The Emotional Aspect of the Game

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The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 2:04:19 AM

Vanman

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Nobody really comments on this aspect of the game but for myself the highs and lows are amazingly fun. The search rolls for naval battles can be very tense, you can feel it in the pit of your stomach. Things can go absolutely glorious, well beyond expectations, and at other times getting BADLY surprised can be devastating. The worst of course is getting a few really bad rolls in succession where you literally, and irrationally, start to think some degree of persecution is occurring. LOL. Sometimes when your opponent gets a string of bad luck you almost start to have sympathy for them (man, that was a raw deal).

I always find the turn of Barbarossa to be a little bit unnerving. Not really as the Soviet player, much more so as the German player. In the 1941 invasion you end up looking at the forces on the border at your disposal and think, 'man, thats all I have?'. In the first turn in May/June 1941 there are always a few units behind or in Konigsberg. I never seem to get setup exactly the way I want due to time constraints, weather etc.

You would think this game would start to get dull after repeated playing but it never does. Each contest is unique due to the innumerable die rolls and the corresponding ebb and flow. Despite its flaws (which are pretty minor in my eyes), its a work of art for an esoteric audience. We should be very thankful this game even exists.

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 3:08:30 AM

brian brian

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World in Flames features a key concept that came from another WWII game, at the complete opposite end of the "scale" spectrum: Squad Leader.

And that concept is: the "Morale Check" - many a player of WiF fails a morale check, and things cascade from there.

You will roll poorly. Prepare.

(in reply to Vanman)

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 6:11:19 AM

BrianJH

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From: Adelaide, Australia
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So, shouldn't one be forming their strategy on achieving their goals with as few dice rolls as possible? Less chance of rolling BAD that way.

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 3:48:48 PM

Centuur

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I had a couple yesterday, in the Netplay game with Gerry. First: I intercept with a 6 factor FTR a Soviet TB-3 doing a ground strike. (he forgot that the Italian lend lease ME-109 was within range). So with a -5 for the Soviets and a +5 for the Italians I was totally in shock when the Axis rolled a 9 and the Allies a 20!
Of course the ground strike was a total success too...

In the same impulse, another intercepted TB-3 got through (without any FTR loss on both sides), succeeding in ground striking all units in the hex...

And in the same impulse, something like this happened again with the British rolling a 19 killing a FTR and the Germans again clearing through an Allied bomber.

If there would be real dice, a friend of my would have done the following to the dice...

< Message edited by Centuur -- 6/5/2020 3:49:54 PM >

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 5:48:20 PM

brian brian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BrianJH

So, shouldn't one be forming their strategy on achieving their goals with as few dice rolls as possible? Less chance of rolling BAD that way.

Absolutely not. You can�t make an omelette without breaking a few eggs. There are 2 kinds of WiF players - Builders, & Fighters. Fighters routinely trash Builders, those who just want to build the most perfect set of counters, not risk it in battle too hastily.

Also the really big die rolls are not rolls you get to choose to make, though land combat rolls in 1940 can be quite consequential. The important rolls are the ones for the weather.

(in reply to BrianJH)

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 6:06:50 PM

warspite1

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The Axis attempting ground strikes this impulse (from post 357-360)... that was emotional....

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4610251&mpage=12&key=

< Message edited by warspite1 -- 6/5/2020 6:07:48 PM >

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/5/2020 8:15:56 PM

AxelNL

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hear hear - good post.

Like I sank half the Italian fleet with my french sortie early 1940 in my last game......

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/6/2020 1:28:02 AM

Neilster

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From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BrianJH

So, shouldn't one be forming their strategy on achieving their goals with as few dice rolls as possible? Less chance of rolling BAD that way.

It's better to make fewer attacks at better odds but in general probability doesn't work the way you suggest. Each dice roll is an independent random event. That's a mathematical definition. They are random because, for each die, all results are equally likely and they're independent because it doesn't matter what has happened before or what will happen in the future.

< Message edited by Neilster -- 6/6/2020 12:28:20 PM >

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/6/2020 5:53:03 AM

warspite1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BrianJH

So, shouldn't one be forming their strategy on achieving their goals with as few dice rolls as possible? Less chance of rolling BAD that way.

warspite1

But how would that work? If you did that then taking Poland (for example) is potentially fatally extended as you would seek to mop up all outliers using auto attacks before having to roll the dice at least twice - Lodz and Warsaw. Suppose the weather goes against the German player, making even auto attacks impossible?

But what would a plan to roll the dice as little as possible look like? What does it mean? For example, would such a policy mean that the Axis never seek out Allied convoys either because Allied units are present or can be brought in? Never undertake strategic bombing unless there is zero chance of interception?

End of the day it's fundamentally a dice game - a sophisticated, difficult to learn and harder to master dice game - but a dice game nonetheless. This has to be accepted or there is no point playing.

You say there is less chance of rolling bad the less you roll? Well as Neilster says that is simply not true. If the dice gods are with you then great, if they are against you then.....

I've given an example (above) of extreme bad luck in a single impulse. Have a look at this for a further example - and I'm sure all (M)WIF players have their own equally shocking examples they can share.

WIF accurately reflects the real war. The Germans have to get off to a good start. The Allies can build up very quickly unless the Germans can defeat them before they build too much. Momentum is everything. With that in mind have a look at these examples from one game:

Axis Land attacks

Look at the Axis average throws. As said above, throwing against Warsaw and Lodz is required. German throws against Lodz alone were: 2,1,1,3 = average 1.75

It wasn't until the Axis 8th land combat throw (the Germans 5th) that they weren't disorganised when attacking. In the Germans first 10 land throws they threw: 2,4,1,1,7,1,3,2,2,9. The 7 and 9? Well the 7 was a 7:1+2 attack against a notional and the 9 was a 7:1+2 attack against Warsaw...

During that game the most commonly thrown dice roll in land combat for the EuroAxis? It was a 1, which was thrown 18% of all throws.

That's emotional

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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 6/6/2020 6:03:22 AM >

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/6/2020 6:11:40 AM

warspite1

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Sadly for the Axis this dice rolling was repeated in the air. Remember, momentum is everything

Have a look in particular at the pilot losses. This is crucial because if the French don't lose pilots they can always keep aircraft in the sky. And if the Germans have to keep buying pilots (as well as aircraft) they are not building infantry etc.

German pilot losses by March/April 1941 were 6:1 in the Allies favour

Allied aircraft losses only overtook German losses in January/February 1941.

Up till March/April 1941 there were 30 rounds of air combat. The Germans had plus modifiers on 22 of those rounds (4 were even).

So yes, this game can be very emotional - but this was all pretty extreme and just one of those games - but its also fun and if you don't roll the dice then you might as well not play.

Note: this should be cumulative by turn

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< Message edited by warspite1 -- 6/6/2020 7:01:12 AM >

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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RE: The Emotional Aspect of the Game - 6/12/2020 7:50:45 PM

CanInf

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I played a game that went to 47. In 40 I thought I was toast. France did not fall until Nov/dec. The Luftwaffe had one fighter ( a 3 factor). The army was reduced to a single mech for armour. I very nearly quit. In that same game by 47 the western allies were nowhere to be seen on continental Europe. I was bullet proof in the east. And the Pacific was only just starting to be dangerous for japan. A series of massively wasteful allied strategic decisions made up for my stunning incompetence in France.

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