!
this game has NEVER left my harddrivre and when anybody ask me what game am i playin latley...........you know the answer SPWAW!! what these die hard guys did to this game is fantasic,
to take a already good game and bring it up to what it is today is awesome. i salute you /:
ive been dabbling with UV (i am over the : why cant i pick which task force to kill thing") and really like the game . although
the scope is very narrow and no editor .
also i just cannot wait for .............COMBAT LEADER!!
i am getting wet just thinking about this game.........i got a really good feeling about this baby. could be one of those really rare gems. untill then i am more then happy to play SPWAW 7.1 or
the new H2H , what a bunch of great features this mods has......hey leo your the man!! the best part is no more* thingy
that should really be interesting trying to keep you armor in one piece now. well thats my story and i 'm stickin to it!!

see you on the battlefield

:D

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Post #: 15

- 7/22/2003 5:55:56 AM

Bing

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From: Gaylord, MI, USA
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John G - You most certainly are not the only here who has played games by SPI et al. In 1958 you would not have been doing this, not that I know of.

One of the greatest games of any kind I have ever played was "Empires of the Middle Ages" - SPI. I used to have many of their releases, but since I moved and play strictly computer now most of the SPI, Victory Games, et al, are long gone.

Used to subscribe to S&T and Moves, until I got stung when SPI went under the first tiime. The new owners had the nerve to write to me wanting me to start all over, no makeup of the games and issues I missed. They just wanted me to give them money. I'll bet some people did it. Not this kid.

Flat Top? Far enough back for you? The best paper simulation of all time, for my money: Harpoon. Might still be, it is very much alive, supported by Bond and his elves.

Remember, a lot of - most of - what is being talked up here came after 1958. How mamy of the publishers mentioned thus far were in the business of wargames in 1958 OTHER than AH?

Could have been some, on a limited basis, but we didn't know about them in Detroit, of that I am certain. Before the Internet you posted an "Opponents Wanted" classified in the General - I made some good friends that way.You also got mail from Sepp Dietrich and such, but paper is easy to throw out.

Bing

_____________________________

"For Those That Fought For It, Freedom Has a Taste And A Meaning The Protected Will Never Know. " -
From the 101st Airborne Division Association Website

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Post #: 16

- 7/22/2003 7:29:12 AM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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Avalon Hill really to me was more about games on map boards than it was about anything else.

Sure they had a lot of the mega titles under their belt, but SPI, GDW, VG, and a few other labels (just can't recall all of them some days) were every bit as important in my collection.

Some of the greats in wargaming were not AH titles.

Australia gave us World in Flames.

GDW gave us the Assault System for modern warfare at company level.

SPI gave us Sniper and Europa, and the term monster game in a lot of cases.

It's not to surprising though Bing that Avalon Hill might be unknown to some today. The world has been fixated on electronic entertainment now for a minimum of 15 years.

Kids today can't relate to it if you don't plug it into the wall, and people making money from gaming, are not going to expend a lot of time relating to a niche community.
Nope they will focus on the big bucks of the mainstream market.

It's the reason why we have weird debates over the term "wargame" in here occasionally. We all "know" what the term means, but we are so few in number.

John q public not yet a wargamer, thinks a wargame is anything not pure fantasy roleplay that involves groups of things shooting up other groups of things.

To me, a wargame is games like Battlefield 1942, Squad Leader, Supremacy, Close Combat, Strategic Command, or Civilization. After that, the term becomes not worthy of the argument.

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I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

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Post #: 17

Because I couldn't help myself.. - 7/22/2003 7:53:58 AM

Belisarius

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From: Gothenburg, Sweden
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I have NO idea what you old farts are ranting about. :D

In 1979 I was barely able to speak. :rolleyes: I didn't even start to think about military stuff until the mid 1990's :p

Guess it was better back then, eh? Well, we live and learn...

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Post #: 18

Better is a relative term. - 7/22/2003 8:25:06 AM

challenge

Posts: 465
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From: Austin, TX
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The major advantage was being able to see the look on your oponant's face when he walked into the ambush. You had to keep track of everything by hand. (Was that unit 431 that used all it's smoke or the one next to it?)

The bookkeeping was the hardest part of the game and drew a lot of attention away from the tactical side. With SPWaW, C&C and other's like them, the computer does all the number crunching, leaving you to concentrate on the important stuff. I still miss the look on the oponant's face when I do something surprising, though.

_____________________________

Challenge

War is unhealthy for die-stamped cardboard and other paper products.

(in reply to M4Jess)

Post #: 19

You think your old..... - 7/22/2003 9:44:34 AM

chief

Posts: 1660
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From: Haines City FL, USA
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In the 30's we had a game that used cards, yep....52 of them and we called it WAR. No score pads, no dice, no pencils. After that we played another game on a board with 48 squares and 16 men to a side. Later we progressed to some war stragedy game called Chess. Now that was a game..........hehehe....:D :D ;) :rolleyes:

ha! young whippersnappers !!

