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Some suggestions for WITE 2

 
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Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 5:08:40 AM   
chuckfourth

 

Posts: 222
Joined: 10/26/2011
Status: offline 		Heres a summary of what I think would make WITE 2 playable. I've covered all this in detail in previous posts.

Get rid of the first winter surprise rule.

German capabilities were no different on week 1 than week 2. What actually was different on week 1 was that about a third of the Russian troops were caught in their barracks on day one.

So the German values should be left standard on week 1 (surprise rule removed) and the Russian attack and defence value decreased by about one third on turn one.

The unjustifyable surprise rule doesnt correspond to anything in reality. It a quick easy fix covering up that the German units are underrated and the Russian units are overrated, or that the game mechanism is faulty.

The Germans used the amount of supply required to fight forward. IF the Russian retreats supply requirements should drop significantly.
Up until mud arrives the Germans should be able to move supply 300 miles from railheads BEFORE distance penalties are applied.

German could and did live off the land. So...
Large supply bonuses need to be delivered to the Germans every time they capture a city.
For example best fodder for horses is fresh grass. USSR is full of grass Russian horses eat it to. Fodder should be removed from supply calculations until winter.

There needs to be a priority supply button added to each unit same as refit button. So the German player can choose where to send his supply rather than distributing it (wasting it) where it isnt needed.

Rail repair rates are way below what was acheived historically.

Appreciable partisan activity doesn't start until about 6 months into the operation. Restricted to forested areas, not cities.

German report series The soviet partisan movement 1941-1944 says this
Road from Minsk to Moscow qualifies as a US "superhighway"
USSR contains 2400 miles of ashphalt road. 64200 miles altogether.
USSR contains 60000 miles of railroad 16000 miles of this is doubletracked. 15% was heavy capacity. On page 6 of this book are the details as to where this quality line ran.
This book also contains maps which dont correspond to what the game has. Especially it has large dense wooded areas in front of Moscaw and around Bryansk and Polotsk these don't appear on your map.

Artillery allocation for attacks is not random/haphazard it is always there as planned.

Some of these issues may have been fixed already, I havn't bothered with this game since my last post in the forum. Personnally because of the Supply nerfing I feel I bought a $80 lemon (WITE 1).

< Message edited by loki100 -- 3/11/2021 7:02:57 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 7:04:06 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Have you read any of the material published about WiTE2?

I have edited your post to remove the unnecessary comments at the end but it seems more about WiTE1 than 2?

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(in reply to chuckfourth)
Post #: 2
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 12:04:19 PM   
kahta

 

Posts: 287
Joined: 9/21/2019
From: Arkansas
Status: offline 		I would suggest reading about the game. It seems as though many of your concerns are addressed in the parts of the manual that have been released and other posts about the game.

(in reply to loki100)
Post #: 3
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 6:43:31 PM   
TheFerret

 

Posts: 64
Joined: 3/9/2021
Status: offline 		I gotta say, calling a game unplayable in part because it doesn't adequately model seasonal variations in fodder availability gave me a good chuckle.

(in reply to kahta)
Post #: 4
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 6:58:16 PM   
Ynglaur_slith

 

Posts: 12
Joined: 2/27/2021
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheFerret

I gotta say, calling a game unplayable in part because it doesn't adequately model seasonal variations in fodder availability gave me a good chuckle.


Literally unplayable.

(in reply to TheFerret)
Post #: 5
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/11/2021 7:32:50 PM   
ranknfile

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 2/9/2021
From: New Orleans
Status: offline 		No game is perfect. But I've seen a definite increase in the realism of wargames since hex-based games first made the jump from board games to computers.
This game has captured my interest as nothing has which preceded it (I have WitE; WitW; many of John Tiller's titles; all the DC games; and many, many other wargames).

I think younger players don't realize how good they have it with what's available today; despite it not being a perfect reflection of reality (that said, seasonal variations in fodder availability is not unrealistic, although perhaps more appropriate to pre-industrial age simulations).

As with any computer wargame, I will judge it (since I almost always play SP) by its AI. I have bought some excellent games, that - while outstanding as a MP game - are a great disappointment as SP games. I certainly hope this one won't be one of those. I suspect it will not be (while fully admitting that there is no AI as challenging as a human opponent).

< Message edited by ranknfile -- 3/11/2021 7:33:40 PM >

(in reply to Ynglaur_slith)
Post #: 6
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/14/2021 4:44:48 AM   
chuckfourth

 

Posts: 222
Joined: 10/26/2011
Status: offline 		Hi Loki
Thank you for your reply.
I have not read a jot about WITE 2 unfortunately ...

So my questions are
Does WITE 2 retain the first move German surprise rule? As I explained already this appears to be a quick fix to hide fundamental issues of balance within the game.
and
Can the German player select which units to send his initial supply allocation to rather than having to distribute it evenly amongst all his units? (like the refit button)
and
Do the Germans get a decent supply bonus for capturing something like minsk?

I would dearly like to play the game but if WITE 2 retains enough of WITE 1 to make it a viable option for the Russians to just withdraw from turn 1 instead of Having to fight hard, then that isnt a playable game for me. In reality a withdrawal like that would have meant the end of Soviet Russia before winter.

... Bare minimum change would be an option/preference that actually had an effect on german supply.

< Message edited by loki100 -- 3/14/2021 10:21:09 AM >

(in reply to ranknfile)
Post #: 7
RE: Some suggestions for WITE 2 - 3/14/2021 10:19:58 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		all your questions are answered in the three AARs we have posted and the various show cases.

I've edited your post (again) to remove your issues with WiTE1 as irrelevant to this forum

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(in reply to chuckfourth)
Post #: 8
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