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mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!!

 
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mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/21/2021 4:42:39 PM   
pontiouspilot


Posts: 1127
Joined: 7/27/2012
Status: offline 		I'm having a mid-war crisis. I'm Japan and really shouldn't be impatient but I'm getting bored with being 4 engined to death. I'm thinking of a Grand Banzaii while I can. Has anyone ever raided Pearl this late? Most of my CVs are intact. I'm scouting approaches now. As best I can tell most of the big US fleet CVs return to Pearl after each attack or foray into Marshalls. I have Suva, Loganville, and New Caledonia so he doesn't have any real good forward ports. I know when I play Allies I really don't leave many fighters in Pearl after mid-43. What do others have in Pearl late game??

My opponent has had a number of fleet CVs torpedoed but his luck has been good and I know none went down. He has lost at least half of his CVEs and likely only has a 6-7 BBs not sunk.

Any other boredom fighting ideas? I own China and see it as too late to fart around in India. The Allies are slowly but inexorably nibbling all the edges in New Guinea, Timor, Tarawa, Ocean, Tulagi, Buin etc
Post #: 1
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/21/2021 5:45:27 PM   
mind_messing

 

Posts: 3393
Joined: 10/28/2013
Status: offline 		This is what I would term a "bad idea".

quote:

I'm thinking of a Grand Banzaii while I can.


I get that, but you can do it stupid, or you can do it smart.

Unless there's Allied amphibs to set the IJN lose on, keep your powder dry.

quote:

As best I can tell most of the big US fleet CVs return to Pearl after each attack or foray into Marshalls.


So this seems a better option for an ambush than trying for Dec 7th v2.0.

Leverage search assets to get early eyes on for the next raid, pre-position the KB out of Allied search range, and have surface forces to hand to intercept. Lean on land-based air to attrition Allied carrier fighters, then send KB into the mix.

Much better chance for, you know, a good outcome when you take it semi-seriously.

(in reply to pontiouspilot)
Post #: 2
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/21/2021 5:57:41 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline 		m-m is right, but if you insist on a fiery exit, PH is not the place. The fortress is formidable, and there is likely lots of AA there, along with Fleet subs. It can make a host of PTs too.

But after a certain point most Allied players consider a raid on the West Coast of the US a remote possibility and do not keep attention to patrols nor garrison all the bases well.

Portland is a great target for destroying hundreds of ships under construction. Seattle and LA are prime aircraft factory targets. But you are talking a big amphib landing, not just a KB raid which will be a flea bite.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to pontiouspilot)
Post #: 3
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/21/2021 5:58:34 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		If he is using his 4Es from a base that can be bombarded and possibly invaded . . .

Paratroopers do not need prep when dropped. But I wonder if they have perfected the HALO jump . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 4
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/21/2021 6:22:19 PM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Well, Large Slow Target did exactly that in our last PBEM - Hit PH hard with the KB Here's the link from my AAR from that memorable day:
PH Strike 7 Dec 44

From the Allied perspective, it did delay operations against the HI by a few weeks to chase down the KB, but it did remove the "Fleet in Being" threat once the KB was caught.

Still, was a very memorable event!

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 5
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 5:23:26 AM   
pontiouspilot


Posts: 1127
Joined: 7/27/2012
Status: offline 		To be worthwhile I would have to catch a large number of CVs there. To be successful there would have to be limited air cover. I'm betting he is all in with fighters at forward bases. I'd bet a good scotch he doesn't unload his fighters when in port.

This late who keeps many fighters in Pearl? Who keeps much AAA?

I have a CS skulking around Midway....we will see if he gets his bum sniffed.

(in reply to mind_messing)
Post #: 6
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 5:24:38 AM   
pontiouspilot


Posts: 1127
Joined: 7/27/2012
Status: offline 		I have caught several 4 eng bases so bad he won't get caught again.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 7
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 5:30:07 AM   
pontiouspilot


Posts: 1127
Joined: 7/27/2012
Status: offline 		I wondered about those west coast targets. Do you think the Japanese planes carry enough bomb load to really make any difference? I'm not going to haul any troops over there...they can die in their holes where they are. The westcoast is hard to egress from without being intercepted from Hawaii on the return leg.

(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 8
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 7:17:07 AM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

I wondered about those west coast targets. Do you think the Japanese planes carry enough bomb load to really make any difference? I'm not going to haul any troops over there...they can die in their holes where they are. The westcoast is hard to egress from without being intercepted from Hawaii on the return leg.

You were talking suicide mission, so I figured why not send the last of the IJA with the last of the IJN.

Seriously, the best end games I have seen were where the Japanese player played cat and mouse with the Allied Death Star, hitting allied shipping somewhere and then deking the response. You can still have some fun.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to pontiouspilot)
Post #: 9
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 8:17:56 AM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

What do others have in Pearl late game??


A lot.

Reading your post, I get the impression that your opponent hasn’t started his main CenPac thrust yet, so he probably has all his troops for the Marianas still in Pearl. So he might have a lot more AA, between the AA units and the base forces. Probably a bunch of squadrons too. It is especially true if, as you say, he doesn’t have any good forward port.
In a few turns, you might get an accurate view of his squadrons’ position across the whole theater. If you know the Allied OOB, it can give you the number of squadrons unaccounted for.