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Post #: 20

- 7/22/2003 9:49:21 AM

Huffy

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From: ,USA
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Jess,...your and I are almost a match....I was in PA. though....models...tons of them......Panzer general,Blitz,...Squad Leader....all AH games....
Then went to gaming conventions.....had a blast....
And ...now....SPWAW....
Take care....
Huffy

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Post #: 21

- 7/22/2003 11:59:35 AM

rich12545

Posts: 1705
Joined: 10/31/2000
From: Palouse, WA
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Heh, you guys are mostly a bunch of kids.
I got out of the army in '69 after a three year stint. Didn't get into gaming (except the card game war and also chess lol) until computers came out. Played the very first war games from SSI on my Apple II. There was Naploleon, Bismarck, Ambush and others. SPWAW is now one of my favorites.

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Post #: 22

- 7/22/2003 7:49:08 PM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

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Funniest thing I have ever done with a wargame has to be giving my squad leader a whuppin in basic with my modest little had to take some of it with me Squad Leader game.

Guys take this warning seriously. DO NOT eeeeeeeeever beat someone like your Squad Leader with a game that screams out he was just beaten by a nothing at his own job.

Yeah I sure regretted doing it. I also didn't get my game back till after training :)

_____________________________

I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

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Post #: 23

- 7/22/2003 9:42:08 PM

Bing

Posts: 1366
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From: Gaylord, MI, USA
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Les - "Avalon Hill really to me was more about games on map boards than it was about anything else." Not sure of the reference here. Most wargames ARE played on mapboards - there were a few which used an abstract "track" kind of system, but not many. Are you saying AH wasn't really about wargames? Doesn't seem likely.

Or ... do you mean war "game" versus what SPI called "simulation"? Remember the furioius debate on that one? When I bought the Isby "Air War" (SPI) I remember having to spend three days just reading the rules. We eventually decided that not even Isby knew what some of the rules meant. Air War was so "detailed" we half expected to come across a pre-flight inspection walk around, including kicking the tires.

IIRC, in the S&T monthly magazine there was a chart which had slots for various game aspects including complexity. For a long time, there wasn't another sim or game on the chart even close to Air War. Course, my friend who had flown 400+ missions in 'Nam kinda laughed at some of the assumptions made in Air War, but it was one of a kind.

I am used to being a dinosaur, it gets that way when a person has been around for a while. These days, I suppose anyone who guns down a zombie-like Nazi in Return to Castle Wolfenstein is a "wargamer". To begin with, "gamer" meant something different than it does today, if the term has any meaning at all currently, which I am beginning to doubt.

I will point back to the days of the PacWarriors as one example: We were the guys who were hooked on Gary Grigsby's Pacific War - in it's original form I believe it was one of the greatest computer wargames produced, in some aspects a work of near genius. I will always feel that way about GGPW. Some of would spend dozens and dozens of hours preparing game aids for the benefit of fellow PacWarriors. Our group included professional historians and a curator for the Arizona Memorial at Pearl Harbor. Many naval officers, both on duty and retired.

These were GAMERS. Also not incidentally among the best people I have ever met - as are a number of people here on the Matrix Forum. I suppose a lot of this is really old fashioned. Don't really care if that is true. Time has not diminished what we had with the PacWarriors, and the values they represented.

As to embarrassing a cadre who you will be answering to on a daily basis, youth can excuse the excess. Once. Beyond that, it's as Casey Stengel said about a certain rookie in spring training, "Only moderately bright ..."

Best from here,

Bing

_____________________________

"For Those That Fought For It, Freedom Has a Taste And A Meaning The Protected Will Never Know. " -
From the 101st Airborne Division Association Website

(in reply to M4Jess)

Post #: 24

- 7/22/2003 10:48:36 PM

cadmus

Posts: 62
Joined: 3/13/2002
From: Columbia, MD
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Hmmm ... I wonder where else you'd find a bunch of guys bragging about how old they are?

In my case, I discovered AH's Blitzkreig at the tender age of 31 (delayed adolescence) ... in 1971. A revelation! After working over a number of the AH Classics, I found SPI's S&T magazine, in time for Winter War and Oil War, circa 1973. Then the glory years of paper maps and cardboard counters ... SPI, Yaquinto, Clash of Arms, GDW and all the rest. Some of my fondest memories are of a group of 6 to 8 buddies clustered around a 4X8 sheet of plywood on saw horses every Thursday night for months .. working on Highway to the Reich. Wellington's Victory! Richard Berg's Civil War Series! La Bataille de la Moskova! Then .. another revelation ... Squad Leader ... and then ASL!

