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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East 2 >> Enhanced Theatre Boxes

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Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/7/2021 9:53:13 PM

Wild

Posts: 364
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline

Am I correct in my understanding that with enhanced theatre boxes turned on, you will have the flexibility to move any unit you wish from any theatre box to the eastern front or to any other theatre box?

Post #: 1

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/7/2021 11:22:30 PM

GloriousRuse

Posts: 906
Joined: 10/26/2013
Status: offline

Within a few limitations.

You can�t draw below a certain theater minimum requirement (~90% of the CV and air values) - France can�t be left empty to fund the east front for instance.

Axis allies have certain constraints based on their historical employment - you can�t, for instance, replace the Afrika Korps with all your Romanians.

Under-bidding a theater can cost you AP and VP, or speed up enemy progress in some theaters. This can spiral if you get caught out by sudden changes in theater requirements or combat intensity.

You need to be aware of second order effects. The strains you put on the war machine may not be evident until you realize that those that the panzer division you took from France used to be filled with captured French tanks, then after losses they had to switch to panzer IIIs and inadvertently put a call on two weeks of chassis production to make the change. Or you could simply end up losing more men and materiel in attrition costs than is really healthy for your war machine. Or all those aircraft you brought from the Far East all get shot down...and now you�re hard pressed everywhere.

(in reply to Wild)

Post #: 2

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/8/2021 1:42:43 AM

Wild

Posts: 364
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GloriousRuse

Within a few limitations.

You can�t draw below a certain theater minimum requirement (~90% of the CV and air values) - France can�t be left empty to fund the east front for instance.

Axis allies have certain constraints based on their historical employment - you can�t, for instance, replace the Afrika Korps with all your Romanians.

Under-bidding a theater can cost you AP and VP, or speed up enemy progress in some theaters. This can spiral if you get caught out by sudden changes in theater requirements or combat intensity.

You need to be aware of second order effects. The strains you put on the war machine may not be evident until you realize that those that the panzer division you took from France used to be filled with captured French tanks, then after losses they had to switch to panzer IIIs and inadvertently put a call on two weeks of chassis production to make the change. Or you could simply end up losing more men and materiel in attrition costs than is really healthy for your war machine. Or all those aircraft you brought from the Far East all get shot down...and now you�re hard pressed everywhere.

Thanks for the reply.

So I could for example have all the SS Divisions on the eastern front at the same time so long as I have enough CV in the other theatre boxes?

(in reply to GloriousRuse)

Post #: 3

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/8/2021 1:43:49 AM

Wuffer

Posts: 402
Joined: 6/16/2011
Status: offline

Ah, so probably no chance to avoid 'Tunisgrad' in N-Africa.
Well, can't help myself, but all in all this looks very promising so far - even the map. Many things which I really didn't enjoy in the first iteration seemed to be optimized.

I think a lot of you had spend a lot of time, tears and sweat into this project. Good luck and good launch, I think I can't resist.

(in reply to GloriousRuse)

Post #: 4

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/8/2021 3:38:24 AM

GloriousRuse

Posts: 906
Joined: 10/26/2013
Status: offline

Yes, you could potentially pull all the SS east, though given their morale gives them a higher CV you wouldn�t be one for one trading them.

Regarding North Africa, campaign progress can actually go both directions. So overstrength axis forces have a chance to delay the WA�s African campaign. You can�t take Cairo or drastically alter the flow of the war, but the WA can speed up or slow down. This breaks down into two basic trends:

1) As the WA gain momentum in the early war it imposes higher and higher theater requirements on the Germans. So the sooner/later that happens the less/more time the Axis have to keep their forces maximized in the east. Since it takes a proper curb stomping to end the war in �41 most games are going to keep going long after Barbarossa - slipping off schedule might see less opportunity in �42, and after the worm turns a few months in �43 with different forces in the east might see quite a bit of difference in how it all plays out in the end.

2) By the late war this is directly affecting the WA drive across NWE into west Germany. There is a German victory check in December of �44 that requires the allies be held out of Germany AND the Soviets have not exceeded the German�s best score. More prosaically, when the WA get over the Rhine the end is nigh - German logistics and production really start collapsing. Obviously this happening sooner or later directly impacts the ability of the Germans to hold back the Red Army as it tries to end the war.

(in reply to Wuffer)

Post #: 5

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/8/2021 8:29:57 AM

loki100

Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GloriousRuse

...

2) By the late war this is directly affecting the WA drive across NWE into west Germany. There is a German victory check in December of �44 that requires the allies be held out of Germany AND the Soviets have not exceeded the German�s best score. More prosaically, when the WA get over the Rhine the end is nigh - German logistics and production really start collapsing. Obviously this happening sooner or later directly impacts the ability of the Germans to hold back the Red Army as it tries to end the war.

There is a key rule that kicks in for 1945 (its present all game but becomes relevant then). If the Axis can't connect 2 of their National Supply Sources then their entire production system falls apart. No supply, no replacements, no fuel = no army. Existing depots retain their freight as do units but of course that is going to be a finite stock.

3 of these are Soviet targets - Vienna, Prague and Berlin, the last one is Frankfurt.

Now lose Berlin and lose the game so we can ignore that one.

If a Soviet player commits to the south, then they should take Vienna and Prague (there are VP reasons for this too) but Frankfurt is realistically out of reach. So if the Western Allies are delayed, a strong German commitment to Berlin can push the game past the Soviet victory points, if the Western Allies are more advanced then an early catastrophic collapse is on the cards.

Now, many German players in MP will (I fear) remain fixated on the first summer and either 'win' in 1941 or end the game. But the game design is for the entire war, and in that context, undermining the other theatres can really come back to hit you.

_____________________________

(in reply to GloriousRuse)

Post #: 6

RE: Enhanced Theatre Boxes - 2/8/2021 9:32:02 AM

Sardaukar

Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline

Stalingrad to Berlin scenario is maybe to have option for those who fear that their opponent disappears if they cannot win in 1941.

StoB is very interesting from both sides.

_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von B�lov, 1870-