Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Well, with the port and the airfield numbers, if there were forts there should be balloons. A good reason to start building the fortifications in Japan early. I am sure that level 9 forts, while expensive, should prove costly to lower level attacks by 4Es.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Well, with the port and the airfield numbers, if there were forts there should be balloons. A good reason to start building the fortifications in Japan early. I am sure that level 9 forts, while expensive, should prove costly to lower level attacks by 4Es.

Balloons can be circumvented entirely by bombing from 7000 feet or higher. I choose 8000 feet because the Japanese 37mm machine cannon ceiling is 7500 feet and the 25mm machine cannon ceiling is 7000 feet. Japan does not have a huge amount of heavier AA guns to take on a major bomber wave.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

You used a lot of sorties to hit CRB. Do you have underway replenishment for sorties?

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

You used a lot of sorties to hit CRB. Do you have underway replenishment for sorties?

The carriers only hit a couple of convoys the first day which were nearish CRB. All the CRB work was done by B-24's hitting the port!

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

You used a lot of sorties to hit CRB. Do you have underway replenishment for sorties?

The carriers only hit a couple of convoys the first day which were nearish CRB. All the CRB work was done by B-24's hitting the port!

Duh! Of course I knew that yesterday but today ...

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
Japan does not have a huge amount of heavier AA guns to take on a major bomber wave.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
Japan does not have a huge amount of heavier AA guns to take on a major bomber wave.

That is not really true...it is just that JFBs tend to spread it around thinly. There is a huge upgrade around late spring to mid 1944...lots of AA guns get upgraded to 12cm plus lots of new units. Hirosaki and Yokohama get big upgrades to the static units too greatly increasing the heavy AA there, but generally you only add one gun a day so it takes some time.

Japan has to make hard choices about where the heavy AA will go! Not fun.

This AA upgrade and new units is relatively fixed, it is one of the reasons why an an AFB that is early to bombing range of Honshu can really reap great dividends thru strategic bombing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I imagine those >1,000 guns at Tokyo are all good ones.

quote:


000001 Sub attack 1944-10-07 45,70 Sabang

Sub attack near Sabang at 45,70

Japanese Ships
SS I-21, hits 10

Allied Ships
DD Rotherham
DD Queensborough

SS I-21 launches 2 torpedoes at DD Rotherham
DD Rotherham fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Rotherham fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Rotherham attacking submerged sub ....
DD Rotherham attacking submerged sub ....
DD Rotherham fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

quote:


000022 Ground combat 1944-10-07 62,67 Kratie

Ground combat at 62,67 (near Kratie)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 5322 troops, 88 guns, 49 vehicles, Assault Value = 126

Defending force 453 troops, 5 guns, 4 vehicles, Assault Value = 3

Allied adjusted assault: 62

Japanese adjusted defense: 1

Allied assault odds: 62 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), experience(-)
Attacker: leaders(+), leaders(-)

Japanese ground losses:
165 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 5 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 1

Allied ground losses:
8 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
22nd (East African) Brigade

Defending units:
87th JAAF AF Bn

quote:


000001 Night Naval bombardment 1944-10-08 Peleliu 90,98

Night Naval bombardment of Peleliu at 90,98

Allied Ships
CL Phoenix
DD Case
DD Cummings

Runway hits 4

CL Phoenix firing at Peleliu
DD Case firing at Peleliu
DD Cummings firing at Peleliu

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Interesting! I do also know there are way fewer of them left.

The bombers are still hitting them, so that plus starvation should wipe them out before too long.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I imagine those >1,000 guns at Tokyo are all good ones.

