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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx Please

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Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx Please - 12/30/2020 10:24:38 PM

joliverlay

Posts: 635
Joined: 1/28/2003
Status: offline

OK, I'm playing Japanese for the very first time PBM or otherwise. Long time Allied player.
We are going to do DeBabes 28C extended map, PDU on, realistic R&D with historical first turn. So nothing gamey and no warp moves. So my first question is what the heck do I do for research and ship building. I'm much better on defense than offense, so I will plan for a long war.

My strategic plan is to faint into India and Alaska and make my main thrust into the south pacific. I will probably do some raiding and may try to take Diego Garcia. I also plan to use some of my submarines to interdict shipping lanes. I want to force him to use escorts everywhere. The Jap subs are great killers of warships, but if you use them that way, the allied kill them off pretty much by the end of 1943. Any thoughts please.

Post #: 1

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/30/2020 10:38:47 PM

RangerJoe

Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline

For your R & D, check the air frames and the engines. Decide if you want to produce an engine for an air frame which you really don't need and plan on not using later, then skip the engine and the air frame. If you want to produce a later air frame in the series, then start the research on the early model, when the factory gets repaired, then in the upgrade sequence go to the first model that you want. Think Judy and Tony here.

Decide which air frames that you want, then produce those engines. If you have to research the air frame, then get the engine stockpile to 501+ if you want the research bonus but remember, each factory receiving the bonus uses one engine for each day that it does research. Get your research factories to size 30 then do not expand them because that is the most efficient size.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

(in reply to joliverlay)

Post #: 2

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/30/2020 10:52:16 PM

joliverlay

Posts: 635
Joined: 1/28/2003
Status: offline

Thanks RangerJoe.

The first turn did not go to well. Lots if hits on BBs in Pearl, but none reported sunk. More discouraging, no hits at all reported on POW and Repulse. I've never not lost them on turn 1 as Allied in a historical start.

I'm not going to stick around P.H., lost 68 planes on the first turn, going back to home waters for now. With British BBs intact, I'll be careful for now near Singapore.

(in reply to RangerJoe)

Post #: 3

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/30/2020 11:56:45 PM

moore4807

Posts: 1089
Joined: 6/2/2000
From: Punta Gorda FL
Status: offline

I've had the privilege and honor of having my butt kicked by John 3rd in the fastest loss ever recorded by Allies (I think...)

So here is what I took away as IJN/IJA lessons.

What I learned from him was priority ONE is to take and make secure your oil/fuel bases first (historical reason for war). Your bonus time in the beginning is vital to move on those spots.

Secondly, don't let your opponent have the time to make Singapore into a fortress, eject them and make it your fortress instead!

Third - This is the direct opposite of what you are intending, but early on go after the islands that Allies will make strong bases out of in Southern Pacific - make his AK/TK trips to Australia as long and expensive as possible using Betty's and Nells. Now I always take NZ bases using APD's, fast AP's, SNLF's and paratroopers, keeping the naval guards for outposts like Suva and Pago Pago. Holding just those two bases drives my opponent nuts. Also once engineers have built them up they make surprise Allied visits almost impossible while still hard to bypass/leapfrog.

There are a couple of real good Japanese production primers on these threads, Several are similar in scope - but you have a good start. Biggest problem is not tweaking the production TOO much as it throws the whole system out of kilter. Nakajima HA-35 is your frontline fighter (and later TB) engine early in the war, you do need to kick that up a notch... All I can think of at the moment. Good Luck and will be following this AAR

< Message edited by moore4807 -- 12/31/2020 12:25:47 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to joliverlay)

Post #: 4

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/31/2020 12:35:52 AM

PaxMondo

Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline

Playing the IJ well means planning out the economy to support the war plan that you have. The economy constrains the IJ unlike the allies whose economy is so large in comparison it isn't even modeled; the devs just gave them all the fuel/oil/resources that they want ... IJ on the other hand will always be tight with supply, and later in the war short on fuel/oil as well.

Thinking broadly .... there is a fixed number of devices/ships/aircraft that IJ can build. You get to control the ratio of those three, and good management will allow you to approximate the theoretical maximum. But the key takeaways are:
1. There are hard limits and they are a LOT lower than the allies in aggregate for the entire war.
2. Good, efficient management will result is less waste.

