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World generation question - 8/6/2020 6:29:11 PM   
soldat411

 

Posts: 11
Joined: 8/6/2020
Status: offline 		Is it possible to create a world that has some oxygen, and the ability to farm water from the air? I've tried the world generation a couple hundred times now and it seems it always shows insidous to human life, and toxic atmos farming.
Post #: 1
RE: World generation question - 8/6/2020 7:18:29 PM   
demiare

 

Posts: 470
Joined: 6/20/2020
Status: offline 		With water atmospheric recompositor? No, it's impossible. 0.5+% of CH4 / NH3 / H2S required for it will make atmosphere toxic.

But you CAN collect water from atmosphere via Wind Traps - all you need is to have some mountains around :)

(in reply to soldat411)
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RE: World generation question - 8/6/2020 8:29:35 PM   
gmsitton

 

Posts: 121
Joined: 10/25/2012
Status: offline 		Yes, a Siwa world around 1g (more likely to have an atmosphere). Just re-roll until you get mostly N2 with 20%ish O2. Also, the world needs to be old enough to have developed a biosphere, so maybe 3b years plus; not too sure what is the lower bound for the age in order to get a biosphere.

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RE: World generation question - 8/6/2020 8:45:07 PM   
soldat411

 

Posts: 11
Joined: 8/6/2020
Status: offline 		thanks I will try that, I was trying on the desert world. I have been trying to create a mad max world with a lot of raiders and a desert environment.

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RE: World generation question - 8/6/2020 10:08:12 PM   
gmsitton

 

Posts: 121
Joined: 10/25/2012
Status: offline 		You could also keep re-rolling until you get a small amount of rainfall, which should translate into a planet with rocky plains and sand dunes. Also, mountains may spawn dry areas on one side and wetter areas on the other.

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RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 12:46:46 AM   
HansLemurson

 

Posts: 134
Joined: 7/28/2020
Status: offline 		The trouble with generating "Desert Worlds" is that if they've never had any life, there's no way they could have acquired an oxygen atmosphere!

I agree that your best bet is gmsitton's suggestion of trying to find a Siwa planet that just has really low rainfall.

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RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 1:46:52 AM   
soldat411

 

Posts: 11
Joined: 8/6/2020
Status: offline 		Yea figured it would be pretty hard to find one, I actually was able to once get a ice world to get a breathable atmosphere. It started off as low toxicity then there was a colonization event that added 10 percent oxygen.

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RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 4:39:26 AM   
HansLemurson

 

Posts: 134
Joined: 7/28/2020
Status: offline 		Oh, interesting, I never considered terraforming events. But your problem is that the Deserts always end up with residual toxins in the air?

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RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 4:54:22 AM   
soldat411

 

Posts: 11
Joined: 8/6/2020
Status: offline 		yea I wasn't having a problem getting water early game with all the glaciers but then I started to run out because the wind traps were only giving me around 20percent of their value.

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RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 4:13:23 PM   
demiare

 

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Joined: 6/20/2020
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quote:

ORIGINAL: soldat411

yea I wasn't having a problem getting water early game with all the glaciers but then I started to run out because the wind traps were only giving me around 20percent of their value.


O_O What is consuming so much water? Open farming is either impossible or stupid move (very few hexs suitable to be turned into agrarian -> low profit) on desert planets.

Few glaciers is more then enough + Wind Traps / Water Soil Recompositors.

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Post #: 10
RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 6:03:51 PM   
soldat411

 

Posts: 11
Joined: 8/6/2020
Status: offline 		I think the domed farming used up a lot of water when I upgraded it, I also had multiple towns. In my new game it seems to be going much better and I am on a desert world again. There are a lot of glaciers on this one.

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Post #: 11
RE: World generation question - 8/7/2020 6:37:19 PM   
demiare

 

Posts: 470
Joined: 6/20/2020
Status: offline 		Well hydroponic is need to be used on planets without much water, dome farming is very inefficient and used as temporary solution until you will conquer land for normal farms OR shift to hydroponic.

Let's see an example from my current capital.
Level4 dome is using 1085 water & 21800 workers & 94 energy for 1400 food. This mean 1 food cost us ~0.8 water and 15.5 workers.
With good governor you could expect ~50% bonus (from both agriculture and relationship) so result will be ~2176 food. 1 Food ~= 0.5 water and 10 workers.

Level3 hydroponic is using 585 water & 5800 workers & 585 energy for 1800 Food. So 1 food cost us ~0.3 water and 3.2 workers.
While it doesn't affected by agriculture skill (and cross-fertilization) it still affected by relationship, so result will be ~2174 food. 1 Food ~= 0.25 water and 2.7 workers.

Yes, hydroponic is expensive (high-tech components) and need a lot of power. But it solve all problems on barren worlds. Plus it have two special techs to boost it even further, AFAIK each is +100% production, so it's will be better then dome even with 100% cross-fertilization (lol, impossible) and +100% from skill (lol your governor will need to roll stably 200+ on it's skill).