Many things may go wrong in your proposal :
- if he catches your CS sniffing around, he may get suspicious and up his defenses
- if he monitors SigInt daily, he may get a radio intercept in the middle of nowhere and get suspicious, and up his defenses
- if he has a trip wire of surface ships or submarines in the search gap between Midway and the Aleutians, you risk meeting them on the way in, if you stand down all your search planes, or alert him even more certainly if they get snooped by search planes, even Jakes
- if he’s using a CVE or two as watchers, with Avengers on NavSearch, he’ll certainly be alerted
- if he’s transferring his CV squadrons to PH to speed up the maintenance, you’re facing a formidable air threat if you’re not attacking precisely on the day they transfer

So, it’s a gamble. You’re the best placed to know your opponent’s style of play : if you believe he’s a bit lazy and prone to miss informations in SigInt or not have trip wires in place, well, go for it. The best outcome could be devastating, with several US CVs heavily damaged. But if you have the slightest suspicion that he got a hunch something is brewing there, get the hell out of dodge !

(in reply to pontiouspilot)
Post #: 10
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 11:23:28 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		The best thing to do might be to try and catch the CVs returning from an operation when the air crews may be fatigued, airplanes lost and/or damaged, low on sorties, et cetera. So if you can reduce his fighter complement first, that would help.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to Ambassador)
Post #: 11
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 1:25:14 PM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline 		I agree with RangerJoe. If his forays are somewhat similar, they become predictable. It’s a middle road compared to your original intent, but fewer risks of seeing the whole operation go south.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 12
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 1:37:53 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ambassador


quote:

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

What do others have in Pearl late game??


A lot.

Reading your post, I get the impression that your opponent hasn’t started his main CenPac thrust yet, so he probably has all his troops for the Marianas still in Pearl. So he might have a lot more AA, between the AA units and the base forces. Probably a bunch of squadrons too. It is especially true if, as you say, he doesn’t have any good forward port.
In a few turns, you might get an accurate view of his squadrons’ position across the whole theater. If you know the Allied OOB, it can give you the number of squadrons unaccounted for.

Many things may go wrong in your proposal :
- if he catches your CS sniffing around, he may get suspicious and up his defenses
- if he monitors SigInt daily, he may get a radio intercept in the middle of nowhere and get suspicious, and up his defenses
- if he has a trip wire of surface ships or submarines in the search gap between Midway and the Aleutians, you risk meeting them on the way in, if you stand down all your search planes, or alert him even more certainly if they get snooped by search planes, even Jakes
- if he’s using a CVE or two as watchers, with Avengers on NavSearch, he’ll certainly be alerted
- if he’s transferring his CV squadrons to PH to speed up the maintenance, you’re facing a formidable air threat if you’re not attacking precisely on the day they transfer

So, it’s a gamble. You’re the best placed to know your opponent’s style of play : if you believe he’s a bit lazy and prone to miss informations in SigInt or not have trip wires in place, well, go for it. The best outcome could be devastating, with several US CVs heavily damaged. But if you have the slightest suspicion that he got a hunch something is brewing there, get the hell out of dodge !


Ambassador,

A good general allows the other side's poor planning to be implemented without interference, and if possible assists in the implementation.

Alfred

(in reply to Ambassador)
Post #: 13
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 1/22/2021 1:50:47 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Not seeing the map, and if you want to have fun, have the KB circumnavigate Australia. Takes preplanning to get fuel for her, but you can raid harbors, create an anvil and hammer for fleeing Allied merchant ships, hit strategic victory points and even escape into the SRA should you still have it.

It will also throw havoc into the Allied planners for a bit.

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 14
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 2/3/2021 4:12:58 PM   
pontiouspilot


Posts: 1127
Joined: 7/27/2012
Status: offline 		For anyone still interested, my CS got to a point about 8 squares east of Layson Is. It picked up a level 3 detection and I retreated quickly north with no pursuers. This tells me that there is NO search at Midway and the searching at Pearl is not top grade. I assume my opponent missed the hit or assumed it a pesky sub. In the meantime the entire US fleet showed up in New Caledonia. This means that whatever is in Pearl it isn't the major units. This means that a Pearl strike is likely not suicidal at all....the question becomes whether it is worthwhile.

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 15
RE: mid '44 Japanese strategies...NO Herr Dirk pls!! - 2/5/2021 5:41:02 PM   
ITAKLinus

 

Posts: 630
Joined: 2/22/2018
From: Italy
Status: offline 		Too late or you haven't carried out yet your plans?



I think you can transform your KB in a striking force focused on port strikes. You can still carry out many funny raids where the allied forces are relatively light. Fuel can be an issue, but if you don't abuse the rest of the fleet (read: BB/CA/CL disbanded somewhere and not roaming randomly around), you should be able to have no problems in doing a good amount of these raids.


Pull the good pilots in reserve, provided you have élite pilots on your KB, and use average guys since losses are always horrendous.


Perth. Colombo. Fiji. Whatever. It's plenty of targets. You arrive in full speed and take advantage of the great range of your Judy-IV and A6M5 in port attack. Striking at 10 hexes with the 800Kg bombs is quite funny.
Again: losses in planes are horrendous and same for pilots if the base has a good FlaK (and they do all have at this point) and a very good CAP, but they are still manageable if the match is quite calm as I understand from your posts.



I did this many many times and had fun. Also, it's quite interesting to arrive to Sydney from the South coming from Perth if he doesn't have sufficient NavS assets in Tasmania (I honestly don't think he does at this point).
He should have to be very lucky to get precise intelligence of your movement. If you still hold some of the Lousiade you can recon Sydney with Emilies (don't remember now from which ones, I think Rossel Island and Tagula Island) to know what he keeps there.

If you are able to catch a major fuel convoy you can potentially hamper his operations in the SoPac for a while (big IF and also a big assumption regarding the potential consequence).



I've planned many times this particular raid on Sydney but I've never had the guts to risk it for various reasons: including and especially the remarkable need for KB to be used as a shield in the Kurilis, where my opponent wanted to make his Big-And-Only-Offensive.

_____________________________

Francesco

(in reply to pontiouspilot)
Post #: 16
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