An interesting tactic, I think M-M might have pursued, was to simply focus all AA at the Japanese Big 3 industrial centers. It is definitely a gambit though.

quote:


000001 Sub attack 1944-10-09 89,60 Wenchow

Sub attack near Wenchow at 89,60

Japanese Ships
TK Itukusima Maru
TK Hoyo Maru
E Sagi

Allied Ships
SS Plaice

SS Plaice launches 4 torpedoes at TK Itukusima Maru
Plaice bottoming out ....
E Sagi fails to find sub, continues to search...
E Sagi fails to find sub, continues to search...
E Sagi fails to find sub, continues to search...
E Sagi fails to find sub, continues to search...
E Sagi fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub



000032 Sub attack 1944-10-09 93,58 Ningpo

Sub attack near Ningpo at 93,58

Japanese Ships
E No.132

Allied Ships
SS Sterlet

SS Sterlet launches 2 torpedoes at E No.132
Sterlet bottoming out ....
E No.132 fails to find sub, continues to search...
E No.132 fails to find sub, continues to search...
E No.132 fails to find sub, continues to search...
E No.132 fails to find sub, continues to search...
E No.132 fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

quote:


000002 ASW attack 1944-10-09 55,63 Bangkok

ASW attack near Bangkok at 55,63

Japanese Ships
PB Edo Maru

Allied Ships
SS Pargo

SS Pargo is sighted by escort
Pargo bottoming out ....
PB Edo Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Edo Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Edo Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Edo Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Edo Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub



000026 Afternoon Air attack 1944-10-09 56,67 Chanthaburi

Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Chanthaburi at 56,67

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 8 NM, estimated altitude 6,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Allied aircraft
Albacore I x 6

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
PB Edo Maru, Bomb hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Albacore I bombing from 2000 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring PB Edo Maru
Massive explosion on PB Edo Maru


000033 Ground combat 1944-10-09 Vinh 65,59

Ground combat at Vinh (65,59)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 56057 troops, 503 guns, 431 vehicles, Assault Value = 2431

Defending force 32174 troops, 326 guns, 485 vehicles, Assault Value = 1045

Allied adjusted assault: 1272

Japanese adjusted defense: 3437

Allied assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 3)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), fatigue(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1356 casualties reported
Squads: 5 destroyed, 107 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 9 disabled

Allied ground losses:
4026 casualties reported
Squads: 69 destroyed, 331 disabled
Non Combat: 5 destroyed, 34 disabled
Engineers: 13 destroyed, 77 disabled
Guns lost 53 (17 destroyed, 36 disabled)
Vehicles lost 49 (13 destroyed, 36 disabled)

Assaulting units:
20th Indian Division
36th British Division
Provisionl Tank Brigade
Lushai Brigade
3rd New Chinese Corps
24th Australian Brigade
96th Chinese Division

Defending units:
36th Division
1st Tank Division
14th Division
108th JAAF AF Bn

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I imagine those >1,000 guns at Tokyo are all good ones.

An interesting tactic, I think M-M might have pursued, was to simply focus all AA at the Japanese Big 3 industrial centers. It is definitely a gambit though.

Yes, I'll need to dig through my notes for exactly what went where, but the general theme was that you don't have enough to beat an Allied strategic bombing effort everywhere, so you need to stack the cards where you can in order to make it count.

It's less of a gabit if you plan it out, as overall you want to move away from the AE norm of "just in time" production, and instead adopt a strategy of "just in case".

Basically, things in the pools can't be bombed, so aim to over-produce VEH, Arm and shipyard points in the '41 to '44 period. Go nuts with aircraft and engine production for late war (emphasis on late war!) airframes, and let them chill out in the pools (again, where they can't be bombed).

What kills Japan late war is a lack of supply. Supply comes from LI and HI. Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto together account for something like half of Japanese supply production, with the rest being dispersed to a greater or lesser extent across the Home Islands.

To my mind you want to make these two cities as troublesome as possible to damage to keep your core supply production running as long as possible. There's the additional incentive that supply pools a great deal at Tokyo, so protecting the stockpile there is an important secondary goal.

That end, both bases are the final destination of most of the late war flak guns. Of particular emphasis are the IJA AA units that use the 12cm AA guns and IJN Base Force units that use the big DP guns.

The air component obviously needs to compliment this, but IJ industry strategy needs to be prepared for the late war or it will suffer as it did historically.

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Realizing that Armament Assembly is not what was recommended here, I went back just now and looked for Vehicle Assembly.

Yokohama/Yokosuka 41
Kobe 41

Those are the only ones I have recon of, but is that really all of them??

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Realizing that Armament Assembly is not what was recommended here, I went back just now and looked for Vehicle Assembly.

Yokohama/Yokosuka 41
Kobe 41

Those are the only ones I have recon of, but is that really all of them??