< Message edited by demiare -- 8/7/2020 6:38:01 PM >

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RE: World generation question - 8/8/2020 7:01:36 PM   
Antediluvian_Monster

 

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Joined: 7/22/2020
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quote:

ORIGINAL: soldat411

Yea figured it would be pretty hard to find one, I actually was able to once get a ice world to get a breathable atmosphere. It started off as low toxicity then there was a colonization event that added 10 percent oxygen.


To get Boreas class world with breathable atmosphere:

1) It needs to be at least medium sized, the small ones will have carbon dioxide based atmosphere that is poison to humans and plants. Not sure where the exact cutoff is, but 5000km plus radius and 0.6g plus gravity should be more than enough. But 4500km and 0.5 g will probably not cut it.

2) The temperature on equator needs to be above zero. Even +1c is sufficient, it seems. Pick a planet with temperature at minimum around -10c. Fast roll is preferable for high temperature on tropics. Rerolling the geology part until you get modest atmosphere will also help push you past zero degrees (modest atmosphere doesn't seem to affect the composition).

3) It doesn't need a lot of water, even "desert planet, without surface water" is enough.

4) The atmosphere should not have so much carbon dioxide that it's outright toxic to plants, but minor toxicity is acceptable and will be reduced to nontoxic by the oxygenation event. It must not be insidious to humans due to too much sulfur dioxide (SO2), but small trace amounts are still ok. Look for atmosphere with RHL level at "toxic", it's there due to too much CO2 and will go nontoxic with the oxygenation event.

All being said, it doesn't really play that differently from any other planet, but it does have the novelty of being the only breathable planet type aside Siwa class. Some open farming might be possible on the tropics depending on how hot you got it (can be over +20c).

< Message edited by Antediluvian_Monster -- 8/8/2020 7:15:35 PM >

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RE: World generation question - 8/8/2020 7:32:45 PM   
demiare

 

Posts: 470
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Antediluvian_Monster
1) It needs to be at least medium sized, the small ones will have carbon dioxide based atmosphere that is poison to humans and plants. Not sure where the exact cutoff is, but 5000km plus radius and 0.6g plus gravity should be more than enough. But 4500km and 0.5 g will probably not cut it.


0.4+G is enough to use filters (possibly even fully breathable if catch high oxygen & earth-like density).

quote:

ORIGINAL: Antediluvian_Monster
All being said, it doesn't really play that differently from any other planet, but it does have the novelty of being the only breathable planet type aside Siwa class.


No you also capable to get Limos breathable. But it's much harder to do because of bugged toxicity calculation that go crazy even with trace amounts of "bad" gases. Expect tons and tons of rerolls :)

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Post #: 14
RE: World generation question - 8/8/2020 7:47:59 PM   
Malevolence


Posts: 1781
Joined: 4/3/2010
Status: offline 		For cross-reference, [1.05b1] Potentially odd planet generation

_____________________________

Nicht kleckern, sondern klotzen!

*Please remember all posts are made by a malevolent, autocratic despot whose rule is marked by unjust severity and arbitrary behavior. Your experiences may vary.

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Post #: 15
RE: World generation question - 8/8/2020 7:58:03 PM   
Antediluvian_Monster

 

Posts: 13
Joined: 7/22/2020
Status: offline 		You can get the right mix with Boreas even with smaller worlds, but in my experience the game will start rolling worlds with very heavily CO2 based (even 90% plus) atmospheres if you do. If you go a bit larger you'll save a lot of rerolling, and rerolling for the planet basics takes less time than the later phases.

I'm honestly surprised you managed to get Limos without SO2 forcing envirosuits. Indeed I had assumed this was entirely intentional, the toxicity being the reason why the type never has native life (without forcing it, which arguably shouldn't be option for Limos per definition, since with life it would be Medusa or Siwa instead). A breathable Limos might be the bugged one?

< Message edited by Antediluvian_Monster -- 8/8/2020 8:09:02 PM >

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Post #: 16
RE: World generation question - 8/10/2020 10:03:52 PM   
zgrssd

 

Posts: 3385
Joined: 6/9/2020
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gmsitton

Yes, a Siwa world around 1g (more likely to have an atmosphere). Just re-roll until you get mostly N2 with 20%ish O2. Also, the world needs to be old enough to have developed a biosphere, so maybe 3b years plus; not too sure what is the lower bound for the age in order to get a biosphere.


You do not need age, as long as the planet can support earth plant life. If it can, they will bring those in during Colonisation Phase.
All that needs is enough CO2 and some rainfall. CO2 is converted almost 1:1 into O2, with only trace amounts left.

I once had a off case, where Earth Plants out-competed the limited Land Life (bacterial mostly). But the oceans stayed full of alien life.

(in reply to gmsitton)
Post #: 17
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