I love SP:WaW. And I'm dead certain I'll love Combat Leader even more. But I sure do miss the group gathered around the gaming table. The interplay .. the banter .. the groans. PBEM and H2H help, but still ....

Anyone remember the Satchel Snatch scenario in Sniper? The interminable die roles and complex tables in AH's Tobruk .. which somehow managed to be engrossing in spite of that?

Oh dear ... I've got myself all a twitter .. where's my toddy and my cane?

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- 7/22/2003 11:18:44 PM

Jim1954

Posts: 1393
Joined: 5/15/2002
From: Dallas
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I sure remember Tobruk. My buddies and I bought 3 copies just so we could cover the dining table with cardboard. Heh, didn't matter, we just ate take out pizza anyway. I don't think we ever finished a whole game.

Star Fleet Battles was a lot like that, too. Up all night just to play 3 or 4 turns. Andromedans were tough with a capital T.

Yaquinto's Ironclads was another one that wore your wrist out. Pick up Clive Cussler's book "The Sea Hunters" for some excellent reading about those old ironclad battles.

First computer wargame was a silly little thing called B-1 Bomber, I think AH put it out. Nothing but text but at the time it seemed cool.

I still remember watching Vic Morrow in Combat in black and white.

Much simpler times.

Yeah, I'm old too.

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KMC/T

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- 7/22/2003 11:19:17 PM

tmac

Posts: 160
Joined: 4/16/2003
From: Syracuse (Home of 2003 NCAA Basketball Champs) NY
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OMG...I forgot Sniper! Those paper paralelogram vehicles/tanks, and charting all the planned movements! that was a fun game. Also, Tobruk did require an incredible degree of bookkeeping. I still own all my old games, from AH Panzer Leader/Blitz, through glory days of SPI (quad games, ziplock bagged games, through Highway to the Reich, etc, etc), I have 2 Yaquinto Armor series, and my personal fave for modern war, the entire series of Assault and Sands of War from GDW. These were great fun to play. I just enjoy SPWAW more than I ever did those. This forum does substitute for the missing interaction between friends over the table, but I don't miss the bookkeeping, endless sorting of counters and stacking them, and feline induced hurricanes/earthquakes (or even human clumsiness caused) ruining days or weeks of prep and play. This forum is a great way to interact, and I eventually hope to make good friends here. This place seems to go waaaay beyond this game that brings us together, with people providing advice and support to their friends here who need it. This really is a tight community of good people (just a little obsessed)

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Tmac - 7/22/2003 11:23:10 PM

Orzel Bialy

Posts: 2664
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From: Wisconsin USA
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You are correct sir...this forum is unlike most I have visited, hence the Virtual Band of Brothers banner. :)

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- 7/22/2003 11:35:35 PM

Les_the_Sarge_9_1

Posts: 4392
Joined: 12/29/2000
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Bing "mapboard" equals map on a board , that's all I was saying.

I think you might not have realised I was saying that most companies use map "sheets". Avalon Hill was probably the one and only company that made a big fuss over mounted maps.

In my early gaming days, I was taken with the ability to play a few hours, then pick the separate "boards" up and store them on a shelf stacked on dice between boards.
It was very handy.

The only thing wargamingish different from AH and SPI, was they were different companies.
I bought SPI games knowing they might be less expensive in some cases, and not as lavish in chrome. But I never thought they were lesser products.

Still got some favourites. Bulge is a great SPI title of modest expense (well at the time it was inexpensive).

Mapsheets are not a negative feature, you just can't pick them up the same way, nothing more. Storing a Europa game merely takes specific planning.
But it is just as difficult these days to store a historical ASL module which uses a map sheet.

Boards have largely been left behind. It is a rare company that will go the expense of mounted boards.

I can have a mounted board easy though.

First you laminate map. Then you use sturdy book binding tape to make the custom cut linked 1/8 thick plywood panels fold. Then you glue laminated map to custom cut 1/8 panelling.

A lot of fuss admittedly. But considering the hoops computer gamers will go to, to enjoy a computer program, I don't think it is too odd really.

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I LIKE that my life bothers them,
Why should I be the only one bothered by it eh.

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True Story - 7/22/2003 11:37:35 PM

M4Jess

Posts: 5140
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: DC
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In (around) 1982 My best friend Don (some of you guys met Don at Aberdeen) and I laid out all of the ASL boards on our apartment floor...It was hugh! We could not even reach the middle boards!:eek: We both owned 2 full sets of counters..:D I was the American...:rolleyes: and Don the Germans...we used both FULL sets of counters!:cool: A turn lasted hours..and the battle was set up for weeks...no partys..no girls..no visiters at all...STAY OUT we have the mother of all battles going on here...

ahhhh those were the days!:)

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Im making war, not trouble~

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