If you can, check Korea and Manchuria.

quote:


000002 Night Naval bombardment 1944-10-10 Peleliu 90,98

Night Naval bombardment of Peleliu at 90,98

Allied Ships
CL Phoenix
DD Case
DD Cummings

Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 4

CL Phoenix firing at Peleliu
DD Case firing at Peleliu
DD Cummings firing at Peleliu

quote:


000038 Ground combat 1944-10-10 Vinh 65,59

Ground combat at Vinh (65,59)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 22235 troops, 320 guns, 395 vehicles, Assault Value = 2029

Defending force 31222 troops, 326 guns, 485 vehicles, Assault Value = 942

Allied adjusted assault: 423

Japanese adjusted defense: 1803

Allied assault odds: 1 to 4 (fort level 3)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), preparation(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
404 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 28 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 7 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Vehicles lost 33 (5 destroyed, 28 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
1221 casualties reported
Squads: 103 destroyed, 65 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 4 destroyed, 12 disabled
Guns lost 32 (8 destroyed, 24 disabled)
Vehicles lost 41 (8 destroyed, 33 disabled)

Assaulting units:
Lushai Brigade
Provisionl Tank Brigade
3rd New Chinese Corps
24th Australian Brigade
36th British Division
20th Indian Division
96th Chinese Division

Defending units:
1st Tank Division
36th Division
14th Division
108th JAAF AF Bn


000039 Ground combat 1944-10-10 62,68 Kratie

Ground combat at 62,68 (near Kratie)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 5328 troops, 88 guns, 49 vehicles, Assault Value = 129

Defending force 393 troops, 4 guns, 3 vehicles, Assault Value = 2

Allied adjusted assault: 174

Japanese adjusted defense: 1

Allied assault odds: 174 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), morale(-), experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
417 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 36 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 3 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 4 (4 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (3 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units destroyed 1

Allied ground losses:
5 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
22nd (East African) Brigade

Defending units:
87th JAAF AF Bn

quote:


000001 Submarine attack 1944-10-10 88,61 Taihoku

Submarine attack near Taihoku at 88,61

Japanese Ships
xAK Eli Maru, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage

Allied Ships
SS Plaice

xAK Eli Maru is sighted by SS Plaice
SS Plaice launches 4 torpedoes

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I imagine those >1,000 guns at Tokyo are all good ones.

An interesting tactic, I think M-M might have pursued, was to simply focus all AA at the Japanese Big 3 industrial centers. It is definitely a gambit though.

Yes, I'll need to dig through my notes for exactly what went where, but the general theme was that you don't have enough to beat an Allied strategic bombing effort everywhere, so you need to stack the cards where you can in order to make it count.

It's less of a gabit if you plan it out, as overall you want to move away from the AE norm of "just in time" production, and instead adopt a strategy of "just in case".

Basically, things in the pools can't be bombed, so aim to over-produce VEH, Arm and shipyard points in the '41 to '44 period. Go nuts with aircraft and engine production for late war (emphasis on late war!) airframes, and let them chill out in the pools (again, where they can't be bombed).

What kills Japan late war is a lack of supply. Supply comes from LI and HI. Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto together account for something like half of Japanese supply production, with the rest being dispersed to a greater or lesser extent across the Home Islands.

To my mind you want to make these two cities as troublesome as possible to damage to keep your core supply production running as long as possible. There's the additional incentive that supply pools a great deal at Tokyo, so protecting the stockpile there is an important secondary goal.

That end, both bases are the final destination of most of the late war flak guns. Of particular emphasis are the IJA AA units that use the 12cm AA guns and IJN Base Force units that use the big DP guns.

The air component obviously needs to compliment this, but IJ industry strategy needs to be prepared for the late war or it will suffer as it did historically.

I thought VEH only got produced on demand? That was the point of Lowpe's suggestion to target those factories.

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Now I am noticing a couple of things called "Armament Factory" instead of "Armament Assembly". I see one Armament Factory in Korea and one in Nagasaki.

What are those?

quote:

• B-29 Target tomorrow, at night: Yokohama/Yokosuka Vehicle Assembly factory at 8,000 ft.