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PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 3:42:51 PM

geofflambert

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I've been noticing that the upgrade options on some squadrons seems to be contracting. Here's a case where a squadron was divided into three and the upgrade options for the three have completely diverged. How is that even possible and is there anything I can do about it?

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< Message edited by geofflambert -- 6/11/2021 4:16:53 PM >

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 4:19:37 PM

mind_messing

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The B fragment is a level bomber, so has access to the level bombing upgrade options.

A and C are still dive bombers, so have the dive bomber upgrade options + the set upgrade path.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 4:22:00 PM

geofflambert

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

The B fragment is a level bomber, so has access to the level bombing upgrade options.

A and C are still dive bombers, so have the dive bomber upgrade options + the set upgrade path.

The B fragment was once Lilys like the other two. I want the other two to switch to Peggy(T). They must've been able to do that once. What changed and why? And A and C don't even match each other.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 5:13:39 PM

Ian R

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TLDR: Back grade A & C to Lilly 2band Lilly 2a respectively - note upgrade which has the plus sign on the A division screen.

The options for your B division, including to the Peggy T, seems to include entries for the cross role types - the dive bombers and light bombers such as Sonias and Anns. Did you pay any cross-type political points anywhere along the way? Maybe you need to get them all into the same airframe, recombine and maybe go to a Helen model or something, and then see if peggy Ia-T then becomes available.

I'm not sure what scenario you are playing, so haven't poked around to look at model specific, and group specific specialty, upgrades; it is however difficult to see why division B has a different upgrade list than the others, EXCEPT that there is a (+) on the A division's Ki-48-IIb Lilly which usually means that was it's historical next transition model. It's as if the failure to actually progress through the (+) model upgrade in division A might have given you a self-BOHICA on the role-crossing model.

< Message edited by Ian R -- 6/11/2021 5:32:37 PM >

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 5:28:10 PM

Ian R

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I just had a little look in the stock scenario database.

The stock scenario progression is

Ki-48 1b level bomber -> Ki 48 2a level bomber -> Ki 48 2b dive bomber-> Ki 48 2c dive bomber -> Ki-119 fighter bomber.

I think you need to back grade to Ki-48 2a to get the level bomber options, including Peggy 1a T, back on the list. After that, you should have the full buffet, as with your B division.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 5:37:29 PM

geofflambert

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Well, since the A fragment won't go back to IIa that's not an option, but even if it was I'd be reluctant to lose the Peggy(T)s I already have in the process. That option might not reappear. The Lily is fine for ASW and attacking xAKs but is otherwise not a very good model. This is a stock game.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 5:51:55 PM

Ian R

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Ki-48 2b DB is the progressive step from the 2a LB; it looks like you flicked straight from 2a to 2c (the plus sign) which is why I am suggesting you put division A back in the 2b and see what happens.

What happens if you put the C division into Ki-67 1b Peggies? The default upgrade in the data file for those is the Ki-67-Ia (T) Peggy.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 6:15:47 PM

geofflambert

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ian R

Ki-48 2b DB is the progressive step from the 2a LB; it looks like you flicked straight from 2a to 2c (the plus sign) which is why I am suggesting you put division A back in the 2b and see what happens.

What happens if you put the C division into Ki-67 1b Peggies? The default upgrade in the data file for those is the Ki-67-Ia (T) Peggy.

I didn't build any of those and don't plan to so it's not actually an option.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 6:22:50 PM

geofflambert

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Here's what happens. I'll report back next turn if the options change, or don't.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 7:28:29 PM

Ian R

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Looking at the actual airgroup upgrade path in the editor in slot #1021, it starts with Ki-30 Ann LBs, then moves through Lilly 1b, 2a, 2b, and 2c and on to the Peggy 1b. The K-30 aircraft type has an upgrade path through the Sally's and eventually to a later Helen model (and Ki-119 later on), but 16th Sentai goes its own way. The PDU on gives the options for Peggy T, and the Ki-119 fighter bomber further down the track.

I think that at least explains why you are getting so many options, and different role airframes, on the B/group. The key may be to find which aircraft model triggers the options to divert paths to a different type. The answer may be that as far as the A group goes, you are stuck until you run through it's complete listed upgrade path. It's a bit like working through all the size changes programmed for a ship borne capable air unit before you can freely change it to the size you want.

A working example of this is the AD-1 Skyraider in my mod. It is the terminal type in both of the separate USN TB, and DB, upgrade ladders. Once a group transitions to AD-1s in 1945/6 you can manually change it to any aircraft in either of those paths.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 8:30:06 PM

geofflambert

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Thanks for your attention. This is just one more of those things I'm going to have to get on top of before I start another campaign game. Ha!

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/11/2021 8:31:48 PM

geofflambert

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It also means one should not be frivolous about dividing up squadrons as you may not be able to put them back together again.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/12/2021 12:42:59 AM

rustysi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

It also means one should not be frivolous about dividing up squadrons as you may not be able to put them back together again.

I do it all the time and have no problem, but then I don't have the 'Upgrade' button set to 'on'. Means it'll only be upgraded manually.

I think that's your future solution.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/12/2021 2:21:08 AM

Ian R

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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

Thanks for your attention. This is just one more of those things I'm going to have to get on top of before I start another campaign game. Ha!

Well, look on the bright side - you got rid of the "(+)" sign next to Lilly IIb on the A/division upgrade list

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/12/2021 4:13:58 PM

geofflambert

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Just what I needed, less positivity.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/12/2021 10:06:06 PM

jdsrae

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quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I've been noticing that the upgrade options on some squadrons seems to be contracting. Here's a case where a squadron was divided into three and the upgrade options for the three have completely diverged. How is that even possible and is there anything I can do about it?

I've noticed this before in a few of my Rufe units where depending on what future aircraft is selected changes the others on the list.
If you select a different one, close the screen then come back, it sometimes changes the list.
If I have the Rufe selected it only shows A6M5c and Rex.
Then if I select the Zero, exit the screen and come back, it shows a lot more fighter options.

Try this in your A det:
- click the toggle to allow upgrade
- select the Peggy Ib instead of the LIly
- click the toggle to not allow ugprade
- exit screen
- come back and see if the list has changed to show all bomber types.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/12/2021 10:44:32 PM

RangerJoe

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Make sure that you have a saved game before you try any of this.

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RE: PDU ON upgrades - 6/13/2021 12:07:05 AM

geofflambert

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I always have save games. I went back a few days and did what you suggest and the result is ...

Yeay! I went to a whole different squadron just in case before coming back.