Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tomn

Check out his posts in the beta thread. Preeeetty sure Poe’s Law isn’t the issue here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ZiggyMaca

If you water down the mechanics, make it less 'hardcore', there is no reason for the game to exist. Other games look better and are 3D, have better sound, character and model animation, voice acted scripted cinematics, and streamlined simple to understand in a few sittings mechanics. Shadow Empire would, if simplified, would compete with these games, and lose. Deep, complex systems, especially the logistics system, are the reason the game is great. If you don't like it, and want to change it, it will never be able to compete with other titles, and will be a failure. It would not appeal to the masses if changed, and would betray the following of players this has if Vic bends to the call for it to be the same as every other game. The amount of games that are 'hardcore' are so few between, it would be a crime to destroy this game for the people that are grateful for something different than the run of the mill mass market game. Please, let there be a game for the people that want deep complex strategy / wargame / hybrids. Please, I want Vic to make games with his personal vision, somewhat tempered by the call for certain modifications. I don't support the call to completely replace entire entwined backbone systems that some find 'hard', I want rather they learn to overcome the challenge, and concentrate on helping Vic to make the mechanics and rules easier to understand, not easier.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

quote:

ORIGINAL: ZiggyMaca

If you water down the mechanics, make it less 'hardcore', there is no reason for the game to exist. Other games look better and are 3D, have better sound, character and model animation, voice acted scripted cinematics, and streamlined simple to understand in a few sittings mechanics. Shadow Empire would, if simplified, would compete with these games, and lose. Deep, complex systems, especially the logistics system, are the reason the game is great. If you don't like it, and want to change it, it will never be able to compete with other titles, and will be a failure. It would not appeal to the masses if changed, and would betray the following of players this has if Vic bends to the call for it to be the same as every other game. The amount of games that are 'hardcore' are so few between, it would be a crime to destroy this game for the people that are grateful for something different than the run of the mill mass market game. Please, let there be a game for the people that want deep complex strategy / wargame / hybrids. Please, I want Vic to make games with his personal vision, somewhat tempered by the call for certain modifications. I don't support the call to completely replace entire entwined backbone systems that some find 'hard', I want rather they learn to overcome the challenge, and concentrate on helping Vic to make the mechanics and rules easier to understand, not easier.

Yes yes yes ! I've also been trying to say this for some time now.

quote:

ORIGINAL: rwbrown

You could just reduce the power of each logistics building and eliminate supply depots and make it a single empire wide total. That way everything that needs logistics consumes logistics from the SHQ, literally like everything else. Logistics should be a resource and there should be a quartermaster Director, consolidating the military and applied science divisions. That way you still have 8 in command.

This would also drastically reduce turn calculations I’m willing to bet.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kriegsspieler

I'm going to divert this discussion slightly, and ask this. I like using the more complicated system of 1.04 -- it does feel like a Grigsby game -- but to be honest I still think I don't understand it very well. Especially I don't understand the information that is being presented.

Does anyone have a suggestion for a thread that explains how to interpret the available information and how to respond to it? Failing that, I'll just flounder around some more. I don't mind, really -- it's how I learn most games!

quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

quote:

ORIGINAL: ZiggyMaca

If you water down the mechanics, make it less 'hardcore', there is no reason for the game to exist. Other games look better and are 3D, have better sound, character and model animation, voice acted scripted cinematics, and streamlined simple to understand in a few sittings mechanics. Shadow Empire would, if simplified, would compete with these games, and lose. Deep, complex systems, especially the logistics system, are the reason the game is great. If you don't like it, and want to change it, it will never be able to compete with other titles, and will be a failure. It would not appeal to the masses if changed, and would betray the following of players this has if Vic bends to the call for it to be the same as every other game. The amount of games that are 'hardcore' are so few between, it would be a crime to destroy this game for the people that are grateful for something different than the run of the mill mass market game. Please, let there be a game for the people that want deep complex strategy / wargame / hybrids. Please, I want Vic to make games with his personal vision, somewhat tempered by the call for certain modifications. I don't support the call to completely replace entire entwined backbone systems that some find 'hard', I want rather they learn to overcome the challenge, and concentrate on helping Vic to make the mechanics and rules easier to understand, not easier.

Yes yes yes ! I've also been trying to say this for some time now.

Nope. You are saying that even the little Automation we got in the Beta is bad. It leaves every level of detail in place.

I no universe is that comparable to the refrenced post of ripping out the entire System and replacing it with a single global "Logistics" resource:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sieppo

quote:

ORIGINAL: ZiggyMaca

If you water down the mechanics, make it less 'hardcore', there is no reason for the game to exist. Other games look better and are 3D, have better sound, character and model animation, voice acted scripted cinematics, and streamlined simple to understand in a few sittings mechanics. Shadow Empire would, if simplified, would compete with these games, and lose. Deep, complex systems, especially the logistics system, are the reason the game is great. If you don't like it, and want to change it, it will never be able to compete with other titles, and will be a failure. It would not appeal to the masses if changed, and would betray the following of players this has if Vic bends to the call for it to be the same as every other game. The amount of games that are 'hardcore' are so few between, it would be a crime to destroy this game for the people that are grateful for something different than the run of the mill mass market game. Please, let there be a game for the people that want deep complex strategy / wargame / hybrids. Please, I want Vic to make games with his personal vision, somewhat tempered by the call for certain modifications. I don't support the call to completely replace entire entwined backbone systems that some find 'hard', I want rather they learn to overcome the challenge, and concentrate on helping Vic to make the mechanics and rules easier to understand, not easier.

Yes yes yes ! I've also been trying to say this for some time now.

Nope. You are saying that even the little Automation we got in the Beta is bad. It leaves every level of detail in place.

I no universe is that comparable to the refrenced post of ripping out the entire System and replacing it with a single global "Logistics" resource:

This was a broader discussion. I don't use betas.

quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd
I wrote some Toutorials:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4834257
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4843217

But for more help, we would need to know wich part precisely you got issues with.

quote:

ORIGINAL: zgrssd
Poes Law applies to every text-only communication.

Expecting people to go through a posters entire posting history jsut to make sense of a single post, is no basis for communication.

"If you had known me for years" means "of course what I emitted was ambigious."

quote:

ORIGINAL: balto

I feel like I am reading a forum on Steam.., all horse***t and no content. Man, what happened to Matrix.