Example on point 1: you can out build the allies in aircraft in '42, but then in '44 you will be having to fight with those early models instead of late war models unless you get an AutoVic. So, don't overbuild early.

Example on Point 2: switching aircraft model that causes the factories to be damaged is always less efficient than sizing the factory correct for the war. However, less efficient might enable an offensive operation that nets you 1M fuel, fuel that you would never have otherwise, which represents potentially another 25,000 aircraft to be built ... so trade-offs are part of this.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to moore4807)

Post #: 5

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/31/2020 12:57:14 AM

RangerJoe

Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline

Here is an older but still excellent AAR to give you some help with the Japanese:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2959613&mpage=1&key=

Take Singakwang ASAP, bring into Indochina paratroopers from Formosa by air then paradrop them in while then either air transport aviation support in or Fast Transport it in. Move in Bettys/Nells and Singapore will be difficult to reinforce. With an Air HQ at Singakwang those Bettys/Nells can carry a torpedo from a level 2 airbase. Without the Air HQ and/or no torpedoes available at the base but the armament set to "Torpedo" on Naval Attack while flying at 1k feet, the bombers will attack with the full bomb load at low Naval altitude.

Then invade Palembang but also bring in AAA and Aviation support the same turn or have it waiting in the hex to unload to tear up enemy bombers attacking the oil production. Doing so fast is risky but it prevents a Fortress Palembang. Coverage by Nells/Bettys is important for this and they can hurt any enemy naval reaction force. A6M2 Zero CAP is important as well, but down low to catch the enemy torpedo bombers. Oscars will work as well.

Don't take oil production early unless you can protect it with AAA and fighters - even Nates if you have to.

Bomb or bombard any enemy base that has 4Es if you can do so without serious loss.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

(in reply to PaxMondo)

Post #: 6

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 12/31/2020 9:45:03 PM

joliverlay

Posts: 635
Joined: 1/28/2003
Status: offline

The most interesting results of December 7th given below. No major loss of enemy ships observed.

I've launched a multitude of small raids and assaults in motion, started mass movement of the merchant marine to home waters to begin organized convoys, have made minor changes to AC production (eliminated some research by changing to Frank, George, and Tojo models. Increased engine production. But otherwise did not change much. Follow on convoys to PI and Malaysia headed out.

Some concern regarding possible activities of British force Z since no hits reported. Expected to contest invasion forces enroute to Borneo, Bettys and Nells flying 100% naval with torpodeos, raids on singapore AF ceased until Force Z contained.

Stopped construction on 1945 + ships.

Did not speed anything up.

1. Air Raid Pearl Harbor: Lots if hits, no sinkings
2. Attack on force Z: Failed, no hits observed by attacking forces.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Dec 07, 41
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Midget Sub attack inside harbor of Pearl Harbor!!!

Japanese Ships
SSX Ha-14

Allied Ships
BB Tennessee
PC Taney

SSX Ha-14 eludes ASW attack from PC Taney
SSX Ha-14 eludes PC Taney by hugging bottom

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Midget Sub attack inside harbor of Pearl Harbor!!!

Japanese Ships
SSX Ha-18, hits 1, heavy damage

Allied Ships
BB West Virginia
PC Taney

PC Taney cannot reach attack position over SSX Ha-18
PC Taney loses contact with SSX Ha-18
PC Taney cannot reach attack position over SSX Ha-18

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submarine attack near Kota Bharu at 53,77

Japanese Ships
SS I-166

Allied Ships
xAKL Dai Tung, Shell hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

xAKL Dai Tung is sighted by SS I-166
SS I-166 attacking on the surface

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Pearl Harbor , at 180,107

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 94 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 31 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 68
B5N2 Kate x 144
D3A1 Val x 126

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 11 damaged
A6M2 Zero: 12 destroyed by flak
B5N2 Kate: 12 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 3 destroyed by flak
D3A1 Val: 17 damaged
D3A1 Val: 3 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
P-40B Warhawk: 47 damaged
P-40B Warhawk: 14 destroyed on ground
P-36A Mohawk: 20 damaged
P-36A Mohawk: 3 destroyed on ground
A-20A Havoc: 27 damaged
A-20A Havoc: 1 destroyed on ground
PBY-5 Catalina: 77 damaged
PBY-5 Catalina: 16 destroyed on ground
B-17D Fortress: 40 damaged
B-17D Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground
B-18A Bolo: 21 damaged
B-18A Bolo: 3 destroyed on ground
B-17E Fortress: 13 damaged
B-17E Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground
SBD-1 Dauntless: 23 damaged
SBD-1 Dauntless: 7 destroyed on ground
C-33: 1 damaged
C-33: 1 destroyed on ground
O-47A: 10 damaged
O-47A: 3 destroyed on ground
R3D-2: 2 damaged
F4F-3 Wildcat: 3 damaged
F4F-3 Wildcat: 1 destroyed on ground

Allied Ships
xAKL Manini
BB Tennessee, Bomb hits 8, Torpedo hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
BB Maryland, Bomb hits 7, Torpedo hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
BB Nevada, Bomb hits 10, Torpedo hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
BB California, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
CL Phoenix, Bomb hits 1, Torpedo hits 1
AV Tangier
BB Oklahoma, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
BB West Virginia, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
BB Pennsylvania, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
DM Pruitt
DM Ramsay
CA New Orleans, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
CM Oglala, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
BB Arizona, Bomb hits 9, Torpedo hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
SS Tautog, Bomb hits 1
DD Helm, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
CL Detroit, Torpedo hits 1
DD Mugford, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage
CL St. Louis, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1
CL Honolulu, Torpedo hits 1
AVP Avocet, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
CL Helena, Bomb hits 1
DD Allen, Bomb hits 1, on fire
CL Raleigh, Torpedo hits 1

Allied ground losses:
23 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Repair Shipyard hits 4
Airbase hits 47
Airbase supply hits 4
Runway hits 85

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Clark Field , at 79,76

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 21 NM, estimated altitude 25,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 25
G3M2 Nell x 27
G4M1 Betty x 27

Allied aircraft
P-40B Warhawk x 1

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
P-40B Warhawk: 1 destroyed
P-40B Warhawk: 1 destroyed on ground
O-47A: 1 destroyed on ground

Airbase hits 6
Runway hits 29

Aircraft Attacking:
27 x G4M1 Betty bombing from 23000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb
27 x G3M2 Nell bombing from 23000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
24th PG/HqS with P-40B Warhawk (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Mersing at 52,82

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 46 NM, estimated altitude 25,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 18 minutes

Japanese aircraft
G3M2 Nell x 9

Japanese aircraft losses
G3M2 Nell: 1 damaged
G3M2 Nell: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied Ships
BB Prince of Wales
BC Repulse

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x G3M2 Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Mersing at 52,82

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 49 NM, estimated altitude 28,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 19 minutes

Japanese aircraft
G3M2 Nell x 7

Allied aircraft
Buffalo I x 2

Japanese aircraft losses
G3M2 Nell: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged

No Allied losses

Allied Ships
BC Repulse
BB Prince of Wales

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x G3M2 Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

CAP engaged:
No.488 Sqn RAF with Buffalo I (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(2 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Mersing at 52,82

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 38 NM, estimated altitude 26,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
G4M1 Betty x 13

Allied aircraft
Buffalo I x 8

Japanese aircraft losses
G4M1 Betty: 6 destroyed, 2 damaged

No Allied losses

Allied Ships
BC Repulse

Aircraft Attacking:
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

CAP engaged:
No.243 Sqn RAF with Buffalo I (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(2 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead
No.453 Sqn RAF with Buffalo I (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(2 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead
No.488 Sqn RAF with Buffalo I (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(3 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 10000 and 18000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 26 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Clark Field , at 79,76

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 29 NM, estimated altitude 25,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 19
G3M2 Nell x 9

Allied aircraft
P-26A x 4

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
P-26A: 1 destroyed

Airbase hits 7
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 9

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x G3M2 Nell bombing from 23000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
6th PS PAAC with P-26A (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(4 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead

(in reply to RangerJoe)

Post #: 7

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 1/1/2021 7:42:35 PM

Q-Ball

Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline

I would accelerate TAIHO and most of the UNRYUS. You can do this without expanding NAVSY, you just have to change your priorities.

I would NOT accelerate SHOHO, RYUHO, or the 2 JUNYOs, unless you suffer losses in 1942; you will have superiority anyway without those units. Build normally.

You will run short of NAV POINTS for a period if you accelerate CVs; temporarily halt construction on YAMATO to free some points. But plan on it coming in with MUSASHI in late 1942. I much prefer to fight those ships in a pair.

You can also delay submarine builds to free up NAV points for CVs; they are expensive builds for what you get out of them, and you should HALT/STOP all the RO-boats and SSTs anyway

_____________________________

(in reply to joliverlay)

Post #: 8

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 1/2/2021 9:18:53 AM

castor troy

Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

I would accelerate TAIHO and most of the UNRYUS. You can do this without expanding NAVSY, you just have to change your priorities.

I would NOT accelerate SHOHO, RYUHO, or the 2 JUNYOs, unless you suffer losses in 1942; you will have superiority anyway without those units. Build normally.

You will run short of NAV POINTS for a period if you accelerate CVs; temporarily halt construction on YAMATO to free some points. But plan on it coming in with MUSASHI in late 1942. I much prefer to fight those ships in a pair.

You can also delay submarine builds to free up NAV points for CVs; they are expensive builds for what you get out of them, and you should HALT/STOP all the RO-boats and SSTs anyway

Q-Ball is spot on here. Have done it pretty much like this but have accelerated all my CV/CVL/CVE except Shinano, which I have stopped on turn one. Have also been building Musashi (stopped her for the first couple of months though). By stopping the RO-boats and all those crappy transport subs I was able to have built ALL IJN carriers by the beginning of 44 bringing my carrier based aircraft strenght up to around 1500.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 1/2/2021 9:19:16 AM >

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Post #: 9

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 1/2/2021 10:08:57 PM

soulsilver

Posts: 316
Joined: 3/25/2020
Status: offline

Dont forget to also ship a healthy amount of resources back to the home islands along with the oil! I underestimated how much resources I needed and payed the price.

(in reply to castor troy)

Post #: 10

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 1/2/2021 10:13:53 PM

RangerJoe

Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline

Build up Fusan and ship resources from there to the Home Islands. This maybe the only place to increase the Light Industry to get more resources to go there. You can also "seed" it with some oil so you can start hauling small amounts of oil from there to the Home Islands as well.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

(in reply to soulsilver)

Post #: 11

RE: Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx P... - 1/5/2021 9:54:21 AM

Bif1961

Posts: 2014
Joined: 6/26/2008
From: Phenix City, Alabama
Status: offline

You had a reported 47 torpedo hits, with FoW you will never know for sure, but that is a lot of torpedo hits, mainly on his BBs. You may not have sunk any outright but some may still sink. I have just started a new game with my long term PBEM partner, I am the Allies this time, and his attack on PH did far less than yours. The difference in this PH attack than in RL is BB Penn can be attacked and once sunk at PH the BB can not be refloated and repaired later. Even if you didn't sink any they are all heavily damaged and cannot repaired and upgraded at PH, the shipyard can't handle 8 heavily damaged BBs at the same time. So he will have some pierside, some with repairships and one or two in the shipyard, all slowing pumping out and repairing system damage to be able to make the long slow trip to west coast and in this case east coast shipyard fro repairs and upgrades. You have seriously delayed him using any of these 8 BBs in the next 12-24 months and they still run a severe risk of being torpedoed by your subs as he tries to make it to the repair yards in CONUS. Check the naval loss VPs and see if one or more of the heavily damaged BBs succumb to their wounds.You have achieved what Yamamoto did, the crippling of the American Pacific fleet so the BBs could not intervene for 6-12 months. He didn't get the carriers because they weren't there and in most games I have played there are HRs that follow not hunting the American carriers for a few days or until they make their presents known through recon or an attack on them or by them. Losing 68 planes from the KB and the veteran pilots would preclude a 2nd PH attack for most, so discretion is the better part of valor. To me the KB is always like a Samaria, unseen and strikes with lighting attacks, causing death and destruction then disappearing back into the vastness of the ocean, only to appear somewhere else and doing the same. Leaving the KB too long supporting an operation gives your Allied opponent the ability to marshal forces to either attack it or avoid it and attack where it ain't. Good luck and good wargaming.

(in reply to RangerJoe)

Post #: 12

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> Blitzimx Versus Joliverlay-Debabes C, No Blitzimx